Discussion with Caleb Maupin

oh can you hear me

you're muted i can't hear you oh shoot

sorry sorry about that i'm really sorry

about this

technical difficulty stuff it's it's

been rough day

all good i've got plenty of unnamed diet

beverage right here

so yeah that's cool

um so what's up i think i just saw on

twitter you were uh you were talking

with like galloway in them

just now yeah went on george galloway's

show um

it's evening for them but it was

afternoon over here uh just a nice

afternoon chat about what's been going

on in u.s politics

i've seen you've been uh you've been

doing your usual thing and uh

btf owing uh some uh

to get into your twitch stream so there

you go right

yeah yeah i mean um

yeah it's pretty much

it's pretty much the fact that you know

the way i like to see it is that

if you look around now and see what are

people's main

barrier to entry to becoming or you know

being associated with

socialism and all this kind of stuff and

unfortunately right now the people

monopolizing that

are what is called um loosely bred tube

right

they're really defining what it means to

be a socialist right now in

america i think yeah

i mean it's shocking to me i mean the

communist and socialist movement has

been

cursed by um reformists and sellouts

you know for since its inception what

shocks me about these people is that

they've developed a model

that in no way challenges neoliberalism

um you know you watch these debates when

the reason foundation

and jacobin sit down and the reason

foundation repeats every

anti-communist lie and the jacobin

people get up and they say oh that's all

true

and and we totally agree we don't want

state socialism we just want to start a

worker cooperative with all our friends

and then

the libertarians go oh we have no

objection to that go start your work at

cooperative we don't care

and so they both just kind of embrace

each other on this agreement that the

state should

leave americans out to dry and that's

what's happening right now i mean

you know you look at texas where the

power grid collapsed

i mean you look at so many people

unemployed i mean

the state has an obligation to intervene

here um

and you know you go back through the

history of social democracy all the

reformists and sellouts understood that

you need you know they at least made

some demand but this idea that socialism

is just this voluntary worker

cooperative this has been around for

years right yeah collective capitalism

cooperative

capitalism employee stock ownership

programs

there's nothing revolutionary about this

right i mean in a socialist society

something like huawei that's got

you know worker ownership and and such

profit sharing might be a good idea but

the notion that we shouldn't be

be demanding a government that fights

for the working families and that we

should just

you know be sitting back and and you

know begging you know some foundation to

give us money to start a worker-owned

pencil factory

i mean it's really disturbing i mean

they've taken everything revolutionary

out of marxism

um and they've just turned it into a a

way that they can kind of celebrate

their liberalism

and keep fighting the culture wars and

that seems to be what they're really

concerned about is these culture wars

you know

um people can be left out starving and

hungry and you know the country can be

falling apart

uh but my my goodness don't say anything

that might be slightly

possibly perceived as transphobic you

know don't don't dare shake hands with

anyone who voted for donald trump

because that's what they're really

concerned about

they're waging this culture war you know

that you better be on the right side of

who cares if americans are suffering and

starving who cares if they launch a new

war against

china or against you know against the

iranians or

i mean it's it's ridiculous it's really

ridiculous i'm shocked at how

how horrifyingly liberal these people

are

yeah i mean um it's very bizarre because

the what it what appears to me

to be the situation with the so-called

american left

is that when it comes to the narratives

about history that you were talking

about

and when it comes to this you know this

culture war

nonsense where now don't get me wrong i

would like to take a you know the

progressive position i guess

when it comes to the culture war you

know i'm not myself a transphobic person

i don't think you are either

um but this idea that it's on the basis

of these

cultural differences that you're going

to completely declare

people you know enemies and drop

um points of distinction like

that you would like how should i say

that they would use in war like an enemy

combatant or something

is absurd but what i think this all goes

down to

the common thread that unites all of

this

is the embedded and entrenched

institutional power

of the democrats the deep states the

people funding all of these think tanks

and foundations

and universities pushing propaganda and

lies

about the history of um

about the history of the 20th century

and the present

and you can now very clearly see that

the so-called american left presupposes

this

as its foundation it's its point it's

it's um

point of departure and all it's doing is

creating this kind of

ornamentation supplementing it

but they're not actually fundamentally

challenging

these premises and i think what is so

imperative for anyone

calling themselves a socialist even if

they hold you know

reformist views if you're going to call

yourself a socialist it is imperative

that you

target these fundamental premises that

these synthetic leftists actually take

for granted

bolster and ascribe ornamentation to

yeah well i mean it's it's was pretty

big in my development

you know to to realize that you know

every day in the united states whenever

the topic of communism comes up we are

told well it failed everywhere it's ever

been tried

it just doesn't work i mean it's a good

idea but it just doesn't work look the

soviet union fell

clearly it just failed i mean it just

never worked anywhere

and that's so obviously false i mean

it's it's

you don't have to have a degree in

economics you don't have to be like a

historian to know it's false okay

look at russia before the communists

came in look at russia now

look at china before the communists came

in look at china now

look at cuba before the communists came

in look at cuba now i mean it's like

duh i mean it's so obvious who were the

first people in outer space

who defeated hitler uh you know i mean i

mean who who have the biggest power

plants

in the world and who you know who are

who are the biggest telecommunications

manufacturers in the world

800 million people in china lifted out

of poverty

um you know i mean i mean goodness

gracious i mean how do these people

how do these people believe this right

but it's just something you're told

over and over again in the united states

communism failed everywhere it's just

never accomplished anything it just

never got anything done

and they just drum this into your head

it's actually it's the big lie

you know in hitler's uh mind conf he

talks about how like

people if you tell a little lie people

will question you but if you tell a

big lie a lie that is so huge

right and that people and you just

repeat it everywhere people just can't

fathom

that it wouldn't be true and this this

lie about communism never achieved

anything i mean

it's just completely unworkable that's

such a lie it is such a lie

um and and once you take that apart

everything falls down like a house of

cards but this lie is so

central to what they believe and that's

why i'm a tanki that's why i will not

disavow being a tanki that's why i'm

proud to be a tanki because

i think you have to be a tanki if you're

going to believe in socialism in the

united states you have to be a tanker

you have to go up against this

it comes up in every debate you know

that bernie sanders is on there i think

that we should raise

the minimum wage to 15 an hour

because we need to do that and then the

the person interviewing him well what

about stalin i mean stalin tried to

you know raises people's wages and

millions of people died and they all

starved and it was miserable oh we can't

do that why was stalin and mao and pol

pot and

you know and and i mean it's just like

if you can't go up against this basic

narrative the myth of the 20th century

you can't go up against that you really

have nothing to stand on all economic

discourse in the united states centers

around this big lie

and if we can't combat this big lie uh

we got nothing so i i'm a tanki i'm a

tanki till the end

you know and and that's the fact look if

you want to talk about a system that's

failed everywhere it's ever been tried

try neo-liberalism

right the the idea that we should just

cut government spending right we can cut

our way into economic growth right

there's this magical thinking that if

you just you cut the jobs of government

workers you lower you know subsidies you

you cut off social programs for

low-income people magically the economy

just starts to do better because taxes

go down or something

well they look at the soviet union after

the fall of the soviet union

they tried that and it completely

destroyed the place they tried that in

chile under pinochet

and it completely destroyed the place

they tried that in bolivia they tried

that in venezuela like every south

american country tried that in the 90s

it destroyed the place

and we've been doing that here in the

united states for decades and the

country is falling apart not

surprisingly so

you know you want to talk about an idea

that's failed everywhere it's ever been

tried

it's funny because i say that you know

everything they say about us

is actually true about libertarians

right you know libertarians you say to

them hey you know

chile was destroyed by your policies uh

you know people have been you know we've

had capitalism for hundreds of years we

haven't ever produced this free market

utopia they want

what do they say oh this was real

capitalism right it was real capitalism

right and and then you know and then you

say to them oh you know pinochet and how

many people

30 unemployment children starving they

don't care how many people have to die

in order to carry out their ideological

project profit

must rule greed is good and they really

do not care about the

pile of dead bodies that their system

has produced

everywhere neoliberal free market

economic reforms are implemented

the country falls apart it's wrecked

this happened with the british empire

back in the 1800s they did it in india

they did it in china

they did it in country after country

after country um

you know and it happened once again in

our time when this adam smith

psychopathy

that they call economic teaching uh you

know became introduced around the world

and it's horrifying to me because if

you're against capitalism this is what

you're against right you're against this

notion that we should

we should leave the basic important

things people depend on like jobs and

healthcare and education

to the magic of some invisible hand you

know i mean that's complete i mean

that's completely what you should be

opposed and the fact these bread tubers

you know they don't even have the

courage to stand up to that it's like oh

we agree with that we just want to make

a worker cooper it's like it's like

give me a break give me a break the

emperor has no clothes

he's walking around naked and it takes

you know you and me and

and the rest of you know the tankies of

this world to stand up and say it the

emperor has no clothes

he's walking around naked he looks like

a fool the cut the world is on fire

and there's an obvious solution which is

you know reviving

statecraft the notion that the

government has a duty to serve the

people

right um you know i mean this is this is

pretty basic right the notion that

that the government shouldn't just set

back and let the country fall to

shambles but we should instead have a

government that fights

for working families build up the

country make people smarter don't make

people stupider

right make people more industrious you

know unleash people's creativity and

talents

how many people are sitting at home

right watching this now are full of so

much potential

right they're ready to go out and work

uh you know they they

they've got a degree maybe they got

student debt they got so much they could

go out and do but because some

capitalists can't make money from hiring

them they're stuck

you know and they're stuck you know

living a life where they you know

they're stuck in low-wage jobs they feel

useless their family's on their ass

saying hey

you know when are you going to get to

get your life together i mean it's a

tragedy

right it's a tragedy what this system

has done many young people are angry

about it

and it seems like there's this big

effort now to make sure that the only

people that that

are able to capture that anger are the

alt-right and white supremacist that's

basically what red tube is trying to do

they're trying to say that if you talk

about economic suffering

you must be a nazi right that's class

reductionism right that's what they're

trying to do they're giving a huge gift

right you know it's like there's

millions of young people that are angry

about economic issues

and bread tube is saying you know what

oh you know you know richard spencer and

neo-nazis you can have them you can have

them right and we're going to

castigate and shame anyone in our

movement

who tries to actually address these

issues um and we're just going to hand

all those people to you here you go it's

a beautiful gift you know vosh

skippy the bear thought slime whatever

you want to call him right uh

what is this the surfer kid surfing usa

whatever that loser is

right these people are the best friend

actual white supremacist neo-nazis ever

had

by making working-class people that are

angry and want economic justice

uh basically feel like they don't belong

in in the socialist movement to make

socialism

part of a war on working-class people

not something mobilizing them to fight

for their rights that's a huge gift to

actual nazism and actual fascism no

question about it

right if i was richard spencer if i was

the the white nationalist and white

supremacist i would be paying these

clowns to be on there representing

socialism

i mean they are every caricature every

caricature the right makes about about

socialists and communists that's not

real socialism

oh you're an and you're a racist you

know people are racist

right obviously you know but if you just

call somebody a racist right if you just

say

you're racist you haven't accomplished

anything prove to them that they're a

racist show them how their position

is racist right show them how they're

wrong but if you just call somebody a

name

you've accomplished nothing right in the

real world you know if you just call

somebody an ist

or a phobe you haven't accomplished

anything you know i mean this this

cancel culture

it's juvenile it's childish it's

thought-stopping it's trying to prevent

people from really engaging

with the issues that you and i talk

about on our streams that's what's going

on i've had it up to here with bread

tube with jacob with all these phonies

right we need a government of action to

fight for working families

yeah you know um that was really you

know you took the words right out of

them

but uh uh you know one of the one of our

taglines of our kind of new brand

is marxism leninism in the age of

multi-polarity

and one of the things that i think is so

um important important about that is the

things you've mentioned about

the way in which the history of the 20th

century and even the contemporary

world is distorted um

by this establishment and these

institutions

well you'd a lot of people look at guys

like me and you and they say these are

these are etiologists right they're

ideologues but if you just go to russia

and you just go to china and talk to

random people on the street

they're going to tell you things and

they're going to express

beliefs without any ideological barrier

to entry whatsoever

that completely contradict like

you'll realize just how much we here in

america

have this ideological bubble imposed

upon us

whereas for other people they live and

breathe like it's nothing without having

to have any brainwashing whatsoever

basic self-evident um

basic normal they get on with their

lives normally without having to care

about any of this kind of

myth making so it's quite staggering you

know you don't have to be this kind of

ideologue who just fanatically believes

in marxism leninism like um

you know as some kind of evangelist or

some kind of you know

psychotic the element of multi-polarity

to us is basically just

humbling oneself as an american just to

learn from other people's perspectives

and just doing that alone

will give marxism leninism and openness

and a richness

that can that's easily contrasted to the

type of larping and

kind of cultural nonsense that is kind

of typical

to a lot of people identifying with it

here in the states

another thing i'm really glad you

mentioned is how

talking about being you know tankies or

whatever and defending the record

when it comes to lies and distortions

being put about the history of the

soviet union and china and elsewhere

has a decisive and practical

significance

even to the real existing progressive or

i don't know if the progressive cause is

dead

in america per se like i mean the one

that opposed obama for medicare for all

stuff but

something vaguely like that it has

decisive significance

um a lot of these bred to people who

were approached me by saying

well by calling yourself an ml

you're you know scaring people away and

i tell them

if they're willing to call joe biden a

communist

you have to own up to this history and

you have to give a counter narrative to

the one the establishment is giving

if you don't have a counter narrative

you're you're proving you're not you're

not able to build up

a counter force to their actual power

that prevents

us from having a 15 minimum wage and

medicare for all and things like that um

and you know this whole thing about the

neoliberal austerity politics

this synthetic left as you mentioned

with cancer culture

perfectly supplements this logic that

somehow as human beings there's too much

of us in the world we're doing

we're being in the world all a bit too

much and we have to kind of

limit ourselves with political

correctness and

we have to um we have to feel guilty

about the fact that we like hamburgers

and

we have to eat v you know it's all this

kind of um

it's kind of the same pathology and it's

a fundamental

deep rooted malthusianism i think

that the synthetic left is especially

is is reinforcing but i mean at the

level of government it's self-evident

that

the neoliberal establishments and

ideologists for decades and decades

despite all the

you know failures that that you're

talking about they were able to ignore

that just because of how ideologically

potent

this idea that you know we need to feel

guilty

about our humanity we have to

[Music]

where there's too much of us in the

world we have to cut cut back we have to

always feel guilty we can't

we can't have a sense of um the

realization of our latent potentials and

power and the unleashing of the forces

of production

so to speak i think this corresponds

if i were to sum it up to some type of

objective decline

of liberalism and to me

this decline of liberalism has led it to

some kind of

state of self-contradiction and

psychosis sure i mean there's a lot that

i can react to

i mean as for as far as like the mindset

here in the west you know

my whole life i've heard people say this

is the greatest country in the world

this is the greatest country in the

world this america is the greatest

country in the world

and if you so much as ask people you

know how did you come to this conclusion

are you saying we have the most money

are you

and they look at you like you must be

brainwashed you don't think america is

the greatest country in the world you

must be brainwashed

you know what i mean and you go around

like people in this country can't find

it

sorry sorry uh my application

is frozen oh

what is going on oh no man my fucking

screen just blanked out

uh hello hey hey i'm here

this stream might have a good thing i

recorded this conversation but

let me see neat's feet go live again oh

wait what happened

stream is working the stream is fine

okay then my

my obs has frozen uh it's completely

frozen

um i think this might be a problem with

microsoft edge

okay uh i'm so sorry about this man i

know

uh one

um moment just go okay okay yeah obs

has frozen completely but if it's still

working

we can okay yeah all right sorry about

that

um continue yeah

no it's just i mean we can't find our

country on a map i mean the education is

so

low here um and we're told that all

around the world these people that are

in

anti-imperialist countries they're all

just brainwashed you know they've all

just been brainwashed but it's like they

can find their country on a map

they understand the views that that

americans have

and they also understand the views of

their own government and they can

compare them whereas

here in the united states people have no

idea about about the

opposing viewpoints around the world so

i mean this this this brainwash hysteria

in the united states is quite ridiculous

i mean it's a huge amount of projection

uh that's what i would say about that

and that yeah i mean you know and when

you talk about the you know the need to

not be you know just kind of

you know overly ideological look there's

plenty that we need to learn i think the

cultural revolution in china was a

disaster

i think deng xiaoping's economic reforms

were absolutely necessary

i think that there are non-marxist

feminist forms of socialism in the world

like office arab socialism like

boldivarianism

um and that you know we don't need to

get bogged down in like the really

really nitpicky ideological debate to

the 20th century right

uh you know who is better enver hosia or

you know or

i mean i i don't get i'm kind of done

with that kind of stuff you know

um but but at the same time you know we

can learn the lessons right i mean

you know i tell people that you know i

mean if we want to make a better country

right if some other country was making a

good car we would look into it right if

somebody if some other country was

making a

uh you know a more efficient way of

developing energy we would look into it

so why wouldn't we look into a better

political and economic model

um you know and that we should study all

of it but blindly follow none of it and

try to figure out a model that can work

for this country and how we can get

ourselves out of the crisis over here

um and when you talk about malthusianism

you know

really what it gets down to is this

right it's you got to imagine a game

right a game of king of the mountain

where you know every every kid's trying

to get to the top of the hill

so one kid gets to the top of the hill

and he announces oh game over i'm at the

top of the hill

that's what malthusianism is right the

the western imperialists they control

the oil markets that's their main way of

dominating things is with the oil

markets right we have an oil-based

economic order

so they're at the top of the hill and

they've announced oh you know our fuel

source

oil that we happen to control is

polluting the world so you know what

human development has to end here

while we're at the top of the mountain

we'll stay at the top of the mountain

and we'll stay on oil we're going to

keep an oil-based economy but everyone

needs to stop developing because we're

at the top of the hill

and that's what's basically uh basically

been announced that's that's the

malthusian viewpoint right that there's

just oh you know human history

human history must stop because we're

we're ahead right we

put while you're ahead well we're ahead

we're at the top we're winning the game

so uh human history game over right and

what's particularly eerie about that is

that it's just kind of a

basic need of human beings to survive is

human beings

want to grow right human beings want to

expand

they want to have more than they had

before they want to work hard for

something they want to have a family

they want to have children

but when you introduce the malthusian

pessimism into the conversation and you

say well

we all have too much and we all need to

be poorer

you're basically with those words you're

basically

trying to kill people i mean that's what

depression is the mental illness of

depression

right when people cannot go forward they

lose their

will their drive to go out and do things

in the world

their body just kind of shuts down that

is that is depression that is what

drives people to become suicidal

and so when they announce you know every

day it's coming out of your cell phone

every day out of your cell phone out of

your computer the malthusian you know

there is no future

there's too many people in the world

human beings are a cancer

mother this stuff is it is actively

killing people it is

toxic it is poisonous and look the

nature of humanity human beings are tool

makers

we're creative creatures we have the

ability to march forward into advance

and

and because they're at the top they've

announced that we can't advance anymore

look

climate change is a reality i don't deny

climate change the answer to climate

change is

obviously getting off of fossil fuels we

need a higher fuel source we need

fusion energy i mean when vladimir putin

called for international cooperation

china russia and the united states to

come together to get fusion energy like

yesterday

that is what needs to be said we need

fusion energy we need to get off of the

trap of

of the oil markets and and natural gas

and all that we need to get into a

higher

higher mode of technology plus we need

to start you know

expanding into outer space look china's

already getting helium-3 from the moon

um you know we need to figure out how to

extract resources from

mars we need to figure out how to how to

not limit humanity to just this planet

right i mean we are

we need to start exploring stuff um you

know

before john f kennedy was killed kennedy

was bad in a lot of ways before he was

killed a lot of people don't know this

he called for there to be a

joint moon mission between the usa and

the soviet union you imagine that right

and he wanted the soviet union

and the united states to team up to go

to the moon not a space race but a space

cooperation

imagine if something like that could be

arranged today that's that's the kind of

thinking we need

right we need progressive thinking not

this game over

economic pessimism there is no future

stuff and

you know it's one thing in the first

world to say oh we've got too much i

don't agree with that i don't think we

have too much i think a lot of working

families around here are suffering but

to go to people in africa with a much

lower life expectancy

we've never had running water and never

had electricity and say oh you need to

stay poor

uh because of mother earth that is the

height of like you know you want to talk

about white privilege and

and and arrogance and i mean it is it is

pretty unbelievable you know you can't

hold back economic development you can't

human beings want more than they already

have they want to advance and we're not

in this to make people poor

i don't know where people got this

notion the memo was sent out communists

want everyone to be poor because

capitalism is people having a lot of

stuff and communists are against that

and they want to make everyone poor

that is not true at all right the goal

of socialism is to build a world with so

much prosperity

and abundance that we don't need a

government right you know that we can

eventually get to the to a level of

material abundance where

all inequality can be broken down the

need for the state can go away people

can just kind of do what they need and

take what they need and do what they

want to do and you know from each

according to his own ability to each

according to his needs

that is the ultimate vision of marxism

right it is it is

the height of progressivism human

progress

and the drive of human beings what got

us from you know being hunted gatherers

living in caves to

making iphones and space travel that is

behind marxism leninism

this is not a reactionary ideology it's

not a pessimistic ideology

it is about the human spirit and how

human beings can

conquer any challenge facing them it

believes that human beings can march

forward

and move ahead that is that has always

been what marxism is about what these

people are pushing this

destructive pessimistic cancel culture

stuff this is not marxism i'll tell you

that much now

in my book on kamala harris i talked

about the roots of it right and that

you know in a feudal society right uh

people are very controlled

and the bourgeoisie in order to bring

down feudalism they gave people

permission to unleash their

impulses their impulses toward anger

their impulses towards sexual

release right and that the french

revolution was an explosion of sex

and rage right the peasantry that had

been very controlled

were given permission to just you know

chop off people's heads and

and and celebrate but also permission to

unleash their sexual desires the marquad

was a big figure

in the french revolution um and that the

bourgeoisie in order to take power they

unleashed people's impulses right um and

you know marxism

came out of the aftermath of the

bourgeois revolutions the disappointment

right that

the bourgeois revolutions didn't create

a just society right

and so marxism kind of held with it that

that belief that

in order to in order to bring down the

old social order we need to unleash

impulses unleash people's rage etc

and that kind of the the psychology of

the bourgeois revolution kind of carried

over

but right now the capitalists they're

doing that right they're giving people

permission to unleash their rage they're

giving people

permission to unleash all their impulses

and be as angry as they want and be

destructive and all of that meanwhile if

you look at the strength of china

you look at the strength of countries

around the world that are building

socialism

it's not their ability to tell people to

unleash their impulses

that holds them together it is the

opposite it's they give people a sense

of community

a sense of purpose a sense of uh joint

effort and and almost that that feeling

that sigmund freud condemned that

feeling of religiousness and

oneness with the universe right and if

you look at what stalin did during his

five-year plans

you look at at what was achieved uh you

know in many countries what what gaddafi

did when he built the

the great man-made river you know the

biggest irrigation system in the world

right it's about giving people a sense

of community giving people

something to be part of not just giving

them permission to unleash their rage

and

their destructive impulses i got into

all of that in my book on kamala harris

because

it needs to be said i talk about that in

my my city builders and vandals and our

age

that we need to kind of rethink the the

psychology of what is it we're appealing

to

with marxism are we just giving people

permission to go out and break shit

or are we telling people that the

capitalists have broken the world

and we're gonna start rebuilding it

yeah i mean um i really like how you

mentioned uh the whole

um the game of uh first one up up the

hill

and i actually think that also applies

internally to the west as well

it's not a it's not an accident that the

people who are pushing this whole cancel

culture

you know fake wokeness and dumb

political correct stuff

these are the elites that made it to the

top

they are white people and they're

telling the rest of the white masses

you know oh you got you know you have to

feel bad and feel guilty

and um oh well that's quite convenient

because you already made it to the top

and you're kind of securing your

position against

the majority of the people in your own

country so it's not just

uh that they're that they're telling

other countries to do this which they

definitely are it's also

all connected you know and i think an

important thing

for us is to be able to show concretely

make those connections

between u.s imperialism and um

uh this internal rule of this oligarchy

these

this deep state and this

institutionalized

kind of professional managerial however

we would call them

elites

it's interesting you mentioned the whole

thing about the bourgeoisie as

unleashing

unleashing people's um

passions so to speak you know uh it's

interesting because

the utopian socialist like fourier

i don't know if i'm kind of lost fourier

i believe specifically

talked about socialism in this way is

this kind of way of

regulating these boundless and crazy

types of

you know urges and passions and emotions

in society and you can kind of see how

with the current american synthetic left

they're kind of going up that alley as

well where they're

the main aesthetic behind them is really

about

it's really about how to

um it's a it's a certain way of

expressing yourself uh not just

in terms of having definite concrete

political positions um

but this kind of cultural posturing and

just a way for people to

you know um

way to people to channel their kind of

urges and

i don't know like to what extent would

be appropriate to discuss this

but i don't know if you're familiar with

how on bread tube a lot of these content

creators the way in which they interact

with their own communities

um you know on discord and elsewhere

it's that we kind of

see a lot of predatory and um disturbing

behavior you know

so yeah well i mean i don't know i don't

know if you want to get into specifics

about that or not but i think it's it's

a symptom of

of this problem right um and that

you know if you look at you know and

i've talked about this it's like this

taboo in leftist circles you cannot talk

about the congress for cultural freedom

well i'm going to talk about the

congress for cultural freedom in the

1950s the cia

set up you know a foundation uh to

start funneling money to trotskyites and

phony leftists right they set up

partisan review magazine

and they started funding like leftist

thought

that was anti-soviet anti-communist um

but was also critical of the cold war

and mccarthyism and stuff

stuff like that and if you read one of

the intellectuals that they talk about

who they they built up was susan sontag

right and susan sontag i mean she's

toxic i mean you read her stuff

she she has this essay that she

published people consider it one of her

greatest works

fascinating fascism and it's all about

you know she's criticizing this

this uh art exhibit and saying it's

fascist but her definition of fascism

is like the most crazy i mean if

anything

anything is fascist she says that i say

gymnastics or fascist

uh fascism is physical fitness if you

want people to physically fit god forbid

that's

fascist uh you know uh you know uh

having a

having a a a powerful leader leading a

group that's

fascist uh you know uh trying to build a

family of mankind that's

fascist um and and if you read that

essay basically she's saying anything

other than

than individualism right anything that

celebrates beauty

anything that is trying to to build a

new word world anything that unleashes

courage and encourages strength is by

definition fascist so

if you follow that essay you can't build

a mass revolutionary movement you can't

you can't right you're going to be

fascist right

there's something especially pernicious

about that

specifically because and we know this

from experience

we are continually called fascists

bread tube i mean and you i think as

well you're called an os bowl and all

this dumb stuff

and and i don't know if you saw my

encounter with washed

but it's precisely why i

acted the way i did on the whole fascism

thing

is what you're saying these people

define fascism so

vaguely and so abstractly

then it that it could be applied to the

power that had the decisive significance

in the actual destruction of

fascism which was the soviet union all

these things you mentioned the promotion

of

beauty the promotion of health physical

fitness

strength promotion of manhood a sense of

manhood

for people and i think you know i'm not

like one of those mra people whatsoever

but

what's so wrong with being able to teach

people

you know who are really confused in this

day and age just you know

how to be a man you know things like

that communist states dealt with issues

like those you know

um and

it's like all of those things have just

suddenly become

fascist when in fact

the fascists were stealing and

opportunistically trying to emulate the

example of

not only the real existing soviet union

but also

the communist parties of their

respective countries and also the

the social democrats the german social

democrats

had traditions of um these kind of boy

scouts camping and all these kinds of

uh promotion of physical fitness and

culture and all that kind of stuff and

the nazis pretty much

we're hijacking all of that stuff so

you have to ask the question where did

the fascists get these things we are

otherwise associating with fascism

they stole it from the socialist

movements

right and and then what's interesting is

a lot of the things that you and i

complain about about the synthetic left

are actually far more accurate about

fascism for example uh you know i mean

we're pushing an ideology that is about

you know human progress

and advancement uh but the fascists were

obsessed with the past they loved

primitive feudal societies

the dalai lama right who was just the

the darling of all these synthetic

leftists oh the evil communists have

oppressed tibet

before the communists came tibet was

this beautiful mystical kingdom

the nazis loved the tibetan society

right the tibetan feudal regime

they loved it because everyone was just

born into their place there was no class

struggle and

and no you know i was this you know

really authoritarian feudal society

um you know the nazis were very very

into the indian caste system something

the british empire reinforced when they

got to india

and this kind of this primitivist

obsession right this this belief that

that well we don't want to advance we

want to go back to like you know

pre-capitalist societies and kind of

kind of you know glorify the the

mystical beauty of

of pre-capitalist civilizations that is

a very nazi

very fascist that's julius evola that's

you look at the ideology

of the far right that is that is very

much intrinsic to what they believe

and a lot of the things that they say

now like you pointed out are fascist

are just things that if you would do

just common sense if you're building a

mass political movement right

if you're i mean if you're trying to

mobilize a mass movement of people

uh to get together you might want them

to wear uniforms so they dress similarly

you know what i'm saying

uh the communists of germany they wore

red arm bands so the nazis they had

their red armband except they put

swastikas on them right

um you know uh the the communists are

all you know going back to the paris

commune we had our salute

right so you know the fascists invented

their salute right

um interesting fact right you know uh

you know back then they didn't have you

know

when they were mass printing propaganda

posters they didn't have

facial details right there wasn't enough

like you couldn't have a lot of facial

details

so lennon and stalin both had very

distinct mustaches

so if people saw the mustache they knew

that's lennon that's stalin well

hitler comes along right he's trying to

build print posters so his face can go

on propaganda posters

he has a very distinct mustache so none

of this is fascist this is just

when you're building a mass political

movement you do this kind of thing and

and communists and social democrats did

it first

and then the nazis were coming along and

building their political movement to

beat back the communists and and the

socialists and such

so they they did some of this on their

own while

also incorporating a lot of very

reactionary elements trying to

reincorporate the past

anti-semitism the idea that the problem

isn't capitalism it's just some race or

another

right um you know i mean they were they

were you know you know co-opting some of

the

effective organizing tactics of the

revolutionary movements

plus incorporating their very you know

reactionary ideas glorifying the past

wanting to go backward

look malthusianism is all over nazi

ideology right they wanted to reduce the

population

in the soviet union stalin gave women a

medal one of the highest honors it was

if you had more than 10 children you got

a medal for being a mother of the soviet

union

the nazis sterilized people they went

around they first started with disabled

people sterilizing them

then political dissidents sterilizing

them and and we know all the rest and

what eventually happened so

you know uh you know i mean the nazis

were actively trying to decrease their

population

right whereas uh you know in in the

soviet union they were actively trying

to expand their population big

difference there

very very big difference there um and

and you know the nazi and the fascist

elements i mean that was very much you

know i thought that was the most

brilliant part of your debate with bosch

right i i never had thought of that and

that when you said that was very

brilliant

he asked you to define fascism you said

fascism is when liberalism like

collapses into itself

that's really what it is right it's when

the liberal societies enter such a big

crisis

that they're forced to become illiberal

to protect their system that's actually

a very good definition

a very very good definition we're seeing

that a lot right now right

i mean this is the argument right is

that you know the western world

is so great because everyone can think

whatever they want everyone can say

whatever they want

um but now uh there's such a crisis in

society and there's a lot of people

joining these

ill liberal movements like communism or

or the far right or whatever

so we need to start banning people from

the internet in case uh they would

it's like wait a second i thought what

was so great is that we don't ban people

from the internet and this is

liberalism collapsing onto itself oh you

know we're for total free speech and

that's why we have to ban people who

might you know come into power and limit

total free speech

this is like it's it's getting crazy

right and then that's kind of the basis

of what fascism is the liberal society

is so threatened

uh in a crisis that it's it's reduced to

that i've talked about bonapartism

uh you know how one section of the

ruling class will battle against other

sections

and i think that that's that's really

key into understanding um and that's

karl marx's pamphlet of the 18th roomier

of louis bonaparte he talks about

you know the finance capitalists were

backing louis bonaparte in 1851 take

over the government

um and what's interesting is i think

that nowadays that's kind of the role

that

the bread tubers kind of play right they

are like they are

fighting for one faction of the ruling

class against another they are fighting

for the ultra rich facts and they're

fighting for

you know for jeff bezos they're fighting

for george soros

they're fighting for the ultra rich

against kind of an insurgency by betsy

devos

and who's the guy who owns home depot

what's his name uh the home depot guy

and you know there's these lower level

capitalists fracking companies others

that are are kind of fighting back

against the ultra rich you know in

in a turf war and you know the bread

tubers they're

you know the hit squad the goon squad of

the ultra rich to control the lower

level capitalists who are rebelling

around donald trump um and uh and that's

really what's going on and it's

interesting because at the same time you

know we're supposed to hate trump

because he's illiberal remember that

like he's illiberal right trump is

illiberal he's just like kim jong-un

he's just like putin he's just like

china he's illiberal he's a threat to

our liberal order

so what we got to do according to cnn

right is we got to kidnap people and

deprogram them

and brainwash and brainwash them to make

sure they don't follow this guy

who's illiberal and brainwashes this is

getting stupid you know what i'm saying

like

it's it's it's really really really

bizarre and silly

um you know and it's like you know i i

i'm not a q anon guy i don't i think

it's a

really crazy conspiracy theory but at

the end of the day the fact that a lot

of working-class americans

are so angry at the ruling class and so

angry at the elite

that they think these people might be

satanic pedophiles

is that a bad thing i mean i mean i'd

rather they think they're satanic

pedophiles than think they're good

you know i mean at the end of the day

right you know i mean i want to engage

with these people i'd rather these

people think that they're capitalists

and the solution is workers power

that's what i want i don't want to just

shame them back into to obeying the

the elites of this country i mean i mean

it's yeah the priorities are all

are all confused you know people make

these endless analogies to the 1930s

right and that's a pet peeve of mine too

the 1930s right you know roosevelt

entered a popular front alliance with

the communists and great victories were

won

that's this is not the 1930s okay i mean

i mean there's no

you know soviet union now there's no

like mass communist party

and entering an alliance with biden is

the equivalent of shooting yourself in

the head

that's really what they what they're

doing i mean that's all they're doing

here this is not

it it is it is not uh this is not a

revolutionary act

we're not on the brink of having a

fascist dictatorship set up

look trump you know trump was bad but

fascist

you know ashes tend to like you know if

if trump was actually a fascist

okay if trump was actually a fascist the

pandemic would have been his reichstag

fire and he would have like swung into

action and did all kinds of stuff you

know that that's what fascists do it's a

bonapartist move to save capitalism

um and donald trump fell on his face in

the pandemic donald trump's a

libertarian he's a pathetic libertarian

he sat back and the economy collapsed

and fell apart and he couldn't even tell

people to put masks on their face what

kind of

you know a fascist would like shoot

people for not putting masks on he'd

implement the death penalty for not

wearing a mask he's a fascist come on

you know donald trump doesn't have the

courage to tell his supporters to put

their masks on and he's a fascist you

know

fascism is heavy-handed authoritarianism

to

try and save capitalism donald trump was

weak

and pathetic and trying to protect lower

levels of capital from some of the

managerial schemes of the ultra-rich

he appealed to racism and anti-immigrant

bigotry anti-islamic you know people's

bigotry and their

their delusions and such so i mean you

know you can see elements there at the

end of the day i mean

you know trump was trump was a pretty

pathetic prophetic guy

and uh you know i i don't think his

crime was being illiberal

i don't think his crime was appealing to

masculinity i think his crime was that

he was a phony and a fraud that's what i

think his crime was

i 100 agree with pretty much everything

you you said about trump

i mean um but this you know again it

comes back

these people are gonna say well it's all

it's just because everyone's brainwashed

by russian fake news there's no

contradiction of liberalism there's no

contradiction of our society it's all

russian fake news coming in and

brainwashing people into fascism

supposedly

but um you know back to this thing about

fascism as liberal liberalism and

contradiction

you know it's interesting because

liberalism was always a negation

it was just a pure negation of the old

feudal and kind of traditional society

and liberalism uh was always this kind

of um

rights for its own sake individual

rights just for its own sake

you know um uh with no

kind of actual content no substantive

content

and fascism and and

when liberalism is faced with a

contradiction that it that there is

indeed

um real premises real substantive

content of its own order like for

example

the fact that people need to be taken

care of economically

the fact that after 1929 the wild west

kind of arbitrary capitalism was no

longer sustainable

um this is where i think fascism has

decisive significance because actually

instead of

being open to the real material content

missing which liberalism foreclosed

itself from in a real authentic

community

fascism invented a fake phony

mythological and idealized

community an idealized past an idealized

tradition

uh which didn't which wasn't didn't

reflect any real

openness to the german and italian

people and it's especially evident for

example in italy the way that the

fascists had an uneasy relationship to

the southern

southern italy the southern italians

and i think there's something similar

going on with bread tube actually

bread tube is inventing the synthetic

left is inventing

trying to reinforce

the gaps in liberalism by creating new

rules

new political correctness new bonds new

pencil pencil factory you know

experiments about you know

how to recreate society entirely from

scratch all of this

just to prevent themselves and avoid

some type of

new openness to the actual majority of

people

who are living in in the country within

which they reside

instead of engaging in a newfound

dialogue with the masses and learning

from them not pandering to them but

learning from them

humbling oneself to them they want to

create something

you know in a vacuum abstractly workers

democratic ownership

of the pencil factory or something and

then they draw a line if you don't agree

with this

you're out if you're in you're in and

that's the whole

that's actually what this whole culture

war is about it's not actually about

the supposed content of transgender

rights and gay rights and

all this kind of stuff it's a way of

uh it's a way of this kind of elite this

cultural elite to estrange themselves

from the majority of the people and

basically um

create their own culture and reality

from scratch without having to

acknowledge the real material reality

uh that is beyond these kinds of bubbles

and walls they're creating for

themselves

so to me that's another way breadtube is

very related to fascism but speaking

about this whole fascism

business this is the plain fact i think

it's ridiculous to compare the present

situation to the 1930s at all

i think it's just stupid like how you

said you know pretty much

agree with what you said about the

reasons why but another reason i would

add is that

kind of missing one really important

thing when they're calling trump a

fascist and they're making all these

accusations about fascism

it's not only the fact that we don't

have we do have china so that's kind of

an equivalent to the soviet union but

what about war there was no

fascism without some type of newfound

aggression against other countries

italy invaded ethiopia for no reason i

mean there were reasons but

this was the meaning of fascism in italy

the meaning of fascism in germany

was the eastward and the invasion you

know the

the conquest of the the living space or

whatever and

the destruction of the soviet union if

anyone wants to look at

where anything that bears any

uh similarity to the 1930s fascism is

going to come from

why don't they look at the actual

american deep state

and it's it's attempts to uh create

newfound aggression against rising

powers

like china and russia if fascism is

gonna come somewhere it's gonna come

from the humiliated

um national feeling that is coming with

the rise of

china coupled with the deep states

hostility hostility to china and then

one last thing i just wanted to say

about the satanic elites and stuff is

that

honest to god i may be at the threat of

embarrassing myself but honest to god

i have no idea what kind of twisted and

warped

and depraved culture actually prevails

among these

elites because after what was revealed

with jeffrey epstein

at the very least i have to confine

myself to a position of ignorance i just

don't know

honestly i don't know if they're satanic

elites i mean

satanic pedophiles they might be you

know it's

it's up in the air we honest to god just

don't know you know

what wouldn't surprise me is all i'd say

well

you know as far as what you said about

fascism and war you know i

i really i really if there's any german

folks watching i

i deeply i deeply sympathize with you

because you know

that the ideas of hitler those were

british

empire ideas right malthusianism

racial pseudoscience anti-semitism and

that there's been this whole

emphasis in in the way history is taught

that like fascism is just like magically

german

right like germans are just fascist

people they're just inherently fascist

and it's like for thousands of years the

germans have been like that and that's

not true

um you know germany until hitler was the

center of the global gay rights movement

there were huge

institutions promoting gay rights in

germany in the 1920s

um you know i mean it's it's the music

of bach and beethoven look the communist

manifesto was written

in germany the biggest marxist group in

the world the german social democratic

party for many years was was in germany

uh the german communist party was the

biggest communist party outside the

soviet union

the germans have a proud history they

have a lot to be proud of right

and that that what fascism and and

hitler was about was about

you know trying to trying to destroy

that history

um in order to prevent some kind of

revolution and it was the british and

and british bankers and capitalists the

british royal family

uh you know you talk about you know

wealthy interests in britain

that that worked hard to bring fascism

to germany as a way of like crushing

its progressive and revolutionary nature

so you know i mean i

and and it and the biggest fear that the

the you know you talk about the anglo

imperialists

the the the eastern establishment of the

united states uh you know the british

the british you know bankers and

imperialists their greatest fear has

always been the germans and the russians

getting together

because if the germans and the russians

got together then basically the european

mainland would be and

all of eurasia would would no longer be

under their dominion

and they know that right and they've

known that for a long time

and if you look at at what happened is

you know the the british the americans

the french they got into the imperialism

game

way ahead of the germans they started

colonizing the world and

and all of that and germany was very

late in the process right they were very

late in the process of becoming an

imperialist capitalist country

uh they got into the game late um and

they were trying to catch up with the

british and the french and the american

imperialists

and because they were trying to catch up

they did some things

uh that were kind of a little bit you

know more progressive i guess you could

say to try and stabilize their society

to keep up with the

the other western imperialists like they

had public education before we did here

in the united states they had a

national health care service you know

before and it was again you know they

were trying to catch up the kaiser and

all that they were trying to catch up to

to what happened and ultimately that

exploded into world war one

after world war one the imperialist

germans were stripped of all their

colonies

they were stripped of all their colonies

um you know and and you know at that

point

they were you know they were kind of you

know held down and you had you know you

had the communist party of germany

fighting for a

socialist germany to join with the

soviet union and so you had the british

you know and the western imperialist

setting up hitler kind of as a counter

gang as

a grouping to fight the communists but

then you'll notice that hitler

changed his ideology in the late 20s

because he realized he had a chance to

come to power

and he sat down with hollimer shacked

holly shacked was the economist who

was friendly with hitler he was a german

banker and he basically uh you know

you know hitler stopped working for the

british and he started working for the

krupps and the tysons and for shocked

um and the the german industrialists

seized control of the government

killed all the communists but also

canceled the loans of the british and

started trying to reseas colonies and

seize territory again

and then you have world war ii um and

and ever since world war ii you know

germany once again you know beaten down

but their capitalist economy re-emerging

so now you have a situation where the

germans have been saying look we want to

buy natural gas from russia the united

states is on the other side of the world

russia is right here we're going to buy

natural gas from russia we're going to

build this nordstrom 2 pipeline

and the united states and britain are

going crazy and telling the germans they

don't have the right to buy natural gas

from russia

and it's this huge issue that they want

the germans to like pay twice as much

practically

for their natural gas just because you

know we say

you know we the americans we the british

say you're not allowed to buy your

natural gas

from russia right but again it's not

just about natural gas it's that fear

that fear on the part of the british

bankers and the american bankers and the

american oil

giants that if the germans and the

russians get friendly to each other

that will cancel out their domination of

europe and

eventually of eurasia right i mean

they're afraid of seeing the belton road

and all the economic development

projects that china is leading

and that russia is leading and with

eurasian economic union

they're afraid of seeing that spill into

europe could you imagine high-speed

railway

all throughout you know eurasia could

you imagine what could be done

right if if you know if europe and

western europe and

russia and china were to get together

and that is what they're afraid of the

world is slipping out of their fingers

and they know it right

their system has gotten to the point

that it is on the brink of total

collapse

right and this is again this is basic

like i

it bothers me that these bread tube

folks don't read marxism you know they

want you to think about something

different because marx talked about

production over production right that

that you know the capitalist is

constantly trying to make production

more efficient

eliminate people from the assembly line

hire as few people as possible pay those

who

he does hire as little possible so you

de-skill the jobs right and the idea is

you know is make production

as efficient as possible as cheap as

possible churn out as many

products as you possibly can hire as few

people pay as little to do it

and the result is the worker who is also

the consumer

can't buy back the product he's

producing right that's what happens

right if you eliminate people's jobs you

drive down people's wages

eventually people can't buy the products

that you're producing and so you have a

glut and the market is full of products

that can't be sold

and the economy collapses and this is

the built-in problem of capitalism and

this is why they created the federal

reserve

i mean this is why all the economic

reforms they've invented have been

carried out they're trying to stabilize

a naturally unstable system

the worker cannot buy back the product

he produces that's the problem of

capitalism and that's what's happening

the computer revolution has just

expanded that problem beyond anything

marx never envisioned self-driving cars

you know marx never envisioned you know

you know you know uh

amazon you know where you know a book is

printed by a machine not no human labor

involved in printing the book the

machine just turns out the book

right 3d printers i mean their computer

revolution has created such a situation

where there's millions of people that

have no place in their assembly line um

and their system is coming to a grinding

halt

whereas in china where the state

controls the means of production where

the banks

and the factories the major industries

are subject to a state central plan and

the lending of money and credit is in

the hands of the state

this isn't a problem in fact as

technology advances in china

living standards advance and people are

getting wealthier while the economy is

becoming more efficient this

contradiction between technology

technology

and you know human prosperity and

abundance is eliminated right we can get

more technology

and people can get wealthier at the same

time so their system has reached an

impasse the computer revolution is

destroying capitalism

meanwhile the socialist countries of the

world are able to deal with the computer

revolution

uh because profits are not in command

the state controls the means of

production not the irrationality of the

market

so they're at an impasse whereas the

developing countries or the socialist

countries of the world are continuing to

speed ahead

the way china handled the pandemic is

another great example of that you know

um and you know they're at an impasse

and i think they will become more

war-like i think it's weird you know

you ever you know there's a line in a

lot of old horror movies they say it's

quiet

too quiet i listen to the biden

administration they sound quiet

too quiet you know what i'm saying

they're very very careful in how they

speak

anthony blinken says oh no more force no

more force

in uh regime change anymore yeah i

really trust you on that one anthony

uh you know i mean it's i i think

they're planning something you know

harris is a very dangerous person i i

have psychologically profiled her she's

a very

very dangerous person she is somebody

who wants to kill

she wants to destroy she wanted to

execute an

innocent man in california she wanted to

block dna evidence and

execute an innocent man that is called

attempted murder in my world right but

you know she tried her best to execute

an innocent man

in california destroyed the lives of

thousands of people

for smoking marijuana and then they

asked her on tv oh have you ever smoked

marijuana she was like oh of course

my family's from jamaica yeah i mean

it's like this is a dangerous woman and

she was put in there

to continue doing what the hillary

clinton state department wants and that

is unleash

chaos and mass destruction to preserve

the rule of wall street bankers and

london bankers

so i'm really perplexed by the kind of

passive

silent you know careful words we're

hearing from the biden administration

i think behind the scenes they're

planning something there are

negotiations going on right now they're

getting ready to do something big

and when when something big happens

which we don't know what it is

when something big happens it is our

responsibility those of us who

understand how the world is actually

working it is our responsibility to tell

the working-class people of this country

that their enemy isn't on wall street

their enemy or their enemy is not in

iran

their enemy's not in china their enemy's

not in russia or venezuela their enemy

is the billionaire bankers that run this

country

this is basic our real enemy is at home

that was the message of the

revolutionary working-class anti-war

movement of eugene debs and

and joe hill and so many great figures

throughout this country our real enemy

is at home

you know our lives are being destroyed

by the capitalists and we need to get

that message out to people

you know one thing that's interesting is

you'll notice that the anti-china

obsession of trump has carried over

right anthony blinken said that china is

the only country in the world

that can challenge the open

international system

right the open international system is

that interesting turn of phrase the open

international system

you know when they rule the world it's

open right you know i mean you know what

i'm saying

you know it's like when they're in

charge it's just it's it's open right

you know

they're not in charge it's just that's

just the way it's supposed to be you

know and and but but if

if china were to start to grow as a

country and have international influence

they're challenging it's not open

anymore

right i mean this is it's like their de

facto supposed to be in charge

that's just the way it is and if you

start meddling with that you're being a

dictator right because

de facto the natural order of the world

is them being in charge

well i think i would disagree with that

i look at the world right now i think

things are very

unnatural we're seeing a lot of

unnatural disasters we're seeing

man-made famines caused by capitalism i

mean you know i mean look what's

happened in africa since this pandemic

has started

malnutrition through the roof that's

their system that is their system right

that kills people all over the world

it's destroying the lives of working

families in this country

um you know we those of us those of us

who understand

actually marxism leninism actually

understand it we have a duty

we have a responsibility to to get

people in the united states to

understand who their real enemy is

you know um we always like to say

that um it's important to learn from

china

you know obviously china is a different

country with a completely different

history

but the way china i mean um

the way china's socialism uh is able to

reconcile

contradictions and um and function with

its dynamism

it's really arrogant that there are

there that there's anyone in america

calling themselves a socialist who's

dismissing and foreclosing themselves to

the most

probably the most successful socialist

country

that gives meaning to the word i mean in

the history of a

history of the world arguably but um

i very much agree that uh it seems to me

as well

that they are plotting something and it

has been awfully quiet we haven't really

seen a really solid

indication of the direction the biden

administration is planning on going in

but if the past is any you know serves

any lesson

something is going on they're cooking

something up and all i would want to say

to that is

all of those people who were shilling

for biden during the election

uh because of the specter of fascism

posed by trump yeah they should be held

accountable for whatever happens

uh when this whole body administration

and its foreign policy

and i'm even seeing some of these same

people these synthetic leftists trying

to walk back

their previous support for biden uh

critiquing

you know the whole business of uh the

lack of passing of a fifteen dollar

minimum wage and

the drone strikes in syria and elsewhere

and so on

uh well you were the one who said this

was your lesser of two evils so you have

to stick by it

you know people like us we're telling

people not to waste their time and

energy

voting for people like biden and instead

commit their energy

to working on building an actual

alternative because as human

beings our time is finite our energy is

finite we can either use our time to go

with the status quo

or we could use what little time we have

to try and build something new

and you know the whole argument that

well you know we're just

doing harm reduction but that's

ridiculous

you know you're a finite person with the

small time and energy that you have

you would be making much more of an

impact trying to build an

actual alternative for working americans

than just

joining this flood this you know

this sheep for the status quo this flock

of sheep

for the status quo as just one among

many

if you're committing yourself to

building an alternative you're not just

a sheep anymore you're actually

participating in building something new

um

but anyway it's very strange in general

how the meaning even in america of

socialism and communism has changed

now in the past the meaning of socialism

and communism

meant empowerment it meant giving people

dignity and something to be proud of

today the meaning of socialism appears

to have been defined

entirely by the right wing

but what we have with bread tube and the

synthetic left is that they're just

going they're just going ahead

and perversely adopting this caricature

and straw man created by the right wing

and embracing that

oh communism is for weaklings who hate

humanity and are misanthropic

and are pessimistic and you know they

they

they as you said they want to kill

stifle people's

creative uh energies their livelihoods

they want you to be depressed

and uh fear-mongering like greta

thumberg about

the end of the world and all this kind

of stuff and they just went yeah okay

so now i've kind of seen what the

meaning of socialism and

so-called communism in the american

context has come to mean

it doesn't actually mean any authentic

discovery of these ideas

within the american context or i should

take rediscovery because they do have

precedent in

american history and rather consists in

a way

of um perversely mocking

and teasing uh conservative people

that's my the conclusion i draw i drew

yeah

well you know it's funny because you

know i think about communism i think

about william z

foster and gus hall and huey newton and

you know the leaders of the black

panther party fred hampton and others

their message was that working people

are oppressed uh by a system that puts

profits over people

and that black and white should united

fight seize control of the economy

and build a society where working people

and their needs come first and human

creativity and progress is no longer

restrained that's their message

but i listen to you know the folks on

bread tube and i'll criticize bernie

sanders a little bit too

when people say you know well the

understanding of socialism is well the

government gives people free health care

the government

gives people free education i mean i'm

for that i'm not against that

but but you know in a way it's they've

taken this like very triumphant

and heroic message um and they've

replaced it with ah fuck this shit give

me some free stuff

you know and that's kind of what i get

from a lot of you know the message that

i get from a lot of young social it's

like the world

sucks give me some food stuff well i

mean they deserve some free stuff

corporations get free stuff all the time

they're not wrong but like that

that that is such a pessimistic way of

looking at things it's not

inspiring it's not you know heroic and i

do think

that social media in a lot of ways has

really weakened

people right it's really kind of turned

a lot of people into

into very emotionally weak people i talk

about over socialization right and that

um

you know it's very interesting you know

uh b.f skinner

who was one of the important

psychologists out of harvard he did a

study and he determined that if you want

to control someone's behavior

uh it's far more effective to reward

them than to punish them

because if you punish somebody they can

just say well you're you're being unfair

to me right you're victimizing me and in

fact there's like

you know there's a lot of like murderers

and rapists and all that that really in

their minds think they did nothing wrong

and the world's just being unfair to

them people can make

huge leaps and back flips to make

themselves feel like a victim no matter

what

but if you reward somebody nobody ever

goes i don't deserve this reward you're

trying to manipulate

me you know what i'm saying so it's

reward is a far more effective way to

manipulate somebody

and but what you can do with rewards

rather than punishments is you can turn

people into addicts

right the reward controls people when it

gets taken away

right it's like oh well you know you

don't get a reward this time you don't

get a sticker little johnny you don't

get a

you don't get a cookie and social media

has got people programmed

right we're constantly looking at our

phones you know oh do we get another

like do we get another share

oh do the people agree with me or oh

they don't agree with me and it's gotten

people into this state where they're

they're like addicts you know the heroin

addict has to get their hit they have to

get their hit we have to get our like

our emotional you know reward our

validation from our peers

and if we don't get that uh you know

then we got to do something different

because we got to get this emotional

validation

and it has kind of turned people into

addicts where they constantly are

craving the approval of others

and they don't have the the courage to

stand against the mob

right as much as i'm a populist and all

of that you have to admit the most

heroic people in history talk about joan

of arc

you talk about dr martin luther king jr

these are people that stood

against the mob these are people that

took unpopular stands that

you know that that you know that stood

firm in their beliefs and

and earned the scorn of others made

other people angry

right and that social media has kind of

weakened people and taken away people's

ability to be tough

and to stand firm and to just say you

know what this is these are my

principles

this is the hill i want to die on you

know come get me right and

and that is what we need to find a way

to reinvigorate in people that

that heroism because i would argue that

social media is

largely it's about making people

dependent on the approval of others

and the the the dirty secret behind all

of it is we know what they do with their

algorithms it's not really

the approval of others right they're

manipulating it behind the scenes

silicon valley

i mean the people i mean look there's a

whole history of this it sounds tinfoil

hattie

who set up who set up silicon valley as

the center of the computer revolution

okay

the nsa the cia it was a strategic

decision they knew the soviets couldn't

invest in

they didn't have the resources to invest

in computers and you know the reason

that

it wasn't the free market that was going

to create silicon valley it was very

much a result of strategic decision

making by the intelligence agencies

they put the usa at the center of the

computer revolution al gore

he said you know we invented the

internet what he meant

was that through strategic decisions the

american government

had created you know what eventually

became the internet and that you know

that they are

very much using social media and using

you know you know the control of the

mechanisms of information

to try and carry out their agenda and

their agenda is not

eradicating poverty in the world their

agenda is not you know lifting people up

their agenda is staying on top of the

world

um and you know you talk about satanic

elites i mean read the aquarian

conspiracy by marilyn ferguson

right i mean marilyn ferguson was al

gore's spiritual advisor

and she wrote this very very disturbing

occultist uh

new age manifesto called the aquarian

conspiracy

all about basically how we're out of

balance with mother nature

and we need to create some kind of you

know social explosion to you know drive

humanity

uh humanity down to uh down to you know

balance with mother nature once again

this is this disturbing stuff

a lot of these new left gurus you know

they seem progressive but again the

dalai lama

was not progressive right uh you know

the indian caste system

you know was not progressive and a lot

of a lot of the eastern

influence uh you know on on uh

you know what what's going on in the

west that's a big thing with like the

new age folks they're all about the east

right the eastern ways the nazis were

like that too right they had this

fixation on the east

whereas in china the communists have

been trying to modernize they've been

trying to get rid of that stuff i mean

this falun gong

cult that's trying to overthrow the

chinese government that puts out epic

times

it's like quoted as a credible source on

china

these folks these folks are are not

eastern in the sense they're

in the developing world fighting you

know to develop and fighting for

progress

they're eastern in the sense they

glorify pre-capitalist feudalism they

they glorify the past um they're opposed

to human progress right and that

john foster dulles uh who was a founder

of the cia

wrote that one of the strategies of the

cia was to was to you know promote you

know

mystical religious groups that would be

against

communism in china um and that that's

long been their strategy and you can

talk about you can talk about falun gong

you can talk about eastern lightning

you can talk about the hari krishna

movement uh you can talk about reverend

sun young moon in south korea

you know the use of like mystical

reactionary groups to to fight against

scientific progress in the east

uh it's been a big aspect of cia

strategy

but also it had a lot of influence on on

silicon valley and the kind of social

engineering faction

uh that is trying to dominate the united

states and rule with

with social media they have a very very

uh

eastern mystical primitivist perspective

i think and that that influences what

they're doing

yeah i mean uh it's interesting you you

bring up

um i i want to say that's that's the

kind of more interesting stuff but uh

you know uh this thing about the

relationship between

this kind of this type of mysticism and

fascism and reaction and

i mean you i mean the nazi thing is

self-evident history madame blavatsky

and theosophy

was all up all connected to fascism and

you know but um i think that the way

humanity can establish an authentic

relationship

to its real past and its old religious

and even

to an extent mystical traditions is by

embracing the wealth

of modern technology and uh

in a sense modern science uh

because these people you're talking

about like falun gong and these kind of

mystic

they're making a fatal assumption they

are making the assumption

that the pre-modern

civilization and society was explicitly

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was explicitly establishing itself

against modern progress but that's

knocking on an open door it's just that

they

they hadn't yet encountered uh

encountered uh

what we call modern science and

technology and so on so on that's why

communists were the only ones who

actually successfully i would argue

revive the unique characteristics of

their respective civilizations in russia

and also in china um whereas people like

falun gong and all these kinds of

you know i would call them fake mystics

and these kinds of religious people

glorifying their idealized version of

feudalism

they are actually an extension of

liberalism western liberalism

in my view i think that's kind of a

lesson from not to get too philosophical

or anything but that's a lesson of

dialectics is that

contraries uh a parent's contraries

uh can coincide you're absolutely right

yeah you're absolutely right i mean if

you look at um you look at the middle

east for example

right saudi arabia is one of the most

primitive barbaric

governments out there that's who the

british imperial is set up and that's

who the west embraces

who do we attack in the middle east we

attack you know governments like syria

that

are modern and secular uh governments

like the islamic republic of iran where

they have women who are brigadier

generals in the military and multiple

party elections etc

that um and that this is part of the

problem with the synthetic left is that

they've

they've obliterated the economic

definition of imperialism

right imperialism is about holding back

development so the western capitalists

can keep the world as a

captive market and instead it's become

quote unquote cultural imperialism

right and cultural imperialism means if

you do anything to

you know to if these countries do

anything to modernize right

if in the arab world the baathists come

in and build power plants

and wipe out illiteracy well that's

getting away from the beautiful

primitive ways look at saudi arabia

that's a beautiful

i mean that's that's the way these

people think i mean in nicaragua the

sandinistas the socialist government you

know

they are working very hard to eradicate

poverty they've wiped out illiteracy

they've done all of this

and the cia goes and they find like the

most like crazy reactionary sex of the

indigenous people who don't believe in

technology and stuff

and say oh you know this these look at

these indigenous people they're so angry

about what the sandinistas are doing

i mean you know i mean it's ridiculous

it'd be like if you you know you went to

you know i'm from ohio right

you could find like an amish guy in ohio

you know and the next time they're

building a power plant you know put him

on tv

oh we ohioans don't believe in

electricity this is not our way you know

you're

people testing our beautiful ohio

culture we're amish here

and this is this is i mean it's and the

majority of people in nicaragua

are indigenous right um and and that

again it's about obscuring the actual

definition of imperialism if it becomes

cultural imperialism and you know and i

mean there

are you know and that's kind of the

beauty of modern china is

you know you know the first act of dr

sun yet sin when he launched the

revolution was he smashed the idols in

the temple

right and he told the people of china

these are primitive beliefs we need to

be modern scientific like the west

mao took that to a whole nother level

with the cultural revolution

but now in in china they have found like

kind of a balance where

you know that marxism fundingism and

mountain thought

and uh you know and confucianism and

some of the aspects of chinese

civilization

are able to kind of like have a you know

a synergy right

um they reject all the aspects of

traditional chinese culture rooted in

feudalism

but they also celebrate a lot of the

traditions of chinese civilization

while also embracing scientific marxism

and that they can

they can walk together and that's the

beauty of it um and that's really kind

of what's amazing

um about you know chinese socialism is

that they they have been able to

combine these things right and that in

the west we like to

glorify primitivism it's this weird

bourgeois thing i swear

it's like national geographic magazine

all these rich people they go to africa

it's like the zoo or something they take

pictures and they're like oh look at

these primitive people with their ways

it's so

you know that's kind of what it is i

mean a lot of what what calls itself you

know intercultural

and and a lot of the academic you know

you know looking at developing countries

is this kind of very

sick you know tourism i guess you could

call it right that's what the west is

doing

um meanwhile people in the developing

world fighting for their rights fighting

to raise their countries out of poverty

are able to embrace some aspects of

their culture but also embrace

science and progress and and that's a

beautiful thing um you know and i mean

i've been to the islamic republic of

iran i've seen you know what they've

achieved as a result of the islamic

revolution and

um you know there are there there are

great things that are achieved when

countries break out of western

capitalism

um and that's that's never told right

that story is never told um and that's

that's

one of the problems in the way discourse

in the west is we never know about

how great it is when countries break

free and start developing themselves and

allow their cultures to flourish but

also allow to modernize

yeah i think um there's two ways of

looking at this event we call modernity

i think

i think one of the ways is the kind of

dogmatic

liberal way is that modernity

is just negation for negation's sake

rights for rights own sake but another

way of looking at it is

allowing us to stop making assumptions

about our our own nature right

the ability to have gender equality the

ability to have

modern education medicine technology all

of these things

free us from the bondage of prejudices

and assumptions

and allow us to have a newfound

openness in relation to our own

traditions

and history without making dogmatic

assumptions and i think that's what

happened

in the case of china they had the modern

revolution but instead of

closing themselves off from their own

past permanently

like how i would argue the west more or

less

america has done they use this as an

opportunity to rediscover their own

authentic tradition and civilization um

while still retaining this modern

standing

freedom that doesn't that doesn't uh

force them to become

bogged down by the bondage uh and

and i think one thing that's actually

the same

two sides of the same coin is the

liberalism the negation for its own sake

and the fake fetishization of indigenous

uh true authentic untainted

human zoo if you it's pretty much what

it is

like these academic ivory dollar people

this is the sick game

they occupy in a position of extreme

modern abstraction from the entire world

and power

and the way these elites love to secure

their power is by referring to the

most marginal the most indigenous and so

on types of people and just say

ah this is this is our substance this is

our content because those people

don't actually pose a threat to their

position in their ivory tower

but these you know working class people

in the west this uh

toxic trump supporters and all these

kinds of things those people

actually do pose a threat to the

institutional power of these

academic elites one last thing about

imperialism

you know i had a debate with some guy

dylan

burns recently on twitch about

imperialism

and what's fascinating to me is about

how leftists make imperialism into an

abstraction

they don't actually want to talk about

imperialism as an actual

reality um as an actual

like it's not a coincidence that

anti-imperialist powers

modernize themselves you can't call that

western imperialism that's just a total

abstraction

if you actually look at the concrete

situation you can

very clearly see uh the

remnants of western and specifically

english imperialism on the one hand and

the peoples of the world including

peoples within europe

itself trying to break out of this old

paradigm

so it's fascinating to me that every

it's all about some abstract principle

oh china's committing imperialism

because there's a dispute

in this south china sea it's stupid

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yeah it's it's pretty ridiculous again i

mean they they think imperialism is a

verb

you know they think it's something you

do um i've even heard people say

imperializing

they has the e on the end of it that's

not even like proper use of the english

language but

but no imperialism is a system you know

lenin's definition of imperialism needs

to be revisited people

people need to understand that when you

know imperialism is not one country

influencing another country or trading

with another country it is a

global setup where big monopolies stop

development around the world i tell

people imperialism is

wall street in london keeping the world

poor so that they can stay rich

that's what imperialism is

yeah i mean um it's it's it's the

it's the epitome of opportunism you know

it's it's always this kind of what about

ism of

we can't think critically about the

nature of

the global world order because you know

that's kind of the thing with bread tube

is they

really like to individualize everything

they try to find

isolated individual actions

which they can they try to reduce

social and historical forces to

individual moral actions

china's committing imperialism russia is

committing imperialism

they want to find ways to absolve

themselves from an

authentic and critical encounter

with the actual concrete imperialism

that actually exists

they want and it's the same thing

actually with their critique of

capitalism

if i just go in my community and set up

a pencil factory

i'm actually because i'm doing it

individually i'm actually creating

socialism

and or conversely if you're making money

somehow and trying to get by in this

world you're committing capitalism you

know it's just this

fundamentally individualistic pathology

which i actually like the way you put it

a lot

it's making things into verbs rather

than

systems you're doing socialism you're

doing capitalism

right and it fits their cancel culture

moralist world view it's not really

about changing the world it's about you

know being a good moral person who

virtue signals and

you know you say all the right things

and you do all the right things and

and they're not really trying to change

the world and and one thing i've noticed

that i must say and

i mean this is just an unfortunate

reality is that you know real political

change

real political organizing requires you

to make alliances with people who maybe

you don't agree with

you know i mean i'm sure you and i can

find something we disagree with if we

try hard enough you know what i mean

but in the real world you have to like

be able to find someone and you know hey

i don't agree with you about this but we

can work together on this

but these folks they want to sit there

on the internet and it's like

every little disagreement has to turn

into an epic war

you know what i'm saying and it's like

anyone you know you must never have

shaken hands with anyone you disagree

with

you must never been in the same room as

anyone who's cancelable

and it's like they don't understand that

like that you don't you don't

change the world and you don't

effectively challenge power

by reducing people to more and more

atomized individuals and breaking down

any bonds

you build community you bring people

together

you make alliances that's how real

things get done

right it's not through through this kind

of petty i swear i see these communist

facebook groups and and all that they

cannot they cannot

you know stop fighting for two seconds

you know um

and and it's it's again it's this

releasing of impulses it's this you know

permission to unleash your aggression

you know and it's again like you need to

be able to learn to

to enter an alliance with people to

shake hands with people you don't agree

about

to find some common grounds and start

building something not tear something

down and make yourself feel good and get

your anger out

but build something that's what this is

about it's about building something

yeah i mean um we definitely are aware

of this

kind of you know people making a

mountain out of

molehill over the smallest disagreements

i mean we've

we've almost gotten you know no end to

that when it comes to people

because of our views about china oh

you're dengues you're revisionists and

all this kind of nonsense

so we're very much familiar with uh with

that issue

um you know uh it's the thing about

specifically when when i think some

somewhere in my conversations with these

people you were brought up somewhere

and they always went back and mentioned

oh yeah well caleb

and he's a transphobe and i knew the

the story behind this one so i said he's

not a transphobe he's marched with

for transgender people he was just

talking to someone who happened to maybe

harbor

those i didn't even know if they did or

not but then they were you know it's

like

these stories are becoming they be they

spin these narratives just because

you're talking to someone you disagree

with

the other one was dugan uh that everyone

because you're a nozbel now because you

talked to

dugan i mean it's ridiculous it's

it's a fundamental breakdown of the

basics

of human communication that have

been in place for the whole probably of

all mankind's history

only now do you have this thing where if

you talk to someone

that you know we have a kind of i don't

want to

bother you with this dumb bullshit but

we have a discord right

and we tend to allow people as long as

they

follow the rules of the platform we let

people and they're not personally

abusive we let anyone with any

ideological views come on our discord

because we want people to be know how to

debate these people right

right and people will smear

us uh for for

anything anyone says in that just

because we don't ban

people for having opposing political

views

so um it's shocking to me

that uh that this kind of

this type of level of individualism has

gotten to this

level where just even being somewhat

associated with someone

you have to adopt all of their views

about every single thing

it's just ridiculous to me but one thing

i would say is that

i think we have kind of made it pretty

clear that

our mission is kind of to take down us i

mean the infrared show we do want to

take down

redtube right but as a kind of

self-criticism

maybe something that's a little bit

vague on our parts is

what are we going to replace it with

right

and i always look to you as an example

as an inspiration of somebody who does

not only destroy

but is trying to build things you know

so

i guess that's all i would say about

that sure um

well you know i mean one thing that

people need to learn about this cancel

culture stuff

is you can never please these people

okay

so stop trying right i mean no matter

what you do

look i mean contra points who's a a huge

bread tuber

right she is a transgender bread tuber

they think she's a trans folk and like i

mean i

watch contra points i cannot think of

anyone who's more outspoken for trans

rights is trans herself but

she did something wrong in a video

sometimes she's a trans folk

you can never make these people happy

but

what feeds them is when people

react to them and they go oh oh i'm

sorry oh yeah and they they play the

game and they disavow

whoever they're supposed to disavow that

is like it's like it's like you know

it's like feeding the monster

that whenever you do that you're feeding

the monster so you know and i don't i'm

at the point where i don't

i don't play that game you know i mean

jason and rouhay maui's travel news or

whatever we don't agree on

a lot right but somebody came on to my

my twitter the other day was like oh you

should disavow jason for this or that i

said i'm not gonna do that i said get

the hell out of here

right we disagree on a lot of things but

i'm not gonna disavow him

i don't play that game i don't play that

game that's being a punk

that's being a coward and you just gotta

you gotta learn to be tough and when

someone

comes to you and says oh disable this

person is about that person say no

no i'm not going to play that game you

know i associate with people with whom i

disagree

maybe i'll argue with this person about

this issue that i disagree with

but but that's that and um and that's

that i mean

and and we gotta we gotta do that and

also

you know on some of these issues i must

say like dugan right

dugan has his view fourth political

theory eurasianism

that's his viewpoint obviously not my

viewpoint i'm a marxist leninist i

believe in historical progress

etc uh you know but he's a very

important russian intellectual very

influential a lot of people in russia

read his words a lot of people in russia

strongly disagree with him but a lot of

people do read what he has to say

why would i not as an intellectual as an

anti-imperialist in the west

why would i not want the opportunity to

engage with him

and why would i not you know seek that

opportunity out it's just like common

sense

if you're in the real world trying to

get things done now if you're

on the internet trying to prove you're

the most glorious and most pure

is maybe not um you know jyoti braar uh

you know she's

a leader of the communist party of great

written marxist leninist uh

she's with the workers party and i mean

they do great stuff they're great folks

they're

trying to get to working-class

communities they're building an

anti-id poll pro-brexit socialist party

uh they have been in the long haul i

mean she went to libya to stand with

gaddafi

um you know she went to gaza to stand

with the palestinians i have

huge admiration for jyoti i don't agree

with everything she said about the trans

issue

but also i will say that that you know

there's a difference here right i have

many

trans friends who i love deeply and

anyone ever tried to

discriminate against them or bully them

or or mistreat them or tell them they

weren't welcome or make them feel

ashamed of who they are

i would be the first to step in and say

that's not acceptable

however i don't really know and i don't

and

they don't really know what trans is

right and there's a huge debate among

trans people themselves

about what it is and what it means right

and i stay out of those discussions i

don't know enough about that and i do

know that that there are very strong

feelings among the trans community about

what exactly is behind the transgender

phenomenon

and i as a non-trans person do not know

what's going on there i'll just tell you

i don't know what it is i know that

people have rights i know people

shouldn't be discriminated against i

know people shouldn't be

be ashamed of who they are they

shouldn't be accused of being mentally

ill they should be allowed to live their

lives as they want

and that's it that's what i know and

that is solidarity right you know i

don't go to the black community

and tell them this is who you are this

is how you should fight this

i don't do that because i am not black

you know what i'm saying that there's a

basic level of just solidarity is

respecting people's rights

um and that's it you know what i'm

saying and that's that's that's it's not

and and this demand that you adopt one

ideological perspective or another

that that's again this is not realistic

right there's i mean

it's not realistic right and the trans

issue

uh the sax worker issue also right i

mean look i have said

i've been asked many times what are my

views about the sex worker issue

my view is nuanced you know on the one

hand right if women want to engage in

that kind of work i'm not going to stop

them i don't want them to go to jail

but we have to be real that in a lot of

working class communities the sex trade

is a very

ugly thing it's a very ugly thing you

know you know

women from maybe a middle class

background who would rather

do that than do something else and feel

empowered on the internet or whatever

and

want to get on a webcam that's that's

one thing okay but

you know we know we know what human sex

trafficking is we know there's real

horrors there

and if leftists go around talking like

all all

all of you know what what is called sex

work is a good thing

we're being really really insensitive to

what lots of working-class people go

through

so again there's nuance to this

conversation we can be you know for

decriminalization

for ending the harassment and the

shaming of people engaged in this we can

be for people's right

to engage in it if they you know do so

freely on the one hand

but we have to be real about the reality

of what the global sex trade is and what

the majority of people who are

quote unquote sex workers are going

through which is horrific

and it's a horror of modern capitalism

and that there's a nuanced way to have

these conversations and

and it seems like as the shrill emotions

get going

no one can ever have these kind of

conversations in a nuanced way and that

that at the end of the day there's a

kind of an anti-working-class edge to it

right

if you go into an immigrant community or

a working-class community

and you're telling everyone you know i'm

a socialist in my organization we really

strongly believe in prostitution

people are going to say get away from me

you know what i mean people are going to

say get out of here

you know what i'm saying you have to be

sensitive about how you approach these

issues and

and the world is not as as simple as

people would like and

again it's a very middle-class kind of

thing it's about appealing to middle

class intellectuals and

and seeing working working class people

you know oh they're uneducated rabble

they didn't go to nyu and study gender

studies like i did

clearly clearly you're misinformed you

must be one of those deplorables that uh

that voted for trump

get out of my way you inferior in i mean

this is not a communist approach

this is not how gus hall and william z

foster and

joe hill and and fred hampton would have

approached working class communities

you know you know you can have serious

conversations and engage with people

or you can just feel good about yourself

and dismiss them um and

and you know there's there's one way

that's the communist way and there's one

that is clearly the middle class

petty bourgeois you know virtue

signaling way and i think we know which

way is correct

yeah i mean um it's very

very suspicious why has this whole

discourse about you know prostitution

and all that why has this become at the

four of the left well maybe it has

something to do with the fact that

people are losing a sense of stable

livelihood

maybe it has to do with the fact that um

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selling oneself has become

the new moral virtue i mean not just in

terms of

prostitution but people sell their souls

you know

uh to these institutions that they're

wedded to

um it's extreme and and another really

nefarious thing is

why are socialists the the foremost if

not

not talking about the rights of people

who have fallen victim to this

trade this uh sex trade i'm just talking

about

as some fashionable you know nude why

are socialists

leading this because

doesn't it only empower people who have

money

i mean it's kind of common sense it's a

sex trade

you're purchasing one of the defining

things that makes us human

which defines human relationships you're

purchasing that with money

who has money in our society

it's it's quite self-evident to me you

know why do culture wars always become

the first

thing right why is that you know i mean

why is that always the the first thing

that pops out right

you know the understanding you i mean

you uh you go back to

you know in the communist movement right

people always talked about

how the communist party with their

anti-racist line

were able to win huge victories for the

working class

black and white right that back in the

1920s

when there was a strike because most of

the labor unions were whites only

the black community would be used as

scab labor right and a lot of black

people hated unions because unions kept

them from getting jobs if the plant was

union

it was a union plant and you were black

you couldn't work there right and so a

lot of black people hated unions very

you know understandably so and when

there was a strike

the black people would all be hired as

scabs right well the communist party

came along

and they said let's get rid of that

let's have anti-racist

unions and let's make the demands of our

strike that black people have the right

to work on the docks in san francisco or

have the right to work in the auto

plants

in detroit and when the communist party

did that and said black and white unite

and fight

the black community suddenly started

supporting the labor movement and not

operating as scabs meanwhile uh

meanwhile at the same time

you had you know the the white workers

uh you know had allies and they were

able to be victorious and

and it was through you know black and

white united fight

putting the needs of the black people at

the front of the labor party

the labor movement's demands that's how

the labor movement was successful it was

understanding that it was in the

economic interest

of the working class to oppose racism uh

that that you know that these

you know these battles were won and that

big victories were won and and black

people got to work on the docks in san

francisco and black people worked in the

auto plants and

you had the very beginnings of the civil

rights movement which the communist

party was part of

um and the understanding was if we can

build solidarity

we can break down racism if the

communist party back in the 1920s and

30s

had had gone to these unions of white

workers

and said to them you all are racist

you're racist you're scum you're racist

you deserve to be poor

the workers would have spit on them and

told them to get out of there right but

it was through

through helping the white workers to

understand that putting the needs of the

black community first was in their

economic interest

and would ultimately benefit all workers

uh that this came through look

the new left the 1960s new left is is

very toxic

okay um the weather underground

uh the weatherman you know the sds bill

ayers bernadine doran

these people that went from being you

know communist revolutionaries who

engaged in left adventurous terrorism

to being like big time democrats and

friends of barack obama

these folks their attitude these people

basically just had a white savior

complex right bill ayers comes from a

billionaire family

he's leader of the weatherman a

billionaire family

you know but in his view right he wanted

to be the white guy who

saved all the black people from the evil

racist white workers right

and that you see that a lot with some of

these you know groups that come out of

the 1960s

they tend to be led by a white guy a

white guy who's from a wealthy

background

who has it in his head that you know he

was sent to earth by god to save the

black people from the evil deplorable

racist whites

right and it's this like this white

savior complex

right that's really what motivates a lot

of the new left remnants they're

very wealthy people who who are at they

see the

the white working class as a bunch of

racist hillbillies and rednecks

and they see black people as just these

victims who couldn't possibly fight for

their own rights

but luckily you know the rich white guy

shows up to save the black people from

the other evil whites and

and that is such a toxic narrative it's

such a toxic narrative

and if the communist party had operated

that way in the 30s they never would

have made any

progress they never would have won great

victories right you look at what

happened in the south when

when the communist party built

interracial labor unions and got you

know white workers to rip up their ku

klux klan cards

and join the communist party instead and

and to stand arm and arm with black

workers it was a totally different

approach

it wasn't about shaming it wasn't about

white privilege it was instead about

building solidarity and understanding

that racism hurts all workers

most especially those who are victims of

it but even those who who benefit from

it slightly in the long term

they are they are hurt by racism that

racism and colonialism

and white chauvinism hurt all

working-class people

um and it should be on the agenda of the

entire working class to eradicate these

things

the way i put it is that those who can

afford

to write people off and simply dismiss

them

and of course those workers were talking

about who were in the sand

of course you could say yes they do

harbor racist tendencies yes there is

something racist about them

but you can only afford to write them

off as racist when you can somehow

find refuge in an establishment

which represents a tiny minority of the

population

that has secured itself against the

majority of the people

you can only afford to skip the part of

actually

winning the masses when you're taking

refuge and hiding behind the

dictatorship of some kind of elite

when all these fake leftists are going

around dismissing all these people as

racists

and deplorables what is what ground are

they standing on to sustain that

they're standing behind the

anti-democratic and anti-popular

elites yeah indeed well listen

um i'm i'm gonna have to probably go

pretty soon

we want to wrap this up uh you know do

you have anything before we go before we

conclude

um we covered so much so okay

i'm not i sure uh we pretty much

touched space and everything i could uh

remember all right well i gotta have you

on one of my streams next i'd love to

i'd love to

you're welcome any time let's put it up

so it was really a pleasure man

i'm really honored to have you on and

i'm honored to be on here right people

have been posting guerrillas in my chat

for the last few weeks

so i'm really excited so yeah let's do

this again sometime always a pleasure uh

it was really great a great conversation

very wide-ranging

uh let's talk again soon okay i'd love

i'm looking forward to it

thank you so much for coming on sure

thing see you later

yep wow guys that was a really nice

conversation

that was fucking crazy

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do

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you