Infrared Collective vs Dharok | InfraredShow Debate
2021-10-20
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""
what up you dumb [Β __Β ]
thank you class 232 appreciate you yeah
shut your ass up bro if you wanted to be
shut the [Β __Β ] up [Β __Β ] you don't [Β __Β ]
set terms and conditions your little
stupid [Β __Β ] shut your [Β __Β ] mouth
bro you don't even know what those
really means you're stupid [Β __Β ] you know
that you're a dumb [Β __Β ] you came in my
[Β __Β ] discord like a stupid [Β __Β ]
talking [Β __Β ] like a dumb [Β __Β ] you're a
[Β __Β ] mediocre unintelligent
unintelligent you have no knowledge you
have no creativity you're a miserable
[Β __Β ] you you have no sense of the beauty
in this world
if you ever say this [Β __Β ] to my face i
knock this [Β __Β ] at you bro
[Β __Β ] shut the [Β __Β ] up [Β __Β ] they're
awful with me shut your eyes [Β __Β ] up
[Β __Β ]
stupid
yeah shut the [Β __Β ] up [Β __Β ]
nice voice changer you [Β __Β ] [Β __Β ]
yeah i messed with the saying sir i
ain't getting [Β __Β ]
am i getting
my job exposure yeah he's got a voice
changer what a [Β __Β ] [Β __Β ] and he had
a voice changer to make himself make
himself sound [Β __Β ] deeper
you're a [Β __Β ] [Β __Β ] what are you bay
area four one five little [Β __Β ]
i got a sensitive job man i like i don't
got i go to the center
[Β __Β ] i got a sensitive job
you're a [Β __Β ]
you're a [Β __Β ] and this is how you sound
without a voice changer i got a
sensitive job i need a sensitive job
don't talk to me and we like knock you
out every time you're not
so you just calling to like say insults
are you actually going to debate or some
[Β __Β ] oh we're going to convict you
we're going to debate all right
we're going to debate all right
by hitting the books and consulting the
evidence now there's something i said in
the past
so in context specifically what did i
say and why did i say it since you're
the expert
i don't like you just like screaming and
[Β __Β ] like so i don't even remember what
you were screaming
did i scream where did you get it from
what video show us the evidence what
youtube video
i don't
know
which youtube video
i don't i don't even see this
you say this [Β __Β ] yourself so why you
keep asking for evidence
you're the one who [Β __Β ] brought it up
you dumb [Β __Β ] you came in my [Β __Β ]
discord trying to back seat soul runner
trying to be a back seat short and be
like um you have to retract this
theoretical position you had in the past
is going to make you look bad in the
future so if you know about my [Β __Β ]
theoretical position why don't you
explain it to us explain what i said
explain my reasoning and why i said it
and explain the ways that i would debate
people about it and justify myself
it's actually really simple it's because
your stupid ass was saying and [Β __Β ] in
uh discord chat and apparently you also
said in the videos that uh
you said like america's socialism yeah
yeah because you brought it up first you
said oh haas six months ago someone's
gonna dig up when he said america was uh
already socialist and and this is gonna
be really bad so he has to walk that
back and retract it well
since you know about what i said and why
i said it in my reasoning and the
context explain it to us or maybe you
don't know any of those [Β __Β ] things
and he just took something i said out of
context and started talking [Β __Β ] on the
discord with a stupid little [Β __Β ]
maybe that's what's going on isn't it
are you saying like a lot of words to be
saying like you like coping right now
because you you're smoking coping you
dumb [Β __Β ] you just i you just heard
something i said nine months ago or
something
you didn't even hear it yourself you
probably heard it from a second-hand
third-hand hand-me-down fourth-hand
sword source just like your wife except
she's 12th hand me down
you you [Β __Β ] used rag hand-me-down
source is what you got you looked for it
then you came in the discord and tried
to backseat show honor us you're trying
to be a backseat showrunner for infrared
and you don't even [Β __Β ] know why i
said what i said or how i justified it
or what my reasoning was or what the
meaning behind it was and you
you think you can backseat show runner
the infrared collective you think you
could be one of us
you think you have what it takes
you think you don't agree with success
you think you know what it takes to grow
this [Β __Β ] you think you understand the
brilliance behind this whole [Β __Β ]
operation you dumb little [Β __Β ]
that's another topic but i can say that
you like running this [Β __Β ] like ass
anyways
anyway why so here's my challenge to you
you little [Β __Β ] [Β __Β ] how much money
you make a year how much money you make
a year
i make like like like 40k something like
that 40k i make more than 40k right now
so if you want to get out of your job
you start a twitch channel you start a
youtube and you build your own brand and
see if you can match our success how
about that derek huh since i'm running
my [Β __Β ] like ass and i'm running a
shitty [Β __Β ] job doing this [Β __Β ] you
should be able to match my success not
only match my success because according
to you that's the result of shitty
management you should be able to do ten
times better than i can [Β __Β ] do like
i don't even i don't even need to deep
do that though because i don't see you
guys because i like i agree with most of
your [Β __Β ] i agree
but i'm trying to be a backstage
showrunner
and you're running your [Β __Β ] like ass
has to walk back house has to walk back
something he said six months ago paz has
to take something back imitate [Β __Β ]
[Β __Β ] everything i've ever said i stand
by it with every fiber and vote in my
body i stand by it
it's you stupid [Β __Β ] people you
stupid [Β __Β ] people just make me be
selective about what i say because you
don't you're the reason why you don't
get all of my brilliance because you're
too stupid to understand what i say but
i'm not walking [Β __Β ] back [Β __Β ]
when you talking to the masses what you
think they're gonna when are you talking
to the masses when you're talking to the
masses the masses already resonate with
the message that we have socialism for
the rich you dumb [Β __Β ] the masses from
the ground up are the ones who created
the slogan that we already have
socialism for the rich the masses go to
the libertarians who say that we live in
socialism because the federal reserve
you don't even know what the [Β __Β ]
masses say the only [Β __Β ] marxist
[Β __Β ] who care about these [Β __Β ]
semantic details are [Β __Β ] nerds in
cities and in universities who are 100
percent disconnected away from the
masses don't [Β __Β ] talk to me about
the massive [Β __Β ] the masses in
their everyday spontaneous instincts
already agree with what i said
that's not even like semantics though
you've got to be able to already agree
with me they already agree we have
socialism for the rich they already
agree we are already living in socialism
when you tell them about socials and
they go oh so just like the post office
and just like you know fire trucks fire
state
they need something real they that's not
that's already how they think it's you
nerds who [Β __Β ] it all up and went now
they now
transactionism is paradise on earth it's
going to be a perfect thing
shut the [Β __Β ] up
are you talking like i'm bread too with
something [Β __Β ] you are bread soup you
are [Β __Β ] bread tube
stupid bro man you stupid you're using a
[Β __Β ] voice changer because you're too
scared to use your real voice cause you
sound like a little [Β __Β ]
i got a job on like you though so like
now
i'm doing a shitty job managing my [Β __Β ]
and you're qualified enough to backseat
showrunner me and be a showrunner once
you match my [Β __Β ] success because i'm
already making more money than you you
do a year i'm already making more money
monthly than you do so if i'm doing such
a bad [Β __Β ] job you match my success
i like i'm trying to give you guidance
sitting like i'm trying to help i need
your guidance tell me why i need your
[Β __Β ] guidance
because you growing too slow you ain't
you should be i'm going through
really
yeah after six months i'm at 600 average
viewers that's too slow
all right you could be doing a lot
better you could be getting like so you
do it so you do it like i got like why
so you [Β __Β ] do it
you're gonna tell me to retract
something i said in the past
you're gonna tell me to retract my own
statements
when i stand by it more than i ever did
before if anything the only thing i
retract
is now if anything back then
theoretically and intellectually i was a
hundred percent more superior than i am
now now i had to adjust myself to dumb
[Β __Β ] like you
just to save energy and time
i had to become more stupid just so
stupid [Β __Β ] like you
wouldn't talk to me
because i hate it when you talk to me i
hate it when you nitpick the things i
said you do stupid to understand what i
say
all right then hello with the definition
then so when you said america socialist
you meant like you meant like america's
like social for the rich that's what
your definition was
where did you hear that i said america
is socialist first of all where did you
hear it
uh like
like all your show runners is like say
that's and they say that the show is
following where
show runners where
uh
i'll search it not who where did you
hear that statement
uh in the discord okay
like maybe like a week ago
okay show us the relevant statement
all right i'm reading through these like
these dms and people are saying america
is already socialist america's socialist
okay so that's where you first saw it
right where did you first see it give us
that
in your discord other side that's like
the accepted
the accepted uh
definition is people like saying
america's socialist because they they
follow your views and apparently that's
what you think so when did you hear this
link the relevant link
like how is that even relevant like it's
relevant because we have to understand
what did you see that justifies what you
you're what you're saying right now
because you clearly didn't read enough
because all these questions you're
asking me now the 21 questions you're
asking me now
i've clarified in a billion times in the
past
all right fine right now thousands and
thousands of times i've clarified it
direct
so clearly you heard it somewhere you
didn't hear it from me because if you
heard it from me you wouldn't be able to
take my [Β __Β ] out of context
everyone was looking the video before
which video you said it in somebody
linked that [Β __Β ]
uh which that's not where you heard it
from
you didn't hear it from our video the
meaning of socialism in 2021
well your own show runners linked that
saying that's where you said it so yeah
but that's not where you heard it
you first brought it up dumbass you
first came and said hans has to retract
what he said as he grows or it's going
to hurt his audience i'm going to even
triple down on it as soon as i get
average 2 000 viewers that's when i'm
gonna really triple down on it i can't
talk about it now or i can't say it
openly all the time now because a dumb
[Β __Β ] like you just always give me a
hard time and make me waste energy
explaining it to you so when i'm 2000
viewers you bet you bet i'm gonna triple
quadruple down on that [Β __Β ]
barlock you know that's like a dumb ass
take that's gonna no it's not a [Β __Β ]
dumbass take you're a dumb [Β __Β ] yourself
like you're gonna alienate people in in
your audience
who
like
because you trying to get rid of the
person am i going to alienate by saying
that who
the people that want to see like america
change like one by one i want them to
suck my talk how about that
and i'm telling them that now
all the people you're saying i'm going
to alienate one by one kiss my ass suck
my [Β __Β ]
in a line congo line
tomorrow to form a congo line from here
to the other side of the country
one by one
then you're gonna like you're gonna
crash and burn with this [Β __Β ] man yeah
it's gonna be scary
that's what everyone always tells me
they've been telling me that this whole
time still hasn't happened
you're a gatekeeper you're the [Β __Β ]
reason socialism never gonna become
popular among the masses as of right now
you're the main reason marxists can't
talk to the masses have no connection to
the masses because you have your own
gatekeeping little bitch-ass subculture
why don't you go watch jason on rouhey
or fellow traveler or some [Β __Β ]
with all those gatekeepers go watch them
nah did you write you write about like
american patriotism just every time you
like you gotta you gotta get better
definitions for some of y'all no it
takes no you don't because no you don't
because it's gonna end people no it's
gonna alienate people as you're going
and telling them oh we're going to
create a completely new system from
scratch
what the hell is that
that that's never exist what what
example what precedent is there for that
and and we cited the the actual text we
cited marx and engels we cited lenin
to back us up we take like that citation
though that nothing will change it'll
just be the same damn system and nothing
like
you ain't building any kind of
revolution you know what what's
dialectics tell me what dialectics is
it's one two no such thing as the same
damn system that system you're talking
about has internal contradictions which
are recurringly transforming that system
into something else into its opposite
that's dialectics there's no such thing
as the same damn system
the same damn system collapses and
transforms under the weight of its own
internal contradictions that's
dialectics if you upholding the state as
the way it currently is you ain't being
there what do you guys need to see
you ain't being there what does it mean
what does that mean what does that mean
well it won't mean
as it currently is as it currently is is
changing the only thing that is is
what's changing yeah we change it to
like a rent your economy which is like
no which is like
super capitalism or something hey no
such thing as super capitalism it's
called socialism
and the whole point is that socialists
are the ones who need to oversee this
transformation because the current
liberal order and the current
capitalists in power are unable to
oversee this transformation and
revolution and the forces of production
that's the point they're unable to
oversee this transformation only
socialists and only communists can
properly oversee it because only we know
about the system that's arriving from
the future to paraphrase angles
then like they're like you're making it
seem like there's going to be a red tier
capitalism or a new feudal capital
whatever they call it it's going to be
some system that works there's no such
system what you're talking about is a
superstructure that's in contradiction
with the base
why is the rent here i'll tell you why
there's rent here because marginal costs
are decreasing at zero because of super
abundance because of automation because
of things like that abundance man like
food price is going up i can barely feed
myself anymore and you're saying yeah
but we still live in abundance
that's the irony isn't it
i get i guess it depends what your
definition of abundance is but i don't
see that [Β __Β ] production is
fundamentally socialized to such an
extent
that it's no longer braced on any kind
of free market prices it's set by these
super monopolies artificially and it's
set at the very top by the government in
the form of the federal reserve and
interest rates
we don't have a currency that's backed
by gold and gold is what crystallizes
labor power it's based on fiat which
means we basically live in a centrally
planned economy
especially since the government
coordinates and works with the top
biggest corporations as few as they are
to coordinate plans for the future of
the economy now do they do a good job of
it no they do a shitty job of it because
we don't have socialists in power unlike
in china
but the system has fundamentally changed
yes it has
then how would you distinguish yourself
from being different from like liberals
and stuff if you if you're gonna like
uphold the same economic system that
they're they're magical because we
understand the system better than they
do that's how
then then you should like you know how
to deal with the system you should be
better than you're going to tell how how
you change things because i like things
are already changing change is not a
problem change is not a problem
things already changing there's no issue
with change
nobody's gotta force any changes things
are already changing there are like good
changes and bad changes though and
that's what you've got change is the
default that's what you've got to
understand that there are bad changes
and we're going for some bad changes and
you and we
there are changes period
the bad changes are because our
political rulers and our establishment
and our ruling class doesn't know how to
cope with these changes so a lot of bad
things are resulting from that
what communists are going to say is we
know how to cope with these changes we
know how to properly transition we know
how to ensure people can have secure
jobs and secure livelihoods and we can
cope with all these changes that are
going on and
make it so that we benefit from it and
it doesn't destroy us all
right you sound like andrew yang right
now i don't give a [Β __Β ]
andrew yang is more popular than any of
the [Β __Β ] stupid small sect of
dogmatic gatekeepers that you following
i don't really following those people
i'm just saying that andrew yang never
was a challenge to the establishment he
never formed he never fomented a
challenge against the military
industrial complex the special interests
the corporations and the democratic
party machine so that's why andrew
yang's a [Β __Β ] it's not because he
wasn't communist or socialist enough in
his views about the economy it's because
on the ground when it came to political
strategy and tactics he wasn't
anti-establishment enough he wasn't as a
big threat to the people in power
even so it doesn't sound like you got
any ideas either of what we did yes i do
yes i do
all right you talking like rhetoric but
you ain't like got like solid policies
that we got to be back in
i have solid strategies that we could be
pursuing ain't no issue with policies a
lot of people got good policies
the issue was strategy the issue is what
kind of people should be reaching out to
and how do you resolve the current class
political contradictions when it comes
to political strategy
uh you just sound like you want to be
like the president or something but and
you don't just want to be on top so i
don't give a where do i go [Β __Β ] how long
you've been watching
like me
month or something so you've been
watching me for a month you buffed it in
kicked down the door and decided you're
going to micromanage and backseat police
and backseat run the show right
i got people who've been watching me
since january
who don't have that all day racism you
sound like too fragile i'm giving you
constructive criticism
the only thing you're giving me is
content for the show you're giving me
constructive criticism
what's there to construct
i'm trying to help you with your
rhetoric
because your rhetoric ain't gonna bite
people over from the left it's just
okay well i don't want people from the
left [Β __Β ] the left [Β __Β ] the entire left
i don't want them how about that
i don't want them i feel like if you
want the right then you've got to at
least like why you even call yourself a
communist because you know that's like
not about ideologies and it's not about
political spectrums i'm a communist with
a capital c you can keep your dumbass
[Β __Β ] uh
fake american politics i want to attract
the right kind of people i don't care
where they came from i don't give a [Β __Β ]
about gatekeeping leftists they failed
to reach the masses they already failed
you snooze you lose what do i want to
collect a bunch of losers
leftists are losers you think i want a
bunch of losers
all right that's fair but like you gotta
at least capture the writing i don't
think you're gonna be able to do that
either captured a lot of right wingers a
lot of right wingers watched me a lot of
right wingers became communists because
of me matter of fact
a lot of apolitical people watch me a
lot of muslim people watch me a lot of
religious people watch me
like give a [Β __Β ] about american leftist
i mean i still think you could like do a
lot better but i think oh okay you then
you
but like
what does that mean what does that mean
like you got like energy and stuff that
i just don't got so why don't you stop
backseat
why don't you stop backseat managing my
show
i'm just saying like you should be doing
more like irl stuff and you you need to
be getting views like a lot more you
should be getting you need to be like
uploading youtube videos of you like
doing like uh stephen hawking no it's
stephen hawk why are you what do you
what is this big what does this concern
you
you backseat managing my show for what
because i think i think you could be
like the next lenin in america but you
gotta you gotta do some reforming you
gotta like get some things straight you
feel me and what do you mean by stephen
hawking
all right stephen crowder you know you
like the public debate means and stuff
you know you got to get a lot of youtube
views and then you got to get them over
to streaming that's how you guys
like blow up and views but like right
now i don't need your advice
if i needed
maybe your advice would be useful when
we had one views
only after we become successful you
barged in and decided
where were you when we had one of you
where did you when we had one view where
did you where were you
where were you in 20 2020 when no one
knew who the [Β __Β ] we were where were you
where were you
now you come when we're successful you
give me advice
i wouldn't say you're there yet but you
getting there but you you ain't gonna
survive if you don't change somebody
okay then what let me let us worry about
that
yeah but like i still change your voice
to something else we're getting bored of
this voice changing something else what
would you mean change my voice i like i
ain't get fired from a job
change it to a different accent and a
different uh
uh
make it higher pitches at a lower pitch
all right let's try to change some [Β __Β ]
real quick
he's working on it
he's working on it
he said he's working on it
[Music]
he said he's working on it
okay i don't know why you can't just use
voice mode
the hell is that
are you fine with this
yeah yeah that's better
all right
i don't really remember what we were
saying before
yeah this more realistic
what were we talking about again
we're talking about the fact is that
your real accent
what's your name
that's your real accent you're not
making faking your accent
are you stupid are you stupid
are you faking uh
trying to sound like something you're
not
i don't even know what you mean by that
i i thought you already i already
changed my voice you think you started
was like too high or something
yeah yeah
so what what's your job that's so
special you're too scared
like why are you trying like you like
just ask that like why are you trying to
like knock me and [Β __Β ] i'm not trying to
dock [Β __Β ]
say you wearing a work in a warehouse
that's not enough that's not information
you can't talk about what your job is
when i ever say i was working in a
warehouse
okay so you work for the fbi
no no
yeah work for the fbi come and give me
stupid advice so you can take my channel
uh that's [Β __Β ] stupid like you're
being like paranoid now but i'm just
saying
i'm just like i'm not even giving you
like toxic like advice or anything i'm
just trying to say things that'll help
out your channel you're saying [Β __Β ]
that's helping me out
now what you like could you talk to a
[Β __Β ] to be doing like irl videos
really
what am i gonna do i'm already going to
a haunted house this weekend
i meant like politics videos you gotta
like me what do you mean change my mind
videos like politics clickbait and like
[Β __Β ] like that
watch
talk to one of the college students
college food is boring as [Β __Β ]
oh so like you don't think you can make
it interesting or something no they're
boring and they're awkward
well if you just gotta talk to people on
debates you ain't gonna grow like this
man yeah yeah you could do that
you could like even look at destiny he's
been around like for like eight years
and he just sits on his ass and plays
[Β __Β ] uh league of legends don't use
destiny as an example yeah he just plays
games sitting on the he sits on his
chair playing video games
man you do like the same [Β __Β ] as he does
no i don't
i you do you doing like computer debates
and you basically make the same content
you've been here for like eight years
and he's got like three thousand viewers
average right you didn't know about that
does the same [Β __Β ] too
he doesn't even debate he just sits on
his computer reacts
that's true but i sound built up a base
first and he was doing other stuff like
what
i think i think he did like ira
maybe
didn't don't don't quote me on that
i think he got that from like the young
turks viewers or something yeah he got
everything from young turks exactly
he got everything from young turks
well i'm just trying to help you out now
you don't got to be so like toxic and
[Β __Β ]
no you're not helping me out
i'll be able to help you out more than
[Applause]
and probably more than at least alex you
got like some dungeons
alex are you here you want to come
debate him
we'll see well let's put it to the test
let's have alex come and debate you how
about that
uh what are we thinking debate about i
just know he says
you know more about marxism than him
right
yeah well we'll see
let's see if he wants to get on
he might not let's see if he's still
online
what time is it in germany
uh you gotta wake up his parents i'm not
sure
oh he needs a minute
okay he needs a minute he's coming
alex is coming
any one of my showrunners can pick their
teeth with you
at least you gotta like handle like a
fair debate like a debate model or
something
and we gotta get like a debate topic
down so he doesn't dish down after me so
what's happening what's up what topic
you want to debate about
uh like anything related to marxism i
gotta get down his definition of marxism
because like well let's talk about that
we'll talk about that
what is marxism we'll talk about what is
marxism
it's like a dictatorship of the
proletariat yeah no we're not we're
gonna debate we're gonna see you're to
debate about it
that's exactly what we're going to
debate about
i think this this guy's scared he's not
scared he just needs a second
he's on the phone with your girl right
now
man i see his real face he a [Β __Β ] i'd
slap the [Β __Β ] out of his dumb ass
really what do you look like
i i'm big as hell i like bench like 190.
you bench 190 yeah
betcha 1986
i'll do reps of 225 10 reps
190. that's the flex i go to the gym
like once every two weeks
it's kilograms right you mean kilograms
oh you mean pounds
you're going to the
you bench like every day and you're only
doing like 35 pounds more than you
talking [Β __Β ] yeah i do 10 reps you could
only the match you can do is 190. the
[Β __Β ] is that
you're not big how how are you big
i'm 210 i'm too gay i way too tad
i dropped i dropped most people
all right alex is here
we're going to moderate a debate so the
debate's about who knows more about
marxism
hello alex
yeah
yeah okay
so this guy's talking a lot of [Β __Β ]
about you
i only heard one thing
[Β __Β ]
he said he knows more about marxism than
you
yeah
how how do you come to that yeah his
voice is trembling this shit's sad all
right
4am in germany shut the [Β __Β ] up he lost
her nah it's four yeah
it's 4am in germany
you sound like a chipmunk dude what um
what are you saying
you want you want me to change my voice
for some reason i don't know why but
this is how we're going to debate about
it
but you know you know more about marxism
right
uh-huh
so you can set the stage if you are
it you claim to know more about me and
more than me
hello
he he's he's sounding like a [Β __Β ] he's
not talking
he's not talking
alvin where are you
the hell is he doing
derek
this dude said he weighs 210 and he can
only bench 190. you can't even bench
your own weight you're trying to use
that as a flex
dude where is c it's three [Β __Β ] a.m
i didn't mute him
is he muted
no he's not muted
what the hell happened
he got scared when you came on
dude that stuff that's a [Β __Β ]
disappointment
i just got out of bed
the [Β __Β ] is he doing
and nobody can hear you
nobody muted you shut the [Β __Β ] up
you're literally scared to debate alex
nobody muted you i'm looking at the
checks right now
you're not server muted you're not
deafened you're not muted no mod muted
you
this dude's [Β __Β ] lying he's
pretending to be muted because he's
scared to debate alex
my [Β __Β ] god
saying he got muted
come on derek
i'm gonna drag him in and out
here
hello
hello
his his thing is lighting up but i can't
hear [Β __Β ]
yeah
the [Β __Β ] happened
he choked on his mic he got scared
said he's checking his mic
the [Β __Β ] is this
who said he's checking his mic
nobody [Β __Β ] muted you stop making
[Β __Β ] up
if we muted he's still saying he's muted
there is no sign next to your name
i would see a red mic if you were in
muted there is no red mic
dude saying he's muted
one of us didn't
really i can literally send you a
screenshot
we have proof his [Β __Β ] is not muted
he probably muted himself in the program
i guess so
did you try restarting the voice changer
maybe that's it why don't you turn off
the voice changer
or restart
it the [Β __Β ] did you leave
let's see if he comes back
it's always these [Β __Β ] mics
[Music]
you know what i legit think this is
someone who we banned before like some
old of someone
and that's why he's using a word changer
i have no idea who who would they be
i don't know
he said he has a sensitive job maybe his
bay area
yeah it could be bay area honestly
i asked where you went
i'm going to restart my pc because
nothing wrong in the mic software oh
[Β __Β ]
why just you gotta restart his pc
hey hurry up
if you're wondering i hope he's got an i
hope he got a solid state drive
if you want to become a showrunner your
mic needs to work
that's the minimum condition and where
the [Β __Β ] is maya maya said she's gonna
come debate too
it's tuesday someone ping maya
someone pinged my i almost banned her
yesterday
you wanted to ban her
yeah
for what
she was being annoying to me
she's not even online
why the [Β __Β ] does she wake up at 1am
that's how you know she probably doesn't
even live in america
she she literally wakes up at like 2 a.m
fair i had those faces too where i just
woke up at 1 hour or two a.m
yeah but
i think maya's literally a cia agent
i think she's trolling 100 percent
not so sure about derek where i thought
he was trolling too i literally thought
he was just larping as a trot but
that he came here actually surprised me
seems to be serious
sadly
yeah
he said uh he said we have to retract
our early statements if we want to grow
yeah i saw that he's so [Β __Β ] stupid
we literally had to dumb our show down
so [Β __Β ] much just so people like him
stop bothering us
[Music]
you are this guy who said like uh what
did you say wait i asked you for a marks
quote and you gave me a [Β __Β ] quora
link
that guy was a phd in marxism though so
yeah okay let's we're gonna moderate the
debate let's go let's begin the debate
for a mars quotation give me a [Β __Β ]
quarrel link
yeah he had a phd though like he wasn't
messing
i don't give a [Β __Β ] i wipe my ass with
people's phds
literally getting phds is the easiest
thing in life
to like uh interpret it and i got you i
got you a marxist philosopher
uh no
you said
i'm looking
i'm i said i'm still waiting for the
quote you said marx never said that
idealism was incompatible with
materialism i asked you where yeah
that's right that's right you gave me a
quarrel link yeah where did mark say
where did mark say that they're not
incompatible
no uh
i couldn't i couldn't find the link but
i read it one time
yeah so you know more okay
let's let's do this debate who knows
more about marxism let's just start it
now forget about the past we're going to
start it now
let's
uh i think i think before we get into
this we gotta define uh where our main
disagreements were because then that'll
show that really uh how he says like the
meat and potatoes of what we're trying
to get down to
so you
[Β __Β ] you'd claim you know more about me
so you know where to disagree
where do you disagree with me
if you know so much
for instance we talked about marx's
materialism
he said
it's competitive
yeah that's that's one that's marxism
101 though that shit's too easy so yeah
so is the other thing okay if it's easy
you can disprove me
you know easily it's like because you
gotta look at it like how like
schopenhauer thought about it like
the things that happened all that has to
do with this we're talking about mark's
materialism are we not
yeah but i'm just
man let me talk you you [Β __Β ]
interrupted me already it has ain't
doing anything to
to stop that but anyway
because i would burst out laughing
because your voice is so [Β __Β ] okay
you guys want allocated time we could do
allocated time two minutes each
yeah that sounds good okay so who wants
to go first
derek there go first you get two minutes
all right so
when we think about schopenhauer we
gotta think about we gotta think about
what he meant when he was talking about
idealism and materialism being
compatible with one another and this is
something marx thought too
and when we look at schopenhauer's uh
thoughts on idealism basically the
material is uh
things that might happen to us and [Β __Β ]
like from like our outside sources
like the outside sources that affect our
life is basically materialism
our determinism if you want to call it
that and the way we respond to the world
with our brain is basically idealism
because the thoughts we have
that can manifest in reality and become
materialism so
so the things that happen to us are not
controllable by idealism but the things
that we output are uh idealism and it's
compatible it makes them compatible with
one another and marks off the same thing
so
so we shouldn't be like making an
economic system around materialism
itself but also about
uh idealism which is why having policies
is so important
and there's something else that i want
to say about this that is not coming to
my mind right now but it's very
important and ties into the whole
arch type uh
combination of all things that we have
to look at we how we have to look at our
world
basically
and i've really studied on this
so i think
so i have a lot of uh
interesting insights 15 seconds
i got a lot of interesting insights that
we gotta
that we gotta use and not just be
complete dogmatic people and and you
know and things like rhetoric matter too
and that's why we can't just be like
you're up you're up
all right alex it's your turn go
okay i have no [Β __Β ] idea why the [Β __Β ]
you bring out schopenhauer and how he
conceived materialism in a deal isn't so
[Β __Β ] irrelevant because
schopenhauer's understanding of
materialism and idealism respectively is
not the same as marx's understanding of
it
so i don't know why you bring this up
from you essentially say nothing at all
and i didn't really hear the rest i was
laughing at your voice and so on and so
on
the fact of the matter is that marx and
engels uh
distanced themselves or not they
critiqued a german idealism and the
younger germans especially
and put forward their materialist
conception of history
in the first place why would they talk
about materialism if they were not
hardcore materialists
why would they and later lenin
criticize idealism vehemently
why did lenin for example explicitly say
that materialism is incompatible with
the idealist view and you would
argue this in his
criticis criticism of imperial criticism
this book that you wrote
doesn't
everyone understood him
how can you say one when this dude is
like completely discounted chopin now
and basically had a house shut the [Β __Β ]
up about schopenhauer when we're talking
about this is a debate about marxism not
schopenhauer
yeah but children came before hegel he
inspired the whole thing and he [Β __Β ]
didn't schopenhauer was a [Β __Β ] angry
bitter [Β __Β ] incel who was raging all
day about hegel's success and he thought
hegel uh he deserved to be successful
instead of hegel so shut the [Β __Β ] up
about so no one gives a [Β __Β ] about
schopenhauer
talking about marxism right now
yeah but if you ignore the things that
preceded marxism you're gonna have yeah
but
didn't influence any marks
schopenhauer did not influence marxism
even if schrodinger preceded marx you
don't understand that marx had a new
understanding of materialism he
distinguishes his
specific materialism from the hitherto
materialism which he alex you know
what's funny too is schopenhauer didn't
even say the [Β __Β ] this guy is saying
he'd even say that he's combining
idealism and material he's just making
that up
when did schopenhauer say he's going to
combine materialism and idealism
it's not you know you have to understand
like what you're doing right now what
schopenhauer said is the form right but
it's the essence of what he's saying
that really matters and with a thing oh
you don't understand that [Β __Β ]
materialism and idealism
isn't about rejecting form and rejecting
content or one or the other it's about
the site of determination and the site
of essence materialism gives precedence
to materiality as the site of
determination materialism also
conceives the material as the site of
the essence
idealism does the reverse
so the fact that thoughts
are relate to reality the way form
relates to content doesn't mean you're
combining idealism and materialism
so you're saying you can't think about
things that are outside reality
no because it's part of reality it's not
outside stupid that's [Β __Β ]
you [Β __Β ] don't even understand
marxism 101 alex was right you don't
even know the fact that according to
marx and angles you're supposed to
change your view of what reality is in
the first place
when that happens just to say it's
outside of reality the point is you
change what you consider real in the
first place
and what's real what you your knowledge
of what's real is always evolving and
always developing
that's why they said ideas are material
they have a material basis because they
are part of reality
but you know more about marxism why did
his mic break again so like sort of like
no i've got one if idealism is so
outdated to you and it's not compatible
with mars and then why is the science
community uh broadly accepting
physicalism community [Β __Β ] the science
community
i [Β __Β ] all the warm moms all of their
moms all their sisters i [Β __Β ] the
science community
i wiped my ass with your phd
but they already prove that there are
things that are outside material
what's outside of reality what is
outside of reality
that you can like look at like the
double slit experiment
is anything outside of reality you don't
know what the [Β __Β ] you're talking about
yes because it shows that no they're
talking about the properties of real
they're not saying it's outside of
reality
you're talking about that no there are
things in reality that that we can't
actually
like detect or know about or
that's not what the doubles that's not
what the double slit experiment is about
if anything you should be talking about
dark matter and dark energy which is
basically and here's dark matter dark
energy it's if our mathematical
formulations don't add up we have to add
magical variables and call them dark
matter and dark energy
just because their [Β __Β ] equations
don't add up they call dark energy and
dark matter
i feel like we fundamentally like
disagree on what reality is so i feel
like this is like okay what's reality
i feel like this is a dead topic because
we can't we just fundamentally
you were supposed to have a [Β __Β ]
debate about who knows more about
marxism and you just started [Β __Β ]
talking about schopenhauer because we
need to talk about policies or something
so someone can actually look stupid here
because we just disagree on fundamentals
what do you want to debate him about
cause he said
like this is one of the dumbasses that
said like
he said like america was socialist he
was one of the people that said that so
i i
would understood now you downplay it you
don't play it
when did i say that oh you pretend you
didn't say that
i'm not pretending i didn't say that i
want to know in which case
it doesn't matter what what does it
matter
absolutely matter because i didn't make
this claim randomly
hello
does mike break again no i'm not gonna
break i'm trying to look up
like like why can't you why can't you
just come out and just say if you if you
think that or not why do i have to go
and go through it i have understood what
we meant by saying yeah okay socialist
so if you claim understood what we meant
explain it
what was the context why did we say it
in first place
are any other showrunners online
if any showrunners are watching just get
in
what you said that [Β __Β ] don't matter
tell me right now
what what is america's economic system
do you want because i because this will
say everything
so are you looking for a quote still
are you done are you gonna give me a
quarter are you ignoring me
he's ignoring me
what is this it's though
whoa
he didn't just he didn't hear a single
one thing i don't even know what a
system is you dumb [Β __Β ]
what's a system
a system is how i
okay how the economics work
do they work in a way that's internally
contradictory that makes them transform
into their opposite or do they just
reproduce themselves
you need to have an opposite but right
now we don't have to worry about the
[Β __Β ] opposite it's not [Β __Β ] worse
things work
we could literally quote angles right
now small enterprises become their
opposite in the form of let's let's quit
the quote from angles right now let's
just get the quote
let me just say something wrong
and scientific
so socialism and scientific socialism
utopian and scientific we're renocal
angles right now
and the production without any definite
all right here it is
here it is
here it is
you ready
in the trusts freedom of competition
changes into its very opposite into
monopoly and the production without any
definite plan of capitalistic society
capitulates to the production upon a
definite plan of the invading
socialistic society that's what angel
said he didn't say you add the opposite
he said it just happens imminently
that don't mean you write about
everything you have to you have to yeah
he was right about he was right angles
was right
but like see like that's like controlled
opposition talking because you ain't
gonna change the system if you don't
create the anticipation
it's already changing
it's already changing
it's not gonna
are you telling me you're disagreeing
with angles you who know so much about
mark
no you shut the [Β __Β ] up you know nothing
about marxism yeah you because you the
type you the top that would be like
london was because he had some different
ideas that he would be like
he would be a revisionist or something
i'm just saying that we haven't
wanted to claim he was a revisionist i
know you're thinking your thinking would
lead to that type of thinking
you're thinking like
the way you just responded to that quote
like that very like orthodox
marxism take that that leads to like
revisionism you would think that lenin
is
with that type of thing yeah it is no it
doesn't what lenin said is the
form of marxism has to change but not
the essence
lenin said
to avoid revisionism the form of marxism
has to change but the essence remains
the same
but now you're making me forget about
things i was about to respond to
something about that about that very
thing you just said
man you don't know [Β __Β ] about anything
i'm just saying that the top of your
thinking is like it's controlled
opposition
controlled opposition
yeah the bourgeoisie are the synthesis
the working class needs to rise up and
be the antithesis so there can be a
synthesis of what the hell are you
talking about
yeah you don't understand because it's
like idealist but
no you don't know what the [Β __Β ]
don't use technology to change it but
other than that it's still the same
oh that ain't true this system is
already breaking down as we speak
yeah that's because
that's like that's not just because of
it
you don't think [Β __Β ] is breaking down
yeah
shit's complicated but like he wasn't
any kind of revolutionary thing he was
like a [Β __Β ] new york billionaire
businessman anyway so like he's part of
the same system and the same people that
uh
that are destroying the working class
you don't know what the [Β __Β ] you talking
about and basically basically from your
theory is that
we don't got to do nothing and the
system will just tell us
i said we're already doing something
we're already doing something that's
what you don't get
it's not about whether we do something
or not it's about what we do because
we're already doing something so what do
we do
but you talk like the system is going to
change whether we do something or not it
is
so then why you can call yourself a
socialist it's just a dead end
the way it changes it might not be
harmonious with our lives and with our
reality with our uh way of life
but you see you got back into rhetoric
again you still don't have any policies
that would have yeah what's your
policies
all right
for one thing we can't do anything
unless we get rid of the bourgeoisie and
i'm sure you disagree you could you
disagree with that there's got there
just got to be
yeah do some things like
we got we gotta completely abolish wage
labor we gotta abolish this okay what
else do we abolish we gotta pay
everybody the same wages we gotta get
the same way
we need to collect it collectively
collect everybody's work like uh working
production and then barter it off on the
international marketplace so we can
why
yeah that's [Β __Β ] stupid why would we
do that
because you know if ever because first
we we gotta build up more power you know
if a revolution happens we're gonna be a
weak country and we have to said we have
to sell all of our means of production
on the international market yes i'm so
sure what we have nothing
we gotta do the same thing and we gotta
bring back we gotta bring them back in
uh
industrialization from china so we don't
gotta rely on them and then once we
build up that base that we gotta how are
you gonna do that when you sold all the
technology on the international market
i'm not saying i'm saying sell our
production so we can
so we can make profit first
but but that's well everyone just paid
so how are you going to revive industry
well we we got it we got the profit that
we make from borrowing off the
international marketplace would go back
to reindustrialization we got to reverse
uh richard nixon's policies that well
i've
basically given all our uh
industry to china
and then once we build up that base we
can actually start furthering uh
internationally how are our prices going
to be competitive on the world market if
all wages are going to be paid the same
no well the thing is it's like it's like
ooby right it's
like you're basically
redistributing the wealth from the rich
national bourgeoisie and you're giving
and you're like paying everybody the
same but you're not like ripping off
like international
uh people in the markets what the hell
it makes like it makes no difference
what how much money the international
people are paying it's just affecting
the national people exactly it's the
difference because there's competition
on the international markets for
products
no it doesn't matter because i'm saying
the profit that would that the
brutalizing make in the national state
is going to be it's going to be
redistributed to the lower class
so what you mean so what
the how is that profit going to be
readers they're not going to have any
profit to begin with
but are you stupid or something oh
really i'm not
exactly each think about like how much
let's get into the details let's get
into the details
how are you going to pay everybody the
same wage
well you you've got to think about how
much like a doctor's paid
you you're not giving him that 400 000
paycheck anymore he's working for like
he's working for like seventy thousand
dollars a year just like everybody else
is
not gonna get everybody to get 70k
what
right that they don't the math don't
check out it's not going to be a 70 70
is that how much would everybody make a
year if everyone was paid equally let's
see
how i better be a lot bigger than that
if everyone was paid to know more about
marxism
marx literally talked about the wealth
was evenly distributed oh this was in
america
you got to remember that cayman islands
do there's like 40 trillion dollars that
are stored on offshore accounts so
there's a lot more money in the economy
that they telling you
like about bezos ain't the richest man
i'm telling you that [Β __Β ] right now that
that's like controlled opposition
[Β __Β ] saying like
like elon musk and jeff bezos is the
richest people that should just ain't
true
like all americans if we were actually
redistributing money would be like
millionaires
what
the hell are you doing
what you mean what i'm talking about you
full of [Β __Β ]
you never heard about the the papers the
paramount papers and [Β __Β ]
where all that money go there
it would be it would be around fifty
thousand a year
depending on my paypal assuming it's
even possible it would be fifty thousand
a year you see this one time i eat this
this dude's saying that panama papers
aren't real so that's trillion dollars
in offshore accounts that he's just
pretending don't exist they made sure
that that was about going after russia
it had nothing to do with the usa had it
was about going after russia anyway
so you're saying oh how are you going to
make everyone uh how are you going to
equalize all the wages who's paying
these wages out where's the money coming
from how's how is it going to work
[Music]
let me ask you something
about the soviet union were they paying
people the same wage because uh they
were they
no they were
[Β __Β ] no they were the soviet union had
more inequality than america
yeah you think about like the 80s and
stuff no the whole time they had more
inequality than the usa yeah why do you
think people were going through like
america and western europe and shits
because they wanted more money to be
adopted and stuff because they were
tired
you still had uh paid disparities that
were way higher in the soviet union
i should just ain't trying to never paid
everybody the same [Β __Β ] what are you
talking about this [Β __Β ]
what up hell do you mean pay everyone
the same wage
i do the same thing in cuba too
no they don't
oh
you did not just say ever i got a sauce
right on my hand no they don't pay
everybody the same well what the [Β __Β ]
are you talking about yeah i got a i had
a bbc article right here and that talks
about that talks about the cuban economy
okay let's link it
let's get the meat and potatoes
this dude don't got [Β __Β ]
your mic broke again
yeah i'm looking for it
and where did she go
how one second
we're waiting
man you're full of [Β __Β ]
you still here
hello
yeah i can't find this this other
problem is i don't exist
no i can i can explain it to you though
it doesn't exist
i can explain to you how this [Β __Β ] works
not everybody gets paid the same so
basically like taxi drivers like
everybody in cuba wants to be a taxi
driver because they paying people you
make a lot more money than everybody
else does because because they privatize
their economy there in like the in
something
everybody
no they don't
you just make more as a taxi driver
because
[Applause]
no foreign stupid no you like you didn't
like really
the industries that we have built up in
america were created under capitalism
how are we gonna [Β __Β ] turn them into
uh you're gonna nationalize all the
everything
yeah that's exactly what cuba did no
that's not what i mean
built [Β __Β ] from scratch just like it's
over you can build it from scratch how
are you gonna you're gonna nationalize
walmart amazon all these companies right
yeah just like you know it's all gonna
be government employees
the government's going to imagine that
manage everything exactly
yeah so what about there's so
target and walmart are they going to
turn into the same thing you're just
going to get rid of one keep the other
well ideally they'd all be changed into
the like
the difference
in burger king can it all emerge into
one
yeah their brands would be like removed
like you would completely remove the
brand you'd keep the stores but
everything would be like state-owned
these would be like state-owned
enterprises
so
one so you're saying one institution the
state is gonna manage all of this [Β __Β ]
you don't see a problem with that
no you can it doesn't
what if the institution fails
there's no there's no there's no one to
uh there's no way to diversify the risk
it's too big to fail that's not gonna
work
we mean that there's somebody to
diversify the risk you have you have
regional directors for everything we
live in the america we live in the
united states like we already have like
regional districts to control these
things and don't gotta be that one
one
institution that controls the entire
economy
yeah that doesn't make any sense
that's not possible
show me in the world where that's
possible
now because i think
in the world
and enterprises
i got a video here that you need to look
at and so you can actually see how that
bro you're debating us right now [Β __Β ]
your video
i mean you like you're criticizing like
cuba's under umbrella goes and they they
run on the same system that i propose
except just now lately that they allowed
more products
changing their system because they don't
work no more
so don't use cuba as a model to [Β __Β ]
emulate when they're emulating china now
because they know that they're gonna
report the system you [Β __Β ] stupid man
i'm not embargo and [Β __Β ] and yeah
they're still gonna reform their system
yeah that's why they have to reform it
though they were filming it because and
you know that the reforms aren't even
working like uh like you said
they got to do something
cuba's health care is going down because
all the people would rather be taxi
drivers and be working these privatized
industries
you know you know better than the cuban
government
the cuban government at this point ain't
even socialist anymore they're just
capitalists just like vietnam how are
you talking about
do you think china's socialist
yeah yeah
but vietnam and cuba ain't anymore
they have different companies
they have a
but you gotta think about it you gotta
think about it in the way of the
bourgeoisie versus the proletariat that
you know see this is the essence of
marxism that i was talking about before
it it's that this is all there is
with cuba and uh and vietnam is that the
bourgeoisie entered like infiltrated the
party because especially in vietnam if
you look at their economy they
completely allowed that inner party to
get taken over by
uh
by like
first russian like corporation owners
and things like that
and
and but the difference is that china
actually maintains that their party
state they they still have the working
class that are controlling the party and
then they use them to control them
who's the who's the current president
prime minister i think i read about
emily he he owns some corporations and
[Β __Β ] i think it's already compromised
all right
what are you talking about
the the guy who
[Music]
yeah i think so
no he doesn't the [Β __Β ] are you talking
about
well i mean i may be thinking about
somebody else
but i'll tell you what right now that
this this miguel
yeah
let me get this straight socialist
you're gonna go around telling americans
you're gonna say hey
i have an idea socialism and what it
means is the government's just gonna
control everything
you think people are gonna be on board
with that
i
optics you know that's just complicated
man but
it's very simple
the answer is no
simple
answer i mean you can look at like how
the reactionary classes in germany were
down for like a centralized state
so like you could
i mean you know that's what all the
trump supporters were hoping anyways
they were hoping trump was going to be a
centralized dictate
to them and
if you if you sell on anything other
than having how are you talking about
they're talking [Β __Β ] man
they didn't say anything about a
dictator
i'm saying you know that the trump
supporters
wanted trump to be a dictator so they
didn't
they thought trump was more democratic
than the establishment yeah you're just
saying some [Β __Β ] now you say some
old
what are you talking about man
they thought obama it was a dictator i'd
be stabbing how many edits of trump have
been like him in like a king alpha and
stuff everybody wanted him to be a king
they were they wanted they want the
economy
they want the economy and he wanted them
to abolish congress and [Β __Β ]
so what that doesn't mean that they uh
that doesn't mean they wanted the
government to control everything
and y'all got supporting me usually you
gotta say some good [Β __Β ] but like this
is just [Β __Β ] stupid now i thought you
were smarter than this
i thought you were
the proof is that the proof isn't has
been in the pudding the whole time it's
just
people people american people want
centralized dictatorships that is what
they want and that is what communism
should be
who the [Β __Β ] said that
that's it
maybe one american who says i won the
centralized dictatorship
just one
taco crossing
that [Β __Β ]
tucker carlson uh
you know like uh
what should happen if you like eight
months ago they had they you know they
wanted that the hell are you talking
about
you know the maggot and the gripers and
[Β __Β ] they like
you know the people that did that
protest at the capitol a while ago
how they're gonna like overthrow
dictatorship you're making this up
you make that you make that totally up
like you made that up that the president
of cuba is a capitalist owns enterprises
just talking out of your ass
well i'm not supposed to prove that to
you and you know
like man you're talking you're talking
right out of your ass
how about that right out of your ass
yeah
it's we just disagree on it on so many
things like i just i don't know how i'm
supposed to prove this to you it's just
true they
you think that nobody gives a [Β __Β ] about
democracy anymore or some [Β __Β ] like no
we could see that america's democratic
institutions are failing because nobody
gives a [Β __Β ] to vote because everyone
thinks that the system is just
you know
irreparable it's like
you know this
okay but people people still okay
with these people people still don't
want the [Β __Β ] government to control
the whole economy
yeah like who you who are you saying who
doesn't want this you think everybody
doesn't want this of course they don't
they so you offering like no solution or
office you're just saying like
a solution let's keep going with this
old all that solution of having the
corporations control everything no and
you call me cia you find sound like ciao
right now
you break up the corporations you break
up the monopolies and you give them to
the people and from the bottom up
the people can build build wealth and
get rich
oh yeah teddy roosevelt is socialist now
apparently
more than you
yeah i [Β __Β ] came with this [Β __Β ]
and teddy roosevelt didn't break up the
monopolies what are you talking about
he consolidated imperialist monopolies
under the disguise of breaking up older
ones
dumbass
i mean he's still running for president
on breaking up monopolies
yeah and and that's why you ain't gonna
because you don't want to participate in
the system and actually have a
revolution uh you're basically doing
this what revolution you're gonna have
we're gonna have the revolution what you
mean
what do you mean what do i mean what
revolution you're gonna have
i don't think i can say this [Β __Β ] online
but
it ain't it ain't nothing gonna happen
that's not gonna happen because the
people like you are defeatists and [Β __Β ]
like you don't want anything to change
you just want to keep saying socialism
is in america as it currently is and
like
and like we just need to be keep doing
the same system with with uh with a
hammer and sickness
you ever heard of the fourth industrial
revolution
you know about all that stuff
smart cities you know how smart cities
now what's that
yeah you don't know [Β __Β ]
everything's changing
so you think amazon is socialist no
how is this helping us like what what
does this even mean we're just changing
the whole economy is changing
but see you view it as that you view the
antithesis as
technology changing but then like it's
still gonna be the same people you know
as soon as we're done
as long as the system doesn't change we
we all dead once automation finishes
like they have no more use for us
anymore is already changing
nothing's changing
the [Β __Β ] are you talking about nothing's
changing
it's literally this most stupid thing
i've ever heard nothing
we got we are we got robots and drones
now okay shit's changing
this [Β __Β ] is changing do you think it's
not fundamental yes it's not shit's
changing but not for the good so i don't
know how that's relevant that this is
just like not even socialist that's what
they said when the industrial revolution
happened they said it's changing not for
the good well it's changing free thank
you showbiz you can't go back to the
past so what does it mean what do all
these changes mean
i'm not sure what they mean i don't
think you know either but i'm gonna say
but i'm gonna say if we keep sending our
asses and nothing changes like we're all
dead it's just that simple so why are
you bothering me to go do something
that would be adventurism i i know i
know about marxism and you you you think
i don't so
so you're saying we keep seeing our eyes
doing nothing
i'm good i like what i'm doing
what do you want me to do
yeah but if you keep doing the same
thing you don't change anything you're
just going to be
honest
if you don't do anything so what you
want me to do
i want you to i want you to start a
party
you know
why would i start a party
you always talk about third parties
anyway so yeah there's already third
parties we have the people's party we
have the communist party we have a bunch
of parties that exist already why do i
want to start one no
those are all controlled by federal
agencies yeah i'm talking like you have
to you have to start a grassroots
movement you gotta blow up you gotta
blow but you gotta blow up on twitch you
gotta start a real movement we gotta do
occupy wall street we gotta get all this
[Β __Β ] going again and then maybe we can
see some change but as it stands right
now we're just sitting on our ass doing
nothing and it's just gonna end in
everybody's death
infrared is gonna be the media apparatus
for the third party
that's what we're doing
we're gonna be the media corporation for
a third party
and and okay well i gotta know this and
if if you try to do this whole third
party thing but you ain't gonna control
it
no i'm not gonna control
we're going to influence it we're not
going to control it
[Music]
control comes with responsibility that's
a profession control means you got
elected and you're a representative
and you can't just take your kids takes
it over there's gonna be elections
there's gotta be a process you can't
just be in control
and so you think this infrared media is
gonna be like it's gonna get like 50
million votes
infrared media is going to influence
people toward a third party
but like this third party has got to get
like votes to actually matter though
sure
and even even if you want to look in
that kind of performance fruit i mean
it's kind of revisionist but
because because that i mean it's not a
revolution but it is what i'm saying how
do revolutions happen you know you don't
even know what the [Β __Β ] a revolution is
revolution is when you [Β __Β ] just go
out on the street and randomly do [Β __Β ]
revolution happens when the system
breaks down and then
you gotta seize the moment just like
lenin sees the moment in 1917 that's a
revolution
when you seize the moment when the
moment's not here
you don't you don't just randomly
overthrow the government
the government breaks down and then you
seize the moment
yeah yeah you know what you're right but
the problem with this thinking is that
you have to be prepared for it but we
we're not prepared we don't have we
don't have any kind of the first step to
being prepared is being mature and
understanding
how economies work how the government
works and you got to win the support of
the masses that's how you prepare you
win the support of the masses
and if it breaks down before you ready
what do you think's gonna happen
well i'm trying to prepare as fast as i
can
oh man i don't think she's gonna work
how you think it's gonna work like
i [Β __Β ] challenge you
what do you want me to do do your own
thing
the hell
hello
yo what you want you i already said my
piece with you very like you just don't
get it no you don't get it the hell are
you do you think you think i want to
stop my own networking [Β __Β ] that's like
that's not what i'm about you know i was
trying to get as i said before what are
you about to start your own party start
your own party
you know
you need help with it clearly because
you just don't need help with shifts
yeah
[Music]
that's the only thing you're just mad
that you don't get this high position
you're basically just yeah you're not a
showrunner you've only been here for a
month
and why do you deserve to be a
showrunner
you know why because you know i dealt
with people like you in the past i was
like trying to help people out help out
the channels and stuff grow them up
what the [Β __Β ] you help xqc
yeah
you saying you help xuc grow his [Β __Β ]
yeah
i know this i know this [Β __Β ] i'm talking
about
show the receipts show the receipts you
help xqc grow his channel
well i mean excuse me
i offered him help and i offered help
and he declined it but what i'm saying
is that he missed he missed an
opportunity because like he didn't get
as big as he could have been because he
didn't get my help to
what the [Β __Β ] are you how big would he
have been if you you took your help i'm
talking i'm talking like hundreds of
thousands of views and [Β __Β ] because
because a lot of his like video ideas
were kind of shitty and like they
weren't getting a lot of views so he's
just like relying on like twitch uh
he's right he's like what should he have
done what should he have done instead
you know he got he got
he's like making like all these like
gameplay videos and stuff but like you
don't play you don't play no good games
that are good for like stream watching
and like he's like coming up with same
like uh
what's that [Β __Β ] call
what the [Β __Β ] are you talking about
you're saying you
xqc would have grew if he listened to
you
well
i helped er
grow and but
don't mention that
ah don't mention it
uh but yeah but yeah actually she did
not help and like you know
and look where he is now
he he's like
he's like known as like the most
entertaining person on twitch
he's known as white he's one of those
successful people on twitch i say i say
he like you know he knowing it's like
one of the most entertaining people on
twitch but like his views don't really
reflect it that much yeah he do he gets
[Β __Β ] 80k views
yeah there's like something like no like
he he averages like uh train wrecks i
think you're like he does something like
born ass like gambling [Β __Β ] he like
averages half of xqc's views okay
so so like it just shows that xqc
despite being a lot more entertaining
than him
uh
he he's not capturing his full potential
because he's just making it wrong
here's the ultimate question it's a
million dollar question what does the
xqc have to do with the revolution
oh i'm not saying he has anything to do
with the revolution i'm just saying that
i could have helped his ass out
like i helped the other guy what's why
what's that got to do with revolution
because you know if you got more eyes
and you got more people buying into your
ideology your crush you see you gotta
convince xqc to buy into your ideology
did you do that
no i don't i don't just don't do just
politics [Β __Β ] i'm just talking about
blowing people up in general
yeah but why
because you know if you get more views
you got more people to influence like if
you got if you were getting seven
billion views on your channel you
basically controlled why were you trying
why were you trying to help xqc
yeah because i like i like to grow my
portfolio of of getting people of being
like a social media manager because
that's the kind of [Β __Β ] that i want to
do instead of my job i gotta do the
revolution right i'm talking like
revolution is like a different thing we
all got different quarters
since you don't want to stream yourself
why don't you find someone who will
listen to you and you can manage them
and grow them bigger than me
put your money
despite you
you could rather excuse me in
entertainment but you you i've only been
here since march
i've already been here since march
uh you you started this [Β __Β ] like a year
ago and we already see that you've used
a
i didn't start switch a year ago i
started in march
but i i don't give a [Β __Β ] when you
started i mean a lot of people already
know who you are in the twitch community
i only have 12 000 followers
derek are you from rts3
no he's not oh what is that [Β __Β ]
he's not from rtg
you sure yeah he's not
there's no way
what was that [Β __Β ] i don't even know
what you're talking about people think
what do you
but that ain't true
what do you mean it's not true
that's funny that players have an agent
bro why are you doing this
why you spend your time
why are you spending your time doing
this what do you gain
what man i don't even got social media
i'm legit or something
so it's not you
no no i ain't i ain't zero
that works in the shadows and grows
people's channels but like
you haven't grown any what are you
[Β __Β ] talking you said you're gonna
grow xqc
and then he declined your office yeah
yeah i know i'm just saying that i just
said i was offered to him but i i i grew
the other guy whose name shall be named
apparently so yeah
who the [Β __Β ] are you
i
what what you mean who am i i don't i
don't want to get diaspora
so you
is this a prank
who will be pranking you or what you
mean
what do you mean what do i mean
are you still thinking i'm jerk or some
[Β __Β ] like what you're on about i don't
know who the [Β __Β ] you are
yeah i'm just saying this [Β __Β ] don't
matter it's like asking like some random
person discord who they are what like
that's such that's not not even relevant
what you're talking about
okay so you so you said out you said you
know more about marxism than alex right
and alex debated you and he disproved
you
now
yeah he did you think you're smarter
than another showrunner
yeah yeah it is
henry here get henry in here
or anything anyone who's online get in
this game
you should bring that stupid
alex stupid as hell
well you just got this proven already
nah you look real stupid on that anybody
that's right i hope showing how i knew
what i was talking about and you look
stupid
[Β __Β ] that [Β __Β ] ass no you just
yeah i know he is
hey
hey what's good
what do you want to debate about
uh i met any like
you know has questioned my knowledge
about marxism so if you want to debate
about something about marxism like i'm
all game
okay
um not one question wait a second wait a
second wait a second
you're you're atrocious right
yeah
okay no no no no no no
okay
it doesn't really work though
what do you mean what do you mean you're
let me make this more um
you're you uh you believe in permanent
revolution right yeah
okay okay so can you explain to me what
the difference between that and uh
neoconservative interventionist
intervention yeah interventionism is
these people
these people were like disillusioned
with marxism in the 1960s there was like
a whole revolution of what marxism is
and that they thought that [Β __Β ] was dumb
and they thought that like orthodox
marxism
what is okay okay let me put it this way
what is the meaningful distinction
between permanent revolution
and u.s interventionism
the main contradiction here is that they
are liberals at the heart of their core
they care about life
they talk about democracy so like they
invade countries for development
just to steal money and say here's the
here's the irony here's the irony right
even if like um the form it takes is
different like for example you're
importing uh liberalism around the world
versus trying to import marxism right
the essence of it the essence of it is
the exact same universalism
you realize that right
it shares the exact same message yeah
but i don't see how universalism is
okay i mean okay so then that means
essentially there is not a fundamental
distinction between neoconservatism and
in permanent revolution
there's no there's no fundamentals
derek what is the shape of the earth
yeah he does actually
he talks about shipping a lot
yeah he does
that's what i thought
no [Β __Β ] way
okay continue
anyway my point is you have you have the
fundamentally the same
you have fundamentally the same essence
right the same uh concrete position
here's the mistake that both here's the
mistake that both neoconservatives and
permanent revolutionary you know
trotskyists whatever make
is they both ignore
the actual uh determinant in particular
realities
that ground the truth they both ignore
the particular and determinate reality
so for for you and for a new
conservative there is no like there is
no uh there's no like real national
reality there's no civilization
civilizational reality there's just an
abstract universal individual
is that it's more through permanent
revolution it's through making people
realize their own civilizational reality
and moving and forcing forcing
capitalism into its next stage
here's the thing though the permanent
revolutionary position
position of importing revolution to
other countries is not something that is
coming authentically from the
civilizational reality
but you just said that your position was
that the revolution comes from
civilizational realities right so unless
that's not their position it should
matter a lot because there's a
contradiction here
like do you see the contradiction
no but you're you're full you're using
state power to make them realize their
own civilizational reality you're not
forcing that you're not forcing that
system to be exactly the same to
yourself okay so you're not forcing it
you're just using state power to make
them realize that it's the truth i mean
you're just saying the same thing in a
different way
the point the point is that and this is
also uh
exemplified by socialism of chinese
characteristics
the point is that socialism always has a
determinate ground and is relevant for a
determinant in particular people not
just for uh people as some kind of uh
abstract universal
like i mean you realize that your
position is the exact same position as
the liberal position right where there
were
where there's this universal there's
like this universal
abstract uh working class that doesn't
actually have um a determinant or
particular ground that's uh relevant
that's that's your position
who's more important the architect or
the worker
don't don't interrupt me i'm about to
say some something hot
what
what you just said harry
you you basically said that china isn't
socialist then you speak
[Β __Β ] um okay show me show me how i
just uh yeah okay so make your argument
then
now the ussr didn't use state power to
make china socialist but they they made
them realize their own socialist reality
here's the thing but you know you know
there was a cultural revolution right
but you realize you know there was the
cultural revolution right and what was
the cultural revolution largely targeted
against it was targeted against the
ussr-style
bureaucracy
you realize that right so china china
i mean obviously the soviet union uh you
know played its role in helping uh uh
the modern chinese state establish
itself right but uh china and through
the course of its history has doubled
down on being a very very uh a socialism
that arises from very particular
explicitly particular conditions and
it's evolved beyond uh soviet-style
socialism so i mean that's like the
worst example you could possibly use not
like they tried they tried
what do you i mean socialism of chinese
characteristics it's not socialism with
russian characteristics
you don't even realize how much
influence went into them like soviet i
mean soviet union
no no i realized that the soviet union
had an influence on china what i'm
saying is that throughout the course of
chinese history and the evolution of
socialism in china it has to an extent
been precisely a rebellion against uh
the soviet influences and a new
positivity that went beyond uh
soviet-style socialism so you believe
that that's very that's so explicitly
clear today i mean that's that's so
explicitly clear today
you were talking about you were talking
about um
state-owned uh like basically you know
like uh 100
states on owned like socialism right
where the public institutions control
everything right
yeah
well yeah i mean you realize that's not
how it works in modern china right
yeah i know that but i'm saying that
that that's america's reality i'm not
saying that's reality for everyone
why are we talking about america what do
you mean what does that have to do with
what i just i mean
i'm assuming most of us americans are
here i'm talking about our socialist
reality would be fully centrally planned
okay so okay okay okay okay but you were
using international examples during that
argument like you even did you not use
china as an example during that argument
derek derek
who's more important the architect or
the worker
uh
you guys are more important than both
workers
what the [Β __Β ]
okay who has a harder time dating a man
or a woman
i mean like
i mean like a woman have it easy but i
don't get how that matters
what's that what's
oh yeah did you did you not use uh china
as an example earlier of what you were
talking about when you when it came to
um the state owning all private
enterprises
i never said that
okay well okay okay then
but i did did not the topic of china
come up like read that you were saying
that china is socialist right
yeah
and you were saying that your idea of
socialism was like entirely public
no my definition of socialism is a is a
dictatorship of the proletariat but but
the form of socialism is is
embedded in the material realities that
people have to realize and that's why we
have that's why we have to
that's why okay well if you're okay if
you're making an argument specifically
for america then i would say um in
america would probably be the country
that has the greatest um
probably the greatest prejudices against
this kind of like um top-down yeah
america is more atomized than
individualistic
yeah it's very written into our our
culture
and you know you know the thing is about
you know the thing about the the trump
voters
it was they didn't support him because
they thought he was going to be
some kind of like a dictator or king
that was what leftists were scared of
right that's what that was
that was the uh like the fear that they
created
trumps it was no it was it was most
fundamentally
because they thought that trump was
going to stop the overgrowth of the
government it was actually the exact
opposite they wanted him to stop the
deep state the overgrowth of the
government they weren't able to stop the
deep state the private interest groups
they wanted to clean the trump right
they didn't want him to become the swamp
they wanted him to clean it they didn't
want him to to be like um they didn't
want him to embody the deep state or
embody uh this kind of uh
new authoritarian uh uh political
reality
they wanted him to adopt overgrowth
through the state
yeah but i don't really believe that
like
i really really
what
i'm saying like i don't really believe
that
man
why not
you might man it's like picking up i can
hear my own voice talking it's a little
distracting
what do you say
i say
your voice is like picking up on my mic
like it's hard to think when your voice
is repeating to me my own voice i
okay one sec let me uh
install a different uh mic actually i
have a better one
your mic is fine he's just trying to
distract
what derek what's your height
what's my height yeah
i'm like six five
the [Β __Β ]
are you from new york
okay
and uh what what does can i have to do
with anymore like
what does that have to have to do with
anything what do you have what do you
think about shrooms
i think i think i think they're probably
not a harmful drug to have legalized i
guess
wow what you think about your own 6'5
yeah
really
and what what's the shape of the earth
i'll go i bet i don't know what you two
what you getting at like what's your
point well you it's a globe
yeah
what
now but i don't really think about
religion that much so is there a god or
no
uh i'm like agnostic you know it's like
i don't think humans are capable of
knowing whether god exists or not
you know
why why
are you just bored or something why are
you doing this
why why am i doing what
why are you why are you doing this
but what you are what you mean
all right can you can you say what you
said before i don't know what his name
is talking about
yeah okay so you you're recommending the
for you you want to manage my streams
right
yeah
okay so how long should i stream each
day
i think you should stream like a normal
40-hour week eight hours a day for five
days
what about longer like do you work
do you like work
huh this is what i do yeah yeah so you
so you have no reason to be working like
eight hours a day
okay but but i i mean that's like
something else like you could still be
doing like 20 hours a week but still
getting mad views
but
it's it's more you get your content
that's the problem here is why you're
not growing right so
really i'm not growing
no you're not growing enough is what i
mean like compared to your like
entertainment value which is not good
enough yeah that's complete [Β __Β ]
just like x y just like xqc right
like you you prescribing like you know
think about it like a material reality
says he just has a different material
reality from you what do you think about
enver hojo
really
now yeah
who's that
really
what do you think about her song
i heard of his name before what do you
think
yeah and you're gonna like do nothing
for anything you're just gonna be like
say some sock damn [Β __Β ]
really
i think i think if you keep going
trajectory that's where you're going
okay
what do you think about destiny
uh man he's stupid as hell he
you know he's like they're done in
cougar like what's that word donald
kruger like everybody thinks he's so
smart but he like there's like such a
facade of [Β __Β ] of like his entire
philosophy of like what he's built on
i do stupid all right henry does it work
now
hello
what time is it right now
you thought of me yeah what's the timing
like 10 o'clock
you you east coastal right like you're
always saying you're streaming at 5 esp
but you never on you like 2 hours late
lazy ass
oh you [Β __Β ] did it and that was
between you and henry henry destroyed
you yeah that's what i'm talking about
every stupid ass yeah
you didn't even know what he's talking
about
yeah sure
you can only bench one night
you think i didn't know what i was
talking about i don't know what you're
talking about you don't know what inver
hoja is dumbass
yeah this dude from albania like nobody
gives a [Β __Β ] about albania i don't know
what this [Β __Β ] is
okay
henry are you there
where's henry where are you from and
then why
hello did your mic break again
where in and why are you
why no from not relaxing myself i'm just
i'm not even into ny i'm just saying
like i'm like right outside my but i
ain't telling you my location
so you're from ny
yeah where
you mean where what do you mean where
you said you're from new york
why you gotta know that i don't see how
that shit's relevant
are you making it up
well what do you think i'm from then
what you mean
canada
why robbie from canada who's from canada
vancouver
who's from canada vancouver i don't know
we have a discord tracker it says you're
in vancouver right now
oh yeah who's in vancouver you are
it says here you're from vancouver
what you made up from vancouver you have
it yes you're in vancouver right now
yeah show it to me
ass
no i can't yeah
yeah
yes i thought
no you shut your ass up
would you [Β __Β ] kim k
hello
what
says she has some fake
she got like 200 pounds of plastic in
her face too it looks like 200 pounds of
bird [Β __Β ]
okay henry you there
where'd henry go
he's dodging
alex are you there
yeah i'm here can you ask him what's
going on or
he says his setup is not boring when he
drowns you can't hear anything
something with the setup
the hell
apparently stannis is coming
stannis said he converted to ml and he's
coming
we're gonna see what's what that's all
about
all right henry you there
and his [Β __Β ] broke
but henry
hello
hey yeah okay we can hear you know
okay yeah i don't know what happened
anyways uh where were we um yeah what i
was saying before that was that um
trump was actually um
for the voters for the people who voted
for him they were voting for him because
they thought he was going to stop the
overgrowth of the uh the state not uh
yeah but that's what that's where your
mistake is because like fighting
corruption like ain't the same thing as
like authoritarianism versus democracy
it's like it's like
but anything the the corruption of the
american state takes the form of an
excess right of a deep state
which which most uh i think most
conservatives would consider to be
authoritarian they they compared both to
uh like fascism and communism they just
they just see it as like you know uh a
authoritarian takeover by the deep state
and by the tech companies and i mean
that they are they're right
they're right and trump was uh meant to
be a kind of anti-establishment figure
that was going to uh reign the men
so you think that justifies that their
mature reality but the problem with
which
out that material reality is it's like
towards democracy or some [Β __Β ] like
that but the thing is you got to realize
i'm not sure what you mean by that
statement material reality is democracy
i'm saying that like the american people
the american people uh do not want uh
they don't want in some abstract way of
authoritarianism what they want is a
people's
what they want is the real people's
republic that's what they want
yeah i know what you see i know what
you're trying to say but like people's
people's minds can change like people
can go from like democracy
yeah but you were but you were saying
that they already wanted a dictatorship
i'm arguing from your viewpoint now i'm
saying even further
your viewpoint
because it's like hard to prove prove
that americans want democracy but
that they want um some form of democracy
i mean it's it's it's one of the most
foundational things about uh what made
the project of america the country of
america uh unique in his founding was
that was meant to be a republic and um i
mean yeah i don't know what else to say
and so you think that if trump likes to
spend elections he like actually became
an authoritarian leader do you think
that uh that trump supporters would stop
supporting him
it depends on what you mean by that if
he became another face of the already
authoritarian people
i'm just saying like if he like
suspended elections and he just said no
more elections no more congress none of
this [Β __Β ] i don't think no he could i
don't think he just said i don't think
he could just explicitly suspend
elections no i'm not saying i'm saying
that i can't do it
but isn't trump's like whole argument
that the liberals are already suspending
real elections that they're i mean isn't
that
it doesn't matter what trump is it's
what
his supporters believe him to be
i don't believe him no but but here's
the thing his supporters believe there'd
already be an authoritarian deep state
that is being unfair to him and
suppressing him they don't think that
he's uh the uh the um gonna become uh
this kind of authoritarian dictator they
believe there's already like and then
when kathy did become that that's my
whole point i'm saying they could eat
americans could easily be aligned with
with uh centrally planned dictatorship
means
if they had the minds changed and they
could have their life changed
in the short in the short term
they might be behind it to fight against
the establishment but in the long term
they wouldn't
that's what you don't get in the long
term they would not
do you think that's something to do with
like genetics or something no it's just
nature of america
where we we we're a very individualistic
country and we're not united as a people
to be uh
you know to to
to have that kind of uh way of
governance people want to be left alone
in this country if you want to do their
own thing
and
people also want to be able to uh you
know they want the government to always
be changing and adapting and they don't
want it to be stagnant
but your position is
though the i think there's something you
ignored too about um power and how
authority works
the people um historically have liked
figures like stalin and mao et cetera
not not simply because they were
abstractly authoritarian but because
they represented the people's authority
there's a distinction there
i don't think that i don't think that
matters that much it's like at least
wait no it's literally the whole point
it's the whole point is that they
represented the people like the whole
point is that in a sense they were more
democratic than formal democracy because
they represented the true real of the
people that's the whole point
and i'm
[Music]
yeah that's not one it's not relevant
but two i mean we can see the historical
example of what happened to him right
i mean that he lost
he was defeated
he didn't actually found he didn't
actually found a new state that would
last uh the test of time
i mean the same thing could be said
about the soviet union i don't care any
of this
the soviet union lasted for what like 70
years
yeah something like that
yeah and it also um
created a lot of the
um the infrastructure that the modern uh
russian state still uses
it's i mean it wasn't soviet union it
wasn't just like a decade of russian
history it was an entire era of russian
history of world history not not only
was it an era of russian history it
literally changed the entire
geopolitical uh playing field entirely
so
like if china collapses from this like
evergreen [Β __Β ] do you think it's not
it's not gonna collapse
i mean nobody knows that but what i'm
saying is that it's not going to
collapse because they're ever grounded
everybody's not going to collapse john i
know that
not only that i'm pretty sure that uh
this was pretty much what the cpc like
uh had saw coming or had planned to
happen i mean
they they had warned companies like ever
grande that there was gonna be more uh
regulations and stuff so i mean
this doesn't seem like some kind of uh
disastrous
completely unpre unpredicted uh chain of
events
it's actually honestly the evergreen
thing is a part of a much wider a much
wider um
group of uh cultural
um
reforms that are going on to benefit the
chinese people it's part of a much wider
uh group of chinese reforms that are
currently going on
well from what you said i now understand
what you mean when you talk about what
socialism is to you because basically
what you think socialism is
nice
don't call me a dumbass you're the
dumbass here socialism is not what
socialism is to me it's an objective
phenomena and i am um
i'm not but here's the thing though i'm
putting it in an intelligible uh
understandable form verbally but it's
not just my private socialism i'm
arguing this is objectively what
socialism historically is and what it's
developing into
yeah but you believe that any state that
doesn't collapse is basically the real
socialist sort of species are you
actually are you actually gonna say that
what are they okay what did i say
what i implied is that for a government
to actually represent some kind of uh
lasting
uh true it's a gym
it's simple right with with the nazis
what happened it was a one military
adventure where everything was gonna pay
off and it failed soviet union actually
succeeded and actually materially
altering the foundations of the russian
state and the russian people and
actually contributing in the long term
to the development and evolution of
russian civilization that's the
difference
but if it survived i bet you would be
calling it socialist today
what
because it survives because basically
maybe there's nothing
russia is ruled russia is ruled by uh
an ambiguous centrist semi-liberal
some capitalist elements but the actual
material foundation of the russian state
and the economy is still from the soviet
union so yeah russia's actual
fundamental economy the economic
foundation of russia is socialist it's
just that they don't have a government
that refl reflects that reality
so you think that because of that it's
inevitable to collapse because like for
example what happens
is that when they when they privatize
when they prac when they so-called
privatize the soviet union it got
concentrated in the hands of a few small
oligarchs who just gave the the
functional nature of these enterprises
this game a different name
but the fundamental structure of the
economy from this of uh russia was still
built by the soviet union
man you know how poor everybody is in
russia like it doesn't yeah yeah because
of the way because of the way it's
managed because of the way the uh it's
distributed
and because of the way the overall
industrial policy and developmental
policy works there right but ultimately
when it comes to returning socialism to
russia it is a matter of government
policy
uh not so much of uh building a
socialist foundation they already have a
socialist foundation they just need a
government that's going to command it in
a socialist way
so
all right
to see what socialism is then how would
russia what would they what are they
supposed to do to make it socialist in
your definition
it would be a change of policies there
could be some industries that could be
further nationalized they could
construct uh state-owned enterprises
along china's lines there's all sorts of
things they could do and they could they
could re-channel uh
for a kind of reinvestment in the former
broken solving industries there's a lot
of things they could do to do that
you know
the program of the communist party of
the russian federation they have plans
and ideas for that
it sounds like like aoc [Β __Β ] like if we
want to fix
i'm talking about the communist party of
the russian federation do you even know
what they're [Β __Β ] politically such a
dumb [Β __Β ]
they literally got number two in the
[Β __Β ] elections recently so they're a
pretty influential big party
i'm just saying like if you think that
if we give people health care and give
them better wages
well then you just with aoc isn't just
that she's uh so she calls herself a
democratic socialist which basically
means she's a liberal
because she doesn't believe in a
proletarian dictatorship or she doesn't
believe in the necessity of a party
dictatorship or a third party or
anything like that
i'm not i'm not saying she's a socialist
or anything i'm just saying that you
probably support the policies that she
supports psych
like
okay formally speaking so does jimmy
dore but look at the great contradiction
between the two
it's not about abstract
i don't know who jimmy dore is so
important
you're a marxist you know who xqc is you
know who every twitch streamer is
but you don't know who jimmy dore is
right
i know i don't like the corbin guy and i
know some other i know
[Music]
no
yeah you do shut the [Β __Β ] up of course
you do
yes you do you know miss give
me i never even heard that name before
what about slicker
nah why are you laughing why why'd that
make you laugh
i wrote something shout out made me
laugh nah you know whose [Β __Β ] slicker
is
you know who wes is based
thank you essentially appreciate you
okay why you keep asking me who i don't
yeah so how the [Β __Β ] do you know [Β __Β ]
our brothers
i i've seen him on my debates okay
when's train coming
what did you mean when it's train camera
when's train coming train train doesn't
do his like his like podcast or whatever
anymore so
that's so such that you know who alabrel
is that's so sauce
he knows this guy knows who alibrell is
but he doesn't know who jimmy dore is
hey alabama he's known on twitch i think
you know who he is right
yeah
really
yeah but i was like just a coincidence
because i like seen him from like
debates and [Β __Β ] what debates
what [Β __Β ] debates are you talking
about he's not in debates my plane's
right train wrecks as i talk to him and
stuff
so you know all about everything on
twitch you know about slicker you know
about alabrel
yeah
do you watch st peach
you know what that is
yeah
you [Β __Β ] do you know what that is
man i don't i just know a lot about
twitch that don't mean anything
so you just know a lot about twitch and
you're a marxist
yeah
and you don't know but you don't know
who environment is
yeah but you don't know who enver hoja
is and you know who jimmy dore is
nope
who's little steve
i don't know
why well
why are we playing like 20 questions or
something
i feel like i'm playing like akinator
some [Β __Β ]
okay
and uh what's your favorite uh
video game
continue with him continue
hey
so what i was saying is
what policies you support and abstract
and what your concrete position is are
not the same thing like aoc says she
supports medicare for all but i mean
when she's had opportunities to support
it practically she's always gone against
it
yeah
so what about it what's decisive here is
not whether or not she says she supports
medicare for all what's decisive here is
where she stands in relation to the
american people in the american
establishment
yeah but you you'd still support foreign
policies that haven't done anything but
say they're gonna do something
well i mean you can't say these po i
mean these policies haven't done
anything because they don't exist right
now
it's not even like the the whole point
with medicare for all
is that it draws a distinction between
the people in the establishment and not
only this it's something that the
establishment if it truly was a
legitimate uh represent uh
representative class or whatever
uh if it was um a real uh state that
represented the people it would have no
reason to come come into contradiction
with a lot of these ideas even had their
origins um in some element of the
establishment and so it reveals um a
contradiction
um both within the establishment and
between the establishment and the
american people that's the point
it's not just about abstractly whether
or not you support everyone having
health care i mean that's gonna depend
on the context right it's about where
you stand in relation to uh the people
of your country
well
to be honest i still feel like you
haven't you haven't like demonstrated
what socialism is
okay so here's the here's the problem
with your understanding of social media
right you know who alacrity is
no
yeah you're from [Β __Β ] dgg discord
aren't you
i know what destiny is i know what dgg
is but what about it
and why he stopped talking you're
literally a [Β __Β ] destiny troll aren't
you
yeah
why wait why did you think i'm a troll
or something
like why like why you keep questioning
who i am i just don't get that
i wonder why
but because i don't have to get the same
user source as you that must be like a
destiny troll
like a chipmunk that's one
voice changer it might be the fact that
you won't know who jimmy dore is you
know
told me to change my voice so i don't
know why you better you had a voice
changer from the beginning
now i was barely distorting my voice a
little but now it's just the same thing
it was just with extreme uh distortion
i listened to what my voice was on
stream and it sounded like to say it
sounded like the same thing almost just
a little deeper but
if you guys like listening to this dumb
[Β __Β ] voice i don't care
you know more than henry
uh
not about everything but like i don't
definitely know more things about
socialism than he does
do anything anything about i'm gonna go
because the soviet union was like
controlling them from the top
same thing with the kpd
i've never i've never said that
here's the thing though even the soviet
uh led afghanistan state it did
fall so i mean i don't know what your
point is here yeah then that's
the same
is that actually is that actually a good
example of your position that you can
just import socialism everywhere if it
didn't actually work
yeah so your definition awesome is if
whether it fails or not like
i can't help you
socialism is not whether or not it fails
yeah
the
you know what do you want to know why
do you get the point of marxism it's
that you can't just have thoughts inside
of your head without testing it out in
reality so whether or not something
actually fails in reality is decisive
for whether or not you want to repeat it
going forward in the future that's both
dialectical and is also just common
sense like
you you realize that the whole point is
that victory
gives expression to a more fundamental
truth
there's a reason why some things fail
and some things don't
and you're just using buzzwords now
no i'm not using buzzwords i haven't
used those things
i thought you've been you've been using
like the same like same phrase like five
times now
okay it was mal was mel using uh
buzzwords and uh when he talked about
the the practice and theory and how you
know that they must have a relationship
to each other was he using buzzwords
now use a lot of different words and
sentences than you use and you just keep
saying the same [Β __Β ] over and over again
i just i i just said that the whole
point is you can't just have these ideas
in your head you have to actually test
them out in reality and see if they fell
or succeed and understand why that's
both a common sense point and it's also
the same point that pretty much every
major marxist says has made
how is that buzz words and how is that
heart how's that hard to understand in
any capacity
uh well the fact that you like trying to
show that we can have like some kind of
libertarian socialism in the united
states despite like every communist
country being like authoritarian in
nature because every everything exactly
in practice is always going to be a
dictatorship because it's a dictation
yeah but here's the thing here's the
thing here's what you don't understand
is that the dictatorship of the
proletariat does not uh abolish or get
away uh or destroy the formal uh
democracy or the formal republic just
like for example china has a
dictatorship of the public the
proletariat it also has the people's
republic
it's not just uh one or the other true
the whole point the whole point of the
dictatorship of the proletariat is that
there's always going to be some kind of
excess beyond uh the formal state power
and the dictatorship of the proletariat
is the
party of the proletariat right uh
ensuring that it's ultimately the
proletariat that is uh in power in the
last instance it's it's by and by being
the party of the proletariat it also
uh gains uh represent uh temptation of
the masses in general that's like the
whole point it's like the proletarian
dictatorship does not come at the
expense of democracy it's the only thing
that ensures true democracy
so if somebody wants that's why that's
why it's the proletariat dictatorship
right and not uh the dictatorship of the
bourgeoisie
so if somebody in a socialist country
uh voted for another party that wasn't
the marxist leninist party or the
communist party they voted for some
liberal party then what do you know
you don't
there's there's not going to be any more
there's only be one party
all right so then why are you talking
about democracy yeah like you you
talking about there'll be democracy
within the party
the party yeah i mean we all know i mean
they popped it so i mean that's our
point of view the thing though in china
the founding fathers never intended
there to be a bunch of parties that are
competing
but they weren't socialists here yeah
but still
they were not intending on a bunch of
parties competing for votes to scam
people
that's that
parties were a danger they saw them as a
danger
i
necessarily disagree with that but that
was mostly for henry because he spent
some [Β __Β ]
what [Β __Β ] was i spitting i mean
everything okay here everything won
everything i said was correct and two i
think you don't really understand the
way that the chinese yeah the chinese
system has a one-party dictatorship but
they also have something called the
people's democracy and it's actually a
democracy
yeah they i know that they got like
other parties in it and they thought
about other parties
no they got potties within it but it's
like those like smaller
all leaders with the same ideology
though that's the other that's that like
that's absolutely not necessarily
there was a great amount of uh
ideological wealth and uh
differentiation within the chinese
government also even within the party
itself and also here's the thing
i would say that china is even more
democratic than the us because i mean
look at what happens to uh
leaders that fail in china they get
replaced almost instantly
they do
like if you become unpopular in china as
a politician you don't have any
political future if you become unpopular
as a politician in america you'll be in
congress for the next 30 years
that's facts
okay so then we pretty much agree on the
same things but like but you still like
pushing like electoralism [Β __Β ] in
the united states despite you basically
what is stannis in the server
no he didn't join yet
when did he say he wants to join who the
[Β __Β ] is
the phone
he did join
oh no he didn't join you
well we unbanned him is that the right
stannis
let me see
settings probably wasn't the right
stannis
members stannis
oh no bands keep going guys keep going
the point the point of uh it's not that
communists are against um
electoralism because they think it
shouldn't exist it's because they don't
see that as the full expression of the
people's will like uh it's not that uh
communists seek to just get rid of
formal democracy is that we realize
former democracy is not the end all be
all the in the last instance the most
decisive expression of a people's will
i mean every
every like a major communist uh led
country that's existed has still had a
formal democracy there's the formal
republic right and then there's also the
proletarian uh party the proletarian uh
dictatorship
i like to why you push electoralism in
the us
what do you even mean by that like what
do you mean by that do you mean that we
want to start a third party like well i
mean that's what i mean
you guys don't support revolution in the
u.s is what i'm saying what do you mean
by revolution do you what do you mean
like just people go outside and do
violent stuff like what are you talking
about i mean completely like using like
a vanguard to overthrow the government
what the [Β __Β ] does that mean
like how do you think revolutions happen
wait wait how do you think revolutions
have happened historically do you think
it's because a bunch of people decided
that they're just gonna go out form a
party and overthrow the state
immediately is that how it happened
but
it's different from like individual it's
not on an individual level it's not a
math level contradiction there's an
objective contradiction
between the people in the existing
ruling class there's an objective
contradiction communists give in
political form expression to that
they don't just they don't create the
contradiction there already is one
so you don't have to create
here's the thing it's not that we have
to bring down the american state the
american state is already falling apart
that's the whole point
we'll have to see that
see here's the thing that's why
listen let me let's see
media platform we're building a media
platform to support
the uh rebuilding and rising of the
american uh the communist party usa
yeah but if you don't do anything more
than that you're just gonna end up like
a sauna
how are you
gonna do what do you want me to do i
don't know what to tell you like what
what is there what's that okay
the inevitable conclusion of this is
just gonna be like another mr live
within his means hassan or something
like that
let me know
what the [Β __Β ]
what what you're talking about
anyways yeah if you don't do anything
brah this is dirk no this is [Β __Β ]
zurich i know this is zurich there's no
[Β __Β ] way this isn't zorko this is a
hundred percent circle
this is one thousand percent
this is you i'm gonna unsubscribe i woke
up at [Β __Β ] 3am for this [Β __Β ] i i had
no idea what you guys are talking about
on surreal [Β __Β ] who the [Β __Β ] said mr
live within his means there's too many
patterns
there's too many patterns you just don't
add up
[Β __Β ] just don't add up there's too many
[Β __Β ] patterns
there's too many things that point in
the [Β __Β ] direction that this is
[Β __Β ] zerka i'm sorry
a lot of people like use that terminal
it's like a normal expression living
within your own means yeah to talk to
emphasize that fat thing about hassan
i mean it's just true about him though
that's just the point i'm saying that
that's going to be infrared if you guys
don't shape up
exactly this
who is this guy it's if it's not zerka
then he's someone who knows
who he is
yeah that's not zurka i don't yeah it's
just a watcher it's the viewer
but it's still weird because he said
he's five
he said
he said he's six five he said uh
he knows who all the twitch was he knows
who alabrella is and he doesn't know who
[Β __Β ] jimmy dore is
uh you you just pulled up a bunch of
coincidences together and saying it like
that that [Β __Β ] would never fly in court
if you try to put that in court
you ever heard of like talking about
contradictions you ever heard about like
circumstantial evidence all right
continue continue
the point i was trying to make was this
there's already an objective
contradiction
between the people in the establishment
in america and communists don't seek to
like create a contradiction or just
voluntarily uh start revolution they
give political expression to this
already existing objective development
the state in america is already
objectively something that is crumbling
under the weight of his own
contradictions the point of the
communist party is to give political
expression of this into a new uh
the possibility of a new
um state or former political
representation that can survive this
transformation
there already is an objective
transformation that's happening
so so you think you say you think that
it's just gonna fall apart and then some
some like napoleon's gonna take over and
and he's gonna be like a socialist
somehow he's gonna say
i mean historically what actually
happens in history is kind of similar to
that actually i know you try to say that
it's like a crazy like joke or whatever
but i mean
i don't know what to tell you like
objectively like the reasons why states
fall
is not because
uh um like uh uh us a party of people
will it to fall you realize that right
yeah and when did the roman empire
collapse
i i don't i have no idea
what did admiral bird say
what do you say
i'm asking derek what did admiral bird
say
okay
so the point is like you're not just
going to create a revolution like out of
thin air
i don't know what you expect us to be
doing differently than what we're
already doing
it's like uh you know when the [Β __Β ]
started escrow would you have just said
like they're not doing enough i don't
know what to say
we don't really have like a secondary
option like uh like
like everybody else had i mean i mean
with the with the russians had they like
they were like already prepared for
revolution but we're not we're not
prepared for anything and and the result
of that is gonna be russia just going in
and taking over our country there ain't
going to be no like actual leader to
take over if it falls this is going to
be
how do you want to prepare other than
rebuilding the communist party and
providing a platform for the
dissemination of information
[Music]
well i mean there there already are
people striking that's not i mean
i'm not going to work that's not
something that i can voluntarily will
people to do it's not like something
that i i'm not i can't make people
strike
what you do is that you you like um
based on the material the poor material
conditions of people you rile them up
and and you get people you get people in
motion to be doing things and then you
take advantage of it that's a whole
bunch of [Β __Β ] nothing
i have to ask you i have to ask you a
question would you would you call this
quote-unquote direct action is that what
you're talking about you just you just
get out there and you just get people to
do stuff yeah collective says yeah
that's just not how reality works
strikes
action
here's here's the problem you you see
reality as this thing that's like
completely determined by the subject and
you ignore the actual objective reality
that gives rise to uh you know different
objective developments you're not a
you're not a materialist that's the
problem you you don't say you just keep
saying objective and stuff but you funny
enough you can't even mention like
historical examples of like these things
you're talking about
examples
okay
when uh
what okay let me ask you a question
when the russian uh empire the czar the
zardam uh fell
was it merely because there was the
existence of a bolshevik party or was it
that
there was already a decline in the
russian empire and world war one had
taken things uh too far
and uh people were getting why are you
getting the other country examples
well there's no example of a communist
revolution in america oh yeah
living in communism
yeah i mean do you i mean we can look at
the uh the american revolution that
wasn't just started uh purely by um
please don't say that [Β __Β ] was socialist
that's just
that [Β __Β ]
was it was funny
i said there is no example of a
socialist revolution but if you want an
example of a revolution i guess the only
thing we can look towards is 1776 that's
my point there is no social security
forget the source of decoration
okay
which states have had that happen
um russia
china
uh cuba
you don't think that was america right
what are you talking about what do you
mean
america i never saw america in a
dictatorship of the proletariat i and no
one from infrared has ever said that
you said america miracle soldiers no
don't don't deny that [Β __Β ] when we got
that america with socialists we made a
distinction between the dictatorship of
the proletariat or the political uh form
that socialism takes in the objective
revolution in the forces of production
when we say that america is already
socialist we mean in the sense that the
um objective revolution in the forces of
production has already happened
that's what we're claiming now that
there's a dictatorship of the
proletariat in fact in our early videos
we've
i very clearly said the problem is that
there is no dictatorship of the
proletariat in america
did your mic break again um i think it's
working right no not yours
i'm good
yes
i just don't agree with him that's the
problem yeah because you're a bdfo
yeah you guys destroyed you
you're crushed
where's stannis can someone go tell
stannis uh
we want to see why he changed his views
someone go to understand ask stannis
does anyone is anyone in contact with
him
what did he change his views to
apparently stannis is a marxist leninist
now
supposedly
and maya is for some reason nowhere to
be found
oh yeah wasn't she supposed to debate
about uh prostitution or something
he's not online
does anyone have beef with you guys
um
[Music]
i don't think
but i forgot their names
yeah i don't know
who do you say
alex hello
are you guys there
so do you concede
uh
i mean i don't really can see that
because like he's using the word
socialist to mean like basically uh
like a technological advancement
technology it's not about technology
it's yours
what these revolutions are like no it's
not a revolution you dumbass the forces
of production are not just technology
i mean i mean if the political structure
doesn't change then it is it's just
technology there's also the relations of
production
those aren't political relations they're
material relations
you get that you get that uh
industrialism and capitalism
corresponded also to a socialization of
uh
production right
the very mode of production itself
changes define socialization of
production
define it
well instead of okay so uh in the past
at probably at the most fundamental
level you had uh peasantry right and
they produced uh goods individually
um and you had a few you know small like
artisans and so on in the city but even
then their production was largely uh
individualistic with industrialism now
you have industries of scale
um where there's the coordination yeah
factories are mass producing things it's
not people so it was technology that
changed
technology
it's not just that though it's also the
relations of uh production change
like the no like not only was there the
socialization of production but there
was also um
the like you know the there was a change
from uh
cmc to mcm prime right
there's also like the very fundamental
logic of the economy completely
transformed
you can say that the technological
changes corresponded to this but that's
not fundamentally
what we mean
and i can give you an example uh of what
we're talking about when we say that uh
objectively
uh the forces of production have already
uh transformed or been uh revolutionized
if you look back for example in the um
19th century up until you get to around
the late 19th century you actually do
have a kind of like free market uh
capitalism but as you approach the 20th
century and very explicitly in the 20th
century itself what happens uh this free
market changes into um you know
monopolies there's industrial monopolies
there's the rise of finance capital and
there's the merging of all those things
um
with the state and with each other and
so you get um a new era of state planned
economies even the the capitalist
economies were still uh state planned in
this era and lenin you know he called he
uh he talked about this when he was
discussing imperialism and what he was
trying to say is that um this already
is a part of the transformation
um from capitalism to socialism it's
already pregnant with uh the seeds of
socialism
and that was i mean that was uh
derek already lost the debate derek
already lost the debate
yeah right
yeah you already lost no like his
definition of social media's capitalism
like that's the ultimate like crux
literally live in the anglo box you just
believe in the anglo box that's why
you're [Β __Β ] confused because you
don't have a [Β __Β ] understanding of
dialectics dumbass
so i mean did you think that marx was
wrong when he said that uh you know
capitalism would inevitably transform
into socialism or do you think that
lenin was wrong when he
uh looked at imperialism and he he
claimed that this was already a
transition into socialism
[Applause]
what does that mean no
you're not pregnant at all
okay what's the difference between your
marxist leninist strategy to win power
and why isn't it just trotskious
a biggest thing because
it's more about it was planned in a way
that was like already like a socialist
reality in the country and it was like
more about it
had a strategy to win power too
what's the difference between the
mentioned big [Β __Β ] and what your
view is yeah seizing power here is not
like what matters what matters is like
defying what socialism is it to begin
with why
because if we don't define what it is
then
there there will be an illusion in
people's heads of
of what
of what it's supposed to actually be and
then nothing will change because nobody
believes it don't know what the [Β __Β ]
you're talking about
socialism isn't a [Β __Β ] idea you
[Β __Β ] impose on reality
here's the here's the great irony
darroch the people who are not educated
about socialism but use the term
colleque
are using it in a much more correct
manner than you are
because it is it is an objective thing
even if they're the form in which they
understand it is incorrect it is an
objective thing and they are talking
about it
like when we say we talk about socialism
we're not talking about some special
term with a special definition that we
subjectively created
you realize that right
so you see so you can't explain it in
the definition though in your in your
mind
explained it plenty of times
no no
i'll explain it right now
there's one sentence
give me a second to explain it then okay
socialism
is a revolution in the forces of
production
that will transform society from being
uh fundamentally centered by the
production of more profit or you know
mcm
into a society that um
has um as it's uh
has its end a social end and the way in
which this happens is both an objective
uh revolution of the forces of
production and a political revolution uh
in the form of a proletarian
dictatorship
uh so basically by own definition
america is in social assault
that's not what you don't have a dude
you don't understand dialectic so shut
the [Β __Β ] up about marxism dialects is
gonna say it's absolutely one thing or
the other dialectic says something is in
the process of transforming into
something else which means it's not one
thing or the other yeah but yeah it's
both at the same time it just depends
from what perspective are you looking at
and i understand that but it's not no
you don't understand that you [Β __Β ]
live in the anglo box we're not we're
not in socialism
at all like not even one percent that's
no that's not how it works that's not
how it works
that's not how it works
there is a sense in which you can say we
do live in socialism
it just depends on what you mean by that
if you mean to say we already live in a
proletarian dictatorship obviously
that's not true right but if you mean to
say
that the forces of production have
already objectively transformed into uh
the fundamentals of a socialist economy
regardless of the political situation
that would be correct
but but did you hear that on henry's
definition of social media
you can tell that if something sources
by how like
they like
henry is correct in the case of the
united states
because
the pursuit of profits for prophet's own
sake
is only maintained politically right now
in america and only maintain
institutionally but if you actually look
at what drives the economy it's no
longer profit actually
profit is no longer what animates the
ability for our economy to grow
or to reproduce itself even in any
capacity
yeah they have their own politics
and that's why some of the biggest
companies that actually emerged within
the past few decades
operated at a loss and many of them
still do operate at a loss in terms of
profit these companies
have as their goal no longer profit so
to speak
but almost some either the reproduction
of an expansion of the companies
themselves and their specific social
goals of transforming and disrupting the
economy like for example uber isn't
about profit
it's not like the main driving force
uber is about this vision of
transforming transportation in the
united states they're trying to
implement and expand itself and and
oftentimes they even miss they even have
to create uh
mystifications about what their real
goal is
in the place of the objective social
ends like for example elon musk has to
create an ideological mystification
about mars being the ultimate end goal
of this whole uh tesla thing and spacex
whatever right it's all about going to
mars right this is no different than
when the soviet union would say it's all
about the end goal of communism it's all
about reaching this end goal they are
creating all these different end goals
and these end goals are not just profit
now they may be
mystifications they may be uh fiction
right but they're not just profit that's
the [Β __Β ] point
it's no longer money for money zone say
that drives the economy
now now i wouldn't necessarily disagree
with that but then you have no it's not
money for money's own stake is still
like the law of the economy in the sense
of
um
the with the reign of the financial
institutions and wall street and so and
so on but it doesn't work anymore it
doesn't work anymore
and in that sense it no longer is what's
able to drive the economy it's what the
institutions want to be able to drive
the economy but it's not in practice
what actually drives the economy anymore
and that's why the system is facing the
internal contradictions that it is
because money for money's own sake is no
longer enough to actually keep the
economy we have now working
you know what also you know what also is
a great example of this the entire
social media company like social media
spirit companies like you do you think
for example they're making more money
when they increase the amount of
regulations they have and the amount of
censorship they're probably decreasing
their user base and their money but
because they're pretty much an informal
kind of state institution that's not
that's kind of besides the point
well you you didn't really you didn't
really say much uh from that statement
but at the same time you you you explain
you're saying
you're saying that money is not like
their their main goal right now which i
understand but you're not
you're not saying what the real goal is
really
the real the what do you mean the real
goal
like like what their actual like motive
is because you need motives you're
saying like the the ceo
of uber itself of
transforming how transportation works
and also keeping the whole thing
together and you know updating the
software and it's it's almost like a
planned economy that's what it is
profit is just what they use to measure
whether they're being successful or not
but it's not
ultimately it's not for profit anymore
uber as the brand is enough as its own
ends same thing with disney same thing
with all these other corporations the
corporations the brand is the end goal
it's no longer about
profit for profit's own sake it's about
the brand
that's what you don't get
that's a very idealist way to look
that's not
and embodies the entire chain of
production that culminates in it so
it's not just i it's obviously not just
a belief or an idea or anything
that's just the end point that's just
like the
the conclusion of it all
what i was gonna say is this a really
good example of this it's really simple
is kind of like how if you're a trish
streamer or internet influencer your
brand is more fundamental than how much
money you're making and the money you
make is just so that you uh
can sustain the brand
why do you think why do you think for
example for example i if i collected
these subs monetarily i would get double
more than double what i get per month
but i prioritize subs because it grows
the community and it grows the brand
these subs are more valuable
even though monetarily they're worth
half the money
if i got this directly in donations it
would be double what i get more than
double i don't i don't that's what i'm
saying right now they're losing money
because they want to like expand like
that's the whole that's what it's just
like another part of capitalism at the
moment that's not socialization that's
that's not important that's not
socialism that's
uh they're taking money to like destroy
competition like that's what they want
to do
they want to expand expand the business
it's the other way around it's not that
this is another part of capitalism it's
almost like capitalism itself became
simply a part of socialism or a part of
the greater logic of how the economy
works but not the actual uh final end of
it or fundamental uh
motor of it
like the the profit
doesn't uh is not it's not the point
anymore
it's a vector of information
it's all it's um about the prospects
i'm sorry
no it's no i haven't and what in my what
meaningful sense have i lost this debate
can you prove can you open that okay
okay at what point in the future then
uh does profit become more fundamental
than the brain because disney is already
pretty far into its future it's been
around for a very long time is very
successful um and it's a very powerful
uh company so why is it uh that for them
the brand is more and fundamental and
more important uh than profit why is it
more important for them to put all these
like cultural and political symbols and
so on into their
their movies than it is to uh be more
popular why is that why are they
exactly
this is exactly how the stock market
works they're seeking money for for the
idea of getting more profit in the
future it's it's like how it's uh
it shows up is
earlier this year if that's how the
stock market works
yeah you don't have an answer to that do
you
well i tell you i'll tell you this
though if you are a pirate if you're a
party in like 1400 and you spend all
this money on a pirate ship and [Β __Β ]
but you're sinking a lot of money but
it's all for the prospect to get money
in the future that's the whole point of
it hey you sent your money now but
you'll make money in the future do you
have any idea how stupid you sound right
now
like you you have any self-awareness i
mean that's basically how like a stock
market works
you do you have any self-awareness of
how stupid you sound right now
so you're saying that the stock market
works
in a way that is
parallel in terms of the mode of
production to how owning a pirate ship
in the 1400s works
am i i mean like sinking money now for
for more profit in the future the
fundamental point is not more profit in
the future the long-term like the
long-term growth what are the long-term
goal goals of tesla is it simply to make
uh more money or is it to like go to the
moon again or is it to have selfish cars
it's this vision of the future that they
have for how society will work and what
kind of achievements society will
[Β __Β ] about this they make try to make
more money that's literally what that's
literally how they raise stocks in this
era that's how they raise stocks in this
era it's not even just a promise more
profit it's the promise of this vision
that's literally how stock raising works
in this era
you call me an idealist while you
believe this idea is [Β __Β ] like all
these ceos are just like
i don't know what idealism and
materialism mean you really don't
why suddenly do you have an issue with
idealism
you just defended it 30 minutes ago
yeah well i i mean you can accuse me
this
criticizing dude for using the term
objectivity but i'm the idealist
yeah i i didn't criticize you for using
objectivity
yeah yeah you did you said you said i
was using buzzwords and you you said uh
well what is this objectivity what is
this object and stuff that's what you
were saying
well i mean like i just met an example
of words like you were just like
misusing words that you didn't even know
what they mean like i thought you know
what you're the one who doesn't get what
they mean like you're the one who thinks
that um but the point of a proletarian
uh party is to just force people to
uh follow its ideals that's literally
your vision you're also the one who said
that uh foreign countries uh for like
foreign communist countries can just
impose communism upon the world like you
really
realize that you just miss captain what
i say
or you just stupid but i mean
do not say that you support permanent
revolution
yeah
okay and uh
[Music]
[Applause]
what are you even saying i can't
understand you
are you just creating a voice
are you just like literally creating
noise is that is that what you're doing
you're just mad annoying bro
you know you just don't even know what
you're saying at this point you're just
like spewing out random [Β __Β ]
dude you're coping why don't you address
my argument then if we're talking about
random [Β __Β ] why don't you address my
argument you said some [Β __Β ] like
this
all those other things have been
assimilated into serving the brand you
dumbass
we're not saying they don't care about
money anymore obviously they have to but
it's all for the brand
that's very vague of what you mean by
brand the brand is literally the entire
chain of production that coheres the
company
it's the whole company itself
is maya in vc now
oh she's here
yeah get in vc maya
she can't because her
roommates are there i told her bring
your roommates too
i know it's not zircon i don't think
it's zirco
but how do you know
we're waiting
are we done
derek so you can see
what oh sorry derek
uh let's just say i agree to disagree
that's such a cool
i i i i i don't feel like i learned a
damn thing like it just seems like it
was just buzzwords and [Β __Β ]
yeah that's why you didn't learn a damn
thing because you're just being ignorant
you still want to be a backstage show
runner
i just had some taco bell what does that
have to do with anything
all right where's maya
oh my god she's scared to she's scared
to get exposed as someone who [Β __Β ]
like she's with roommates and she's
embarrassed by being an infrared
why she's not
[Music]
okay
what the [Β __Β ] maya has a new name
in the discord what the [Β __Β ]
did she change her name herself
yeah
i didn't do anything
[Laughter]
here's the new name
shut up derek
so derek you lost
take the l man
maya is literally full of [Β __Β ] she's so
scared to debate
she always is in a discord saying all
this [Β __Β ] but she's too embarrassed
to be associated with any of it in real
life
appreciate you
when you when you just type the amount
so we're not getting stannis or maya
okay i'm kicking this guy out you lost
dude derek you lost
all right i'm gonna go now
all right see i'm gonna i'm gonna head
out to you guys