Haz from Infrared Has Another Convo with Jackson Hinkle 🚀 Infrared Content Catalog

yo what up man

yo

what's up

what's up man long time

oc how you been

good let me just make sure we're uh good

to go on my end with the audio

um can you talk a little bit

uh yep i'm right here

a little bit

okay

ah

i don't think that worked

i basically so i'm on uh oh wait wait

wait i know what i need to do i know i'm

i'm not using stream labs i'm using uh

stream yard

oh okay

and that [ __ ] is streets

so let me do one thing a little bit

different you've been using stat the

whole

time

what's that you've been using stream

yard this whole time

no

um

but wait let me see this

okay i think this should work

okay let's try this again um

try this again say something

uh hello testing testing

mike seeing if it works

there we go we're good to go okay cool

um no i use so i use streamlab for a

while

and then

streamlabs

i don't know why it just kind of like

would always like i i would have my

stream drop

and

it would i would like have like terrible

terrible streaming issues even though i

have really good wi-fi

um i got fiber

so

i think it's like um it's probably the

settings with like the bit rate and you

have to like actually manually

do that kind of stuff like you got to

set the fps the bit rate all that kind

of stuff

i did that and it was good for a while

and then i like

when it wasn't good i reached out to

streamlabs support and twitch support

and like twitch support basically said

like oh like that's a streamlabs issue

so i reach out to them

and then they help me and it was good

for a little bit and then it just like

i don't know i had the same problem but

stream yard honestly works for most

things and apparently now works well for

this so

yeah yeah yeah well it's good to have

you here i want to i want to introduce

you to my audience so this is paws from

infrared for those of you who do not

know

uh infrared i mean i've i've talked

about and maybe you can talk a little

bit about what infrared is like as a

whole like as a collective if you define

it as such but um

you guys have a youtube you have a pop

and discord you have the twitch where

you mostly hang out um and i want to put

these up on the screen for everyone so

you know where to go

yeah yeah well

actually i can't because i'm already

okay no stream marriage is a bit streets

okay so yeah just explain it i like what

infrared is who you are uh for everyone

who isn't familiar with your work

sure so we were we started out as kind

of like a collective trying to do a

podcast

um we've been together for like

many years now you know maybe probably

like five six years

and

we just kind of share a very different

vision of the world you know from a

perspective of politics and ideology

than most of the kind of leftists

in western countries that we've

encountered and our kind of perspective

is very informed more from like um

perspectives in non-western countries

right and we thought that people here in

america and elsewhere were doing a

really bad job of translating

marxist leninist ideas

from these non-western countries to the

west so we wanted to do a different

approach to that

and um yeah we wanted to like i guess um

give people a different idea of what

marxism leninism is

as opposed to the kind of mainstream

like we wanted to show people that

there's another side to this

that's not really being given adequate

representation

um

so we you know our basic stick is that

we want to have unique perspectives on

things we don't want to like we see that

there's something wrong with the current

approaches and we also align ourselves

uh

with

the global phenomena of populism you

know we consider this

to be something the left has really

lagged on as far as um

being able to make sense of it and lead

you know

yeah you guys offer and i like i

recently watched the the stalin video

you put out um that was really well done

but you guys offer something that

really hasn't been offered by any

content creator on the left that's

at the quality that you're producing it

at um which i think is super important

because like if your goal is to get out

this information to as many people as

possible and to make it and meet people

where they're at is a good way of

putting it um then it has to be

relatable it has to be good content and

you all do it you do a really good job

of that and your stream is funny as hell

um so that's entertaining as well and

you also debated vosh right you i mean

yeah so it's a funny story with that

um

so the day it happened

i just had people messing me like hey do

you want to debate bosch and i was like

i considered this like a long-term goal

right so i was like

really now or like in 15 minutes i was

given like a you know a 15 minute heads

up and i was like okay let's do it um

so i got i got on and uh

i kind of was i was actually i was super

aggressive you know like because i i

just thought this is the biggest debate

lord

on youtube right now and it's like

i considered him the final boss so i was

just you know going at it

and he after like 12 minutes he just

left the call

yeah similar similar to how mine ended

up too i mean dude literally if there's

anyone that ever debates him to his left

who's like a moderately good debater

just immediately like you know rage quit

that that's all you can do

yeah i i really don't think he has a

sense of pride you know most of us have

a sense of like pride like if we get

challenged

and you know we want to end up but you

know vash has actually been pretty

transparent in the past about the fact

that for him the only thing that matters

is

furthering his specific political agenda

um and he said like he's willing to lie

he's willing to be dishonest as long as

it fulfills his his goal that's why he

says things like i don't do debates

unless i know i can i'm going to win you

know like

so

that's kind of the person we're dealing

with there you know i yeah so

and he still gets smacked he still gets

smacked yeah well well like i said you

know he he he started that debate with

you

and he he laid it out what he thought he

said

you know

uh if by the end of this

you don't agree with me it's because

you're mentally ill like he was that

confident that you just had it in the

bag you know

yeah yeah

um

well yesterday you did a really

interesting stream um

in which you you pained yourself

listening to hassan [ __ ] for

like i don't even know how long it was

it was a while but you you were

listening and talk about basically lie

about marxism through his however many

you know hundreds of thousands of

viewers and uh

then they posted the video on youtube

and it and it has racked up another of

several i think it's like 150 000 views

on youtube already wait what

yeah wait my video or his video oh no no

no no his video okay think i thought

like you said somebody clipped it and it

went viral i was like oh wow

that'd be sick that's the goal that's

the goal yeah but like

that's exactly actually what i wanted to

get at because

um like how it how infuriating is it to

you

and frustrating is it to you to see

someone like hassan

go out there and just completely

misinform people who probably would uh

be open-minded and uh respond well to

like what actual marxism is yet he's

he's telling them that like this

reformist

democratic party um like

pseudo-progressivism is the answer

yeah you know you know for me the kind

of place i'm coming at is that i'm more

of a meat and potatoes guy you know

ideology is not that important to me

um so i kind of have to see it at that

level and what it what it really is is

that hassan is telling his viewers that

like oh

it's almost like he's making it into a

religion like oh marxism is just this

kind of niche

idea that

we use to supplement and it's just like

that you know we should have workers

co-ops

and um

but that's only if we're like feeling

especially edgy and dangerous and

adventurous or whatever like he's he's

treating it like it's this kind of um

supplement to this cookie-cutter

democrat position

and what i really want people to

understand is that marxism is not some

kind of like moral

theory about

some like that there should just be

worker co-ops marxism has ambitions

that are at the ex you know executive

level of power it's at a level of scale

of the modern um economy uh as a whole

it's not just like some side project you

do

uh at you know

opening a pizza shop that's a co-op and

and the reason hassan would prefer it to

just be this kind of like pizza shop

thing

is because he wants people to not

keep their eye on the ball as far as

where real politics is happening which

is at the executive

level of state power i mean at that

level hassan told his viewers to go vote

for biden

he still won't account for you know his

mistake as far as the overall strategy

political strategy

yeah of the country is concerned he

won't admit that people like jimmy dore

were right and he and his uncle were

wrong

so he's distracting them with this like

nonsense about marxism that it's like oh

yeah marxism is this idea that you know

we should we should all run every you

know it's really funny this was the

highlight of the stream to me was that

when he was like

yeah and you know like the way you think

about this like workers ownership of the

means of production is like it's like me

you know i'm a streamer

i own my computer and i can you know

stream whenever it's just like being a

streamer

like yeah

i i i just i don't know i mean um how

could a how could a self-proclaimed

socialist

go about pretending like could you

imagine hassan just like going up to

like a coal miner or something and just

being like yeah man it's just like

streaming you know

all you it's you're gonna be just like

me you know you're just gonna

you know

it's it's ridiculous it's absurd

it would be like uh it'd be like the

stephen crowd i think it was i think it

was a crowder moment when didn't he get

like slapped in the face by some union

worker he got like punched out or

something

yeah yeah you know what i i think it is

that's what i said last night too it's

it's like marie antoinette let them eat

cake you know oh yeah just everyone will

be a streamer like me it'll be just like

that

yeah you know yeah and and the other

part in the in his video he was

basically he was trying to try to relate

to the average worker and he said you

know he's like bro i worked at a startup

and he's like you know my

uh i didn't have control over my

intellectual property and um this

basically means that you know i wasn't i

didn't have full control over the things

i produced in my labor whatever and and

he he was he was posturing all this as

if he was working at like some small

startup or something when literally he

was working at the young turks

because of his uncle

and like the young turks was not a

startup when when

when hassan started working there it was

like i mean how many years like over 10

years has been going well to be fair i

mean there's nothing that really

conjures to mind the image of the

working man then um

a uh a young you know a young guy

working for their uncle's media company

you know

that is the quintessential you know

american worker

yeah yeah no she was wild i i couldn't

even believe it and it's like

bro like no wonder no wonder like we

this the left right now is such a so

many people feel politically homeless is

because like this dude is supposed to be

the answer he's like posturing himself

as like the answer to all of our all of

our problems and stuff

um

you know what

sorry go ahead one of the other crazier

parts of the stream i found was when he

someone asked him like well uh you know

communism has never worked marxism has

never worked in history and he conceded

that he was like yeah well yeah no it it

hasn't ever worked and i'm like do you

have you have you ever like picked up a

history book like you have any

recollection of or even like

have you even looked at what china is

doing right now they've eradicated

extreme poverty in their country um

you look at what cuba is doing

despite the economic warfare that

they've been under for decades it's like

how can you how can you actually say

that as a leftist

and the answer i think is he's just not

really a leftist if you're saying some

[ __ ] like that then you're not really a

leftist

well i mean one of their usual

approaches is like well if we you know

if we if we own that history then it's

gonna scare people away from the word

but it's like dude

they already think biden is like stalin

okay so if you're going around calling

yourself a socialist like you're gonna

you're gonna have to embrace that

history if you don't wanna do that don't

call yourself that you know

um yeah

i mean let yeah like let's be honest if

it wasn't for the soviet union and china

and all of this cold war and all that i

mean would the word communism have any

power or be interesting what's no i mean

those are the things that gave the word

clout and relevance in the first place

yeah and the other thing is like

the

the successes of these countries

um

are not scary like if if hassan did the

due diligence of actually explaining to

his audience the successes that these

countries have had be it in like i can

uh you know like

um like economic uh literacy or

education or literacy or um health care

or

uh you know distribution of wealth like

these these are like these are

objectively good things

and

by continuing to like concede this

[ __ ] point that marxism has failed

or communism has failed and every place

that's been tried

it's

it's perpetuating this myth that it

can't work if it were to be applied here

in our own american way that was based

on you know american progressivism so

um honestly i think it's detrimental uh

to the movement as a whole it's

detrimental in the same way that like

aoc and bernie sheepdogging people into

the democratic party is detrimental

yeah i mean you know one of the things

is is that

we we're so we're dealing with a new

very dangerous ideology that's that's

emerged recently right maybe we can just

vaguely call it democratic socialism and

and it's kind of almost kind of a

religion it's this idea that well

um

we have this ideal of a perfect society

it's it's never existed anywhere on

earth

but we're always going to go back to

that as that our ultimate end goal

that's going to justify like all of our

positions now

so you know we'll support biden we'll

even support americans foreign

interventions but all in the name of

this supposed end goal that has never

been realized anywhere and has

absolutely no reality and it's not so

much about the end goal as much as it is

their new religion that allows them to

justify

continually supporting

the democrats i mean if you think about

it it makes sense if if they can just

pretend that they're doing it all in the

name of this like imagined you know end

goal

then they can justify anything that the

democrats do right i mean like if you

confront them for example with the fact

that oh but what about the

inconsistencies what about you know the

track record of the democrats what about

the corruption what about by what

biden's doing they could just be like

well yeah but the world is shitty anyway

and this is just a closer step to this

you know real this end goal we have in

mind

so it's a really nefarious and you know

like here on twitch for example

on political twitch you see people

saying things like

oh you know like uh it would be a good

thing if america overthrew the

governments of china and north korea

because that would make them more

democratic and democratic being a

democracy is a necessary step to

realizing our special vision of

democratic socialism so actually

um

american imperialism is spreading

socialism you know

i mean that's kind of what this ideology

is is leading to and and the super

dangerous thing about that sorry to me

to ramble is that

when you when you look at fascism

historically right real fascism

it came out of the movement of social

democracy that's where it emerged and it

it was really following this path of

like

social democracy becoming a form of

social chauvinism like our nation is the

best way to realize our goals and then

that was pretty much a stepping stone to

the whole phenomena of fascism

so i see something like that

on its way to

being realized

in uh this new democratic socialism

thing

yeah and you you know what's scary about

it also is the fact that like

i mean there are parallels that could be

made to like those critiques that uh

linen brought up and satan revolution of

like social chaveness

like to what's happening right now like

you see this

this pseudo-progressive movement that's

rising to power and it's in in its own

way

is uh engaging in this authoritarian

power grab

um of this country like the way in which

uh the progressives from like elizabeth

warren to aoc

uh to all the other justice democrats

are

bolster bolstering the security state

they're um exploiting what happened on

january 6 to give billions more to like

police capitol police and capital

security and wage this new war on uh on

like domestic terror as they define it

it's really scary and i don't see it

going down like anything but a bad path

and um

you know someone who's been really

documenting it well that i hope to have

a conversation with soon about it is uh

and i have disagreements with him on

other issues but like glenn greenwald

has been laying this out so beautifully

and it's like

it's really terrifying it's really

terrifying because like

i remember i remember during the um

primary season like

my my art teacher from high school he

was like a big elizabeth warren

supporter for some

reason i don't know why but he was and

he he like

he reposted something about elizabeth

warren's plan to crack down on uh like

on like hate speech and fake news on

facebook and social media apps and i'm

like that is not a good thing that is

not something that a leftist like you

claim to be should be standing for but

people are getting duped into it by uh

the fact that these these so-called

progressives are

weaponizing like progressive language to

achieve these these really authoritarian

goals it's frightening

um

yeah uh

sorry i my dream just got

dated

oh you're good yeah i just got bots

raiding my chat this happens like every

time i talk about like a spicy issue

that's bothering a certain you know

political ideology this this actually

happens so it's actually kind of really

yeah

but anyway um

you know

here's the thing we left this real

leftist i should say

we have to be very careful be and we

have to learn the lessons of history

it is so easy for us to be duped you

know we we really just don't pay

attention and we kind of

just you know

human beings

when they see others signaling in ways

that are familiar to them they just kind

of overlook it right but we have to

really

understand there's really a difference

between

what's on the surface and what's really

going on

and

the troubling thing that we have to come

to terms with is the fact that

this you know pseudo-progressive

democratic socialist or whatever we call

it ideology has proven to be perfectly

compatible with the deep state american

imperialism the cia all of the

military-industrial complex and

corporate america we have to really and

seriously reflect

uh on what is actually emerging because

i see i genuinely i don't mean to be an

alarmist but i genuinely see parallels

to historical fascism

this is kind of this is pretty much how

fascism came to be leftists really

weren't paying attention

you know some of these chauvinists

sounded leftist and they sounded like

they were progressive and then all of a

sudden this this new monster just

emerged that they had no way of making

sense of

so it's it's very important for us to be

vigilant that there this is j really

something evil and and dangerous that's

you know

coming into being

and it's cloaking itself in the disguise

of like oh it's being super progressive

socially and all this kind of stuff but

what's really going on is you know this

is i think that this is the new

religion and ideology of american

imperialism we see that american

imperialism is in decline all across the

globe so one of the new forms of soft

power is exporting this kind of

religious you know religion of

pseudo-progressivism

uh and

the whole i mean the american left as we

know it is

is pretty much just going along with it

they're not even questioning it

yeah i agree and given that we both see

that to be the case i'm curious how you

would approach

a conversation

when someone like hassan is uh focusing

like so so much on the fact that like

what he wants is democratic socialism

and that this is what marxism is like

them he he continues to harp on

democratic socialism and as you pointed

out in your reaction to his video

yesterday like

marx and engel weren't talking about

democratic socialism they were talking

about like proletarian dictatorship

that's what they were talking about so

i'm curious how you would respond to

someone like hassan uh or someone who's

again like cloaking this this

authoritarian power grab that we're

seeing from these mainstream progressive

figures like the squad the justice

democrats the people that hassan

supports

um

when in fact they're using these like

these

progressive terms like democratic

socialism to try and achieve their goals

yeah you know

it's it's almost the sad thing is is

that it's not even so much a debate

between like revolutionary marxism

versus reformism because even on the

reform front

some like these people are totally

impotent they can't even get health care

you know

so they wouldn't even force a vote on

medicare for all dsa wouldn't even do

that yeah that's that's what i mean so

what i really you know like i said i

think um monsters are supposed to be

materialists right and the basic idea

with that is that we're supposed to

focus on the meat and potatoes behind

things etiology is oftentimes a

distraction and when we look at the meat

and potatoes all of this kind of

pretentious ideological stuff hassan is

talking about

is just an excuse for the objective and

material reality of his poli his

political impotence he's still just

trailing along the mainstream media and

the democrats and and the deep state

and

you know um

all everything he's saying is just an

excuse for that i mean he he might you

know pretend like he he wants this

democrat socialist society or whatever

but the real thing going on is that he's

just making excuses for why

he can't break from the democrat the

democratic party and

break from the kind of american ruling

class

but you know to be clear

what hassan and all these other

democratic socialists are saying has

absolutely nothing to do with marxism or

you know marx and engels

um

marx and engels you know did not

virtue signal about democracy at all

um

they didn't you know try to pander to

liberals and you know whatever they

they often thought

liberals were

at a certain point harming the movement

and getting in the way of building a

real

more kind of populistic working class

movement that also relates to the

peasantry

so

i think one of the reasons they use

marks and angles ideas is because it

gives them legitimacy marx is very old

and

he's got a big beard so he looks like he

was smart and

i don't know i mean i feel like they're

trying to turn marx into like the

democratic socialist dumbledore you know

if that kind of makes sense it's almost

like an aesthetic yeah

yeah no i agree with that because like

nothing that they claim to be supporting

in the current state of like at least

american politics resembles anything

that marx would have supported

mark marx would have

like all all prominent marxists would

have laughed at the squad and the

justice democrats and what they

honestly what they're even trying to do

but also what they've become you know

like it's just

it's it's so ridiculous and like there

there isn't like any single ounce of

effort from any of the justice democrats

speak out against like

you know u.s imperialism or

the security state it's like those are

those are untouchable issues those are

those are the issues that will expose

them if they get caught talking about

them and we've seen it like a few times

you see talked about venezuela a few

times didn't go well um but like there's

some issues that like they just they

just don't talk about and you see that a

lot from

hassan and the other and like in bread

tubers uh who will just refrain from

talking about certain issues or certain

stories because they know that if they

do talk about those issues in those

stories they're going to look like fools

in front of their in front of their

audiences so they tiptoe around and find

ways to continue to try and defend uh

the democratic party and joe by i mean

like it just still drives me insane that

like

all of these people who claim to be

marxist socialists vash hassan they they

all encourage their audiences to vote

for joe biden

like you've lost all my respect at this

point if you're encouraging your fans

for [ __ ] joe biden it's insane i mean

this is what i said last night i said

it's one thing to not do anything right

maybe you could be critiqued for just

you know not doing anything

but you didn't have to like tell people

to go vote for biden

at the very least you didn't have to

completely ruin

your credibility and just tell people

that this was a choice they had to make

yeah exactly it's really pathetic you

know i mean it's like the democratic

party made it very clear that they don't

care about the will of the voters they

don't care about democracy or the will

of the constituents

the and the fact that the people who are

supposed to be the vanguards of a

populistic or socialistic

movement in america

that's pretending to want to overthrow

the establishment

they should be the first ones to say

okay well if you don't care you know why

are they doing it for free i don't get

it are they getting paid are they what

do they gain from this you know

here's what i think i have a theory i

think what they gain from it

is being able to play among us with aoc

what they gain from it is

you know being able to have connections

in the corporate and political

establishments and that's pretty much

who they're siding with they just want

those opportunities they want those

connections they want to be insiders

they want to be part of what george

carlin called the big club and that's

why i think they're doing it they're

trying to climb ladders and become

established you know

alternative media

has really been a rival to the

mainstream media online media has and i

think what these people are trying to do

is they want to get a foot in the door

to becoming legitimized and established

and that's that explains a lot of the

reasons why

they assume the positions they do

yeah i mean i i think you uh i think you

hit the nail on the head like that

that's exactly what's happening and and

you look at

you know the

like the media agencies the

representatives that all these people

have and it's like they all run in the

same circles you know like the the me

too propagandists that are covering up

um you know for joe biden in the face of

like uh tara reid's story and all the

other women who've come out against him

like those same people are the same

people who are uh representing like jake

huger and other voices at the young

turks like it's the same little

incestual pool of like political and

media elites they all run in the same

circles together

and i thought it was really interesting

in your stream when you were talking

about that yesterday specifically with

um

i don't really know destiny's history

with twitch but you were you were saying

something like

uh

destiny for those of you who don't know

destiny is a uh like a fat neo liberal

streamer like the the biggest neoliberal

streamer in the world i don't mean like

fat like physically fat i mean like he's

just like the biggest neoliberal on the

planet and it rank imperialist and like

twitch has had a rockier relationship

with destiny from what i understand you

were saying than with hassan

um yet hassan postures himself as

someone who's like anti-corporate

anti-establishment anti-amazon who owns

twitch yet

the amazon owned twitch has been more

hostile to destiny uh in so far as like

you know carrying out their community

guideline restrictions and all that

stuff than they have been with hassan

that's the crazy thing i mean destiny is

more critical of

you know policies he tends to be more

critical of

narratives not in terms of the

mainstream media but just in the twitch

culture you know

and that's a it's a super weird thing

it's like

and and the reason is obvious because

destiny openly admitting his position

and just being honest about it

oh it almost produces it almost subverts

the thing he's trying to defend you know

the best way to defend the status quo

isn't by directly identifying with it

but by pretending you're otherwise you

know if you directly identify with it

it's almost like the it produces this

effect of absurdity which actually

undermines it

and i think that's what destiny's done

um in the case of hassan hassan's done a

much better job of defending the status

quo because he doesn't actually take

responsibility for it he says oh well

because i mean

the layman obviously sees problems with

the system right

and if you you have to take some kind of

you have to like make sense of those and

take account of them right so hassan

does that while at the same time

reproducing that same system and that's

a much more efficient way

than just like denying the problems

altogether which is kind of what destiny

does

yeah no i'd have to agree with that what

you you've had a few conversations with

destiny

how has that been is he is he more of

like uh you feel like he's more of just

generally like an honest dude than than

someone like bosh

yeah well way more than vlos from from

my limit i mean i've i've talked to him

quite a bit

um i don't really know him that well so

it's hard to judge his character but

he's he's he's um a pretty friendly

pretty

he seems honest to me you know he he

doesn't really take things personally

when it comes to politics

doesn't seem petty and he i really do

believe that when he says things he

believes it he doesn't lie yeah you know

he believes what he says the issue with

vosh is that he lies very openly and

it's really scary how like

he doesn't there's it's like you know

usually when people lie you just kind of

like

you see this have an effect on them in

some way and boss just does it with like

empty cold eyes he just lies with no

problem whatsoever

yeah he does he does

um it's it is frightening it's again all

tying it back like the the

tens of thousands hundreds of thousands

of people that listen to them and they

just like

they flat out lie to their audience

every day it's crazy um i know i'm

jumping around a little bit but if a few

minutes ago you said something to the

effect of like

you're more concerned with the meat and

potatoes of any given situation uh and

you try i mean like i think we can both

agree that like learning history

learning theory are good things but like

you try not to let that get in the way

of actually fighting for

um the things that are right in front of

us

do you see that like um like okay so

jimmy dore i don't think that he's he

even considers himself a marxist i i

never heard him talk about marxism but i

know some people in my chat have said in

the past like oh he doesn't really

consider himself a marxist

would that be like a good example of

like kind of what you're talking about

yeah i think it's a perfect example i i

mean

just to be completely honest with you as

a marxist leninist i've been pretty

annoyed at the so supposed rise of

marxism and even marxism leninism in

america i see it as a distraction from

the concrete and authentic

uh

populist movement that's

kind of represented in part by people

like jimmy dore

i think people are you know a lot of the

time people are turning to marxism

as a way of avoiding reality we're in

react when actually the point of marxism

is that it's supposed to help us clarify

the reality right like the point of

marxism isn't

to like create our own

you know um vision and just impose that

on reality it's to discern the real and

concrete material contradictions

in reality and if you do that you are

led to the the fact that

um

the site of a working class uh

populistic movement is gonna be from

people like jimmy dore and i i think

marxism has to prove its worth

uh as far as being useful to these kinds

of movements and not the other way

around it's not jimmy dore's job to

prove

he's a marxist it's

it's the job of marxist to be able to

make sense of

jimmy dore's popularity and the

widespread need and

desire on part of the american people

for an alternative

um so we marx is we have to serve the

people we can't tell the people to serve

us and our

you know

ideological agendas

so no that's a that's a good point yeah

so i've been very wary and kind of

suspicious of

a lot of this kind of um

new found interest in in marxism and i

think it can be led in a good direction

but at the same time it is oftentimes a

distraction

yeah and you especially see that when

people say things like oh jimmy dore is

just a social democrat and it's like

okay but what decisive significant if

that's true what decisive significance

does that have for concrete reality

because the concrete reality is that

he's telling people to get away from the

democrats and look for alternatives and

that is a real

step one

yeah

and and

beyond that like the the dude who

considers himself a socialist a marxist

vosh he's he's telling people

that

uh based on

quotes from linen that linen would have

wanted all of you to vote for joe biden

so it's like

it doesn't get any more backwards than

that right like using

um lennon's words to try and and

manipulate people into voting for one of

the most ranked corporatist careers

politicians racists you know like

imperialist on the planet it just makes

no sense so

uh

sorry glenn

no what were you gonna say i was gonna

say there's there's like two there's two

really

you know

just glaring reasons why that's like

such a silly thing for volsh to say the

first one is that

lennon never taught he never lennon

never spoke of tactic political tactics

in individual terms like oh you random

stranger should

vote this way i mean voting was a matter

internal to the party the party would

decide

you know if they should

engage in this kind of political action

so that alone makes what wash says

flatly wrong but more interestingly is

that if you look at the history of what

separated lenin and the bolsheviks from

people like dementia

it was actually a fact that

what lenin was actually saying was that

yes the proletarian revolution must be

united

with the democratic revolution to

overthrow the tsar based right the kind

of more progressive democratic one but

lenin had a very um unique insight here

so the menshevik said that the

implications of that is that

the proletarian movement has to follow

the liberal big bourgeoisie that were in

the cities

the joe bidens of their time right we

have to the mensheviks basically we're

saying that

we can put this

revolution on hold and we can just

um

follow the progressive big bourgeoisie

lenin

uh had a very had a genius response to

this and which you know is why he's such

a historical genius he said first

this big bourgeoisie you're talking

about is in bed with the czar they're

not going to be able to overthrow the

czar they're in bed with the czar right

just like joe biden

is not going to be able to eliminate

um you know the

america's um oil industry and all that

kind of in the insurance industries it's

the same thing we're dealing with in a

way and the military-industrial complex

second lenin said

the actual

real

authentic progressive and democratic

forces are not going to be found in the

cities it's not going to be the big

bourgeoisie it's kind of it's going to

be this more

small bourgeoisie that you're finding

among the peasants you know kind of like

i guess they would be like comparable to

like small business owners today in

america now you're gonna find

the democratic forces

uh in the peasants

and the workers need to unite with the

peasants

and that's how they're going to be able

to overthrow um the czar that's how

they're going to be able to take power

by by you know just trailing the liberal

big bourgeoisie you're just

wasting your time basically right so

it's super ironic for volsh to say that

lenin would have advocated for voting

for biden when

i mean like the whole thing that

distinguished lenin from everyone else

during his time was

taking the opposite stance that

while you can't you know jump in in the

proletarian revolution alone

the real

um

the real

you know

allies the proletariats going to find is

going to be among the peasantry

and i my argument is that in america

that what's comparable to that is the is

you know the flyover states the rule

america yes i of

people who are voting for trump not all

of them but a lot of them you know it's

gonna be a lot of them yeah people who

are losing their jobs like in the coal

miners in west virginia

and you know those people are not

you know super socially progressive or

whatever

but that's where you're gonna find the

real forces of democracy

the real forces of

change you're not gonna find it by

trailing

the silicon valley pseudo progressives

um who are in fact

incapable of actually

initiating this kind of fourth

industrial revolution they're they're

too wetted with wall street they're too

wedded with

um the big fossil fuel companies and and

all so

yeah i'm sorry for going on a tangent no

no no i i thought that was extremely

insightful and it paints a

very accurate picture like where we're

currently at in this country and

yeah you i mean again you really you

really nailed it with um kind of like

as when you when you talked about like

flyover states you talk about the rust

belt

like these are the states that democrats

should be winning like hypothetically if

they were actually left this like you

know in control of the democratic party

but like

it's just it's never gonna happen and

it's not even the aims of the democratic

party anymore like the democratic party

is focused on targeting uh suburban

communities suburban voters now like

that's that's their target audience that

target audience does not give a [ __ ]

about you know security state uh the

security state beefing up or like

privacy intrusions or

um you know u.s imperialism like they

don't care about those things because

they've they've to a certain extent

relatively they've made it

and they're more concerned with like

uh the social issues or like what's

what whatever's being covered on like

cnn or msnbc you know like that's their

concern because they have the privilege

to only care about those things whereas

people in the flyover states people have

like lost their jobs lost like any and

all manufacturing within like a 100 mile

radius of where they live

like those are the people who are

suffering those are the people that we

should be uniting to try and rebuild

this country

um and that's why i i think you'd

probably agree with me that like so many

people in those states um

who had jobs that have been outsourced

via

you know like tpp permanent normal trade

relations

uh nafta like all of these

trade deals that are crafted by

multinational corporations um resonated

more

with trump's rhetoric than they did with

hillary clinton

who's the hut or the wife of the guy who

orchestrated all those deals in the

outsourcing of all those jobs

yeah well you know

you have a really viciously kind of

class chauvinistic attitude that

democratic socialists have

where

you know they are the same way i mean

they really do see these you know sub

you know more wealthy suburban americans

is like oh they're more progressive and

these are the people who are going to be

won over to socialism and all these

deplorables i just

hey you know it's almost like it's not

almost they're really a kind of

aristocratic

so it's like the aristocracy

like um

hundreds of years ago they have that

level of arrogance and

smog sense of social superiority

and and they become so detached from

ordinary americans that it's almost like

they think they're like a

some kind of separate species altogether

like they're just transcended

you know the american people and they're

just above it all

and

you know the truth is is that not only

are these people not opposing these new

security laws they're jumping for

they're jumping with joy when you know

they look at that they're saying okay

finally we're going to be able to rein

in america's majority

um because they've given up on actually

being able to persuade and win them over

and they really think that their fair

failure is because of some kind of

deficiency

on part of working americans and not

themselves and you you see these people

saying really nasty stuff you see i've

seen you know these i've seen democratic

socialist leftists

joke about the opiate crisis i've seen

them you know mock rule people talk

about how they're backward and

reactionary

um

like i said it's a really nasty kind of

ideology that's that's starting to

emerge

yeah it's an it's an

it's like a mindset that

you know anyone who's poor is just

irredeemable and they can't be a part of

this movement

uh because maybe they didn't go to an

ivy league and maybe they they aren't

aware of like

what what like gender pronouns are

something like that you know it's just

insane and and uh

everyone has room for growth but like

at the end of the day

the one thing that the left shouldn't be

doing is discounting the pain and

suffering that is being felt by so many

uh millions of americans all across this

country who are actually suffering at

the hands of capitalism you know

um i'm curious your thoughts i know we

briefly kind of talked about this when i

went on your stream um but i'm curious

your thoughts as far as like electoral

politics go um

obviously you don't support the

democratic party but you do you have

like any

candidates or politicians or anyone that

you're you currently look to as like a

fighter for change uh as it currently

stands like i think kashama swan is

doing or sean swan is doing a really

good job

i know that there's

there's an individual who i actually did

a stream with who's running for long

beach city council in california under

cpusa i'm curious your thoughts on like

the current state of like third parties

and and like outsider politicians

you know um i'm not too i don't i'm not

too kept up on what's going on in the

electoral races right now

i don't i'm not just i'm just not

informed enough but i will tell you

back in the day

in 2016

not sorry not 2016. this is like 2018 or

something

i remember

richard ogetta you know and i thought

this would be a force of change and this

would really initiate a new thing and

unfortunately that it seemed like that

fell through you know

i really saw something promising in him

back then

but to be honest with you um

it's it's really difficult to know

you know what where to go to from here

but

yeah i'm i'm not really dogmatic you

know i'm just looking for who can really

build a third-party alternative and

really inherit the force of 2016's

populism

and i think that's the number one

important thing right now is just

some kind of force that can transcend

america's false

division between like trump and these

so-called progressives

um

who you know

whether it's the people's party that's

gonna do that or whether it's you know

communist party which to me would be

like a dream but if it's not the

communist party i mean that's fine

whoever is worthy of succeeding that

mantle i'll get behind them you know

that's really what i'm looking at now

but i do think that while

it's important to

pay attention to local

realities at this level to build a

backbone of the movement we need to keep

our eye on the prize i mean our

ambitions must be

like nationwide and executive has to be

a movement that

will sweep the whole country you know

yeah and a lot of times people get this

idea like oh if you just do like praxis

and mutual aid

you know that's at least will feel good

and will feel cozy and it's like that's

a complete distraction we our ambitions

have to be

like big leagues you know yeah i mean if

we only preoccupy ourselves with like

i mean in theory if like everyone

was

making sure that their community was

like you know in check that would be a

good thing but that's not how it works

it's like

you know if we still have this this it's

really a one-party system in this

country that is controlling everything

and that that's the corporate state

then we're bound for failure we're bound

for more misery and more suffering so i

agree 100 with that

um

yeah

yeah it's like there's there's been

waves you know the the first one i think

the memory there's probably been before

it was occupy wall street that was

really like a moment where

it seemed like the establishment was

losing control

but they got that under control i mean

one of the ways they did that so was

flaming up the culture

i mean there's so many occupy people who

became like reactionaries and whatever

just because of the culture like tim

poole is one of them you know

actually it was kind of like before that

there was definitely before i was in

politics so i mean i'm not too privy to

that but that's interesting that you're

saying that because that like reminds me

so much of what's happening right now

yeah i mean so so occupy was was one of

those moments and then it kind of got

extinguished and then 2016 was the next

one

um there a lot happening between those

but i'm just trying to sum it up 2016

you had this kind of shock wave of

populism where it seemed like they were

scared the establishment and whatever

they were scared you know

and but they got it under control uh

eventually

and

now we're here you know and and joe

biden's the president but but covert

happened

20

20 20 and

uh there's it's really uncertain what

the kind of future we're going into now

because

if you look at europe uh the mainstream

media is not covering this

just recently you had a demonstration of

200 000 people in

reality yeah that is unreal all over

europe and france and germany and

elsewhere there is

just a shock wave of unrest and the

media isn't covering it

and i think they're they're not covering

it because they don't want it to spread

here but i do think it is gonna spread

here i think we're gonna see

something like that happen here it's

only a matter of time

so so i i haven't um

i actually haven't seen it yet either so

i i need to do some research but are you

saying

is it is it would you say it's similar

to like what you saw happen with like

yellow vest movement

it's seated so yeah it seems like it i

mean um

i mean we're we're looking at the delta

variants and and i don't really see her

a solution in sight yeah it seems like

we're really [ __ ]

and i guess there's a there's another

one too now that's like

it's uh they said there's a fourth one

that's gonna be it started in california

i guess that's where they first found it

and it's going to be

more

transmittable than any of the other ones

and it's it's not um

it did none of the vaccines apparently

protect it yet yeah well that's that's i

mean if it happens in like this is how

my mentality if i see on the news that

there's like a new thing in india it's

like okay it's coming here

yeah that was the delta varian you know

that i remember seeing the news about

delta and it was like why is it why

aren't people acting like this is like

gonna be here very soon because it is

gonna spread here if you find it in one

place in the world it's coming here you

know

very soon yeah so yeah that's gonna be a

thing and then what does that mean it

means there's gonna be turmoil economic

turmoil right they're people you know

how how is

life gonna go back to normal and how are

people gonna pay rent how are people

gonna get by

so

what's you know this i wouldn't be so

worried we're not like you'd think after

all this time we have a

socialist vanguard that's going to lead

us through these troubling times and

we don't i think a lot you know we we

should have the the infrastructure and

the backbone and

these all of these influencers and bread

tube and hassan to be the leaders of

some kind of alternative but they they

just chose the easy path and decided to

sell out or i don't know i don't know if

they sold out maybe they were like that

from the start but we it's like we have

no infrastructure to to deal with this

issue but that's what i always like to

say is you know people ask me like oh

haas how do they initiate the revolution

and i tell them

we're not going to initiate the

revolution it's it's going to happen i

mean

there are 200 000 people in berlin like

yeah that's gonna come here and

if you're not the one leading that that

sucks for you and it's also dangerous

because

some right-wing demagogue might come and

lead it you know i mean it's gonna

happen either way people are fed up so

it's your job to

[Music]

be the leader of that you know it's not

about creating something from scratch

it's about relating to

the american people and

it's a very gloomy it looks really

gloomy

as of now but i think

people like us real leftists

i think we should i mean you know to be

honest that's one of the reasons i

started streaming i started streaming

because

i see these media platforms as vehicles

to initiate

i think i don't see myself as the leader

of a movement or party but

just this information war

changes how people do things in real

life if that kind of makes

100 i mean like

i know i know like i oftentimes do bring

things back to this but like just

imagine if some earth just imagine if

like all of bread tube and hassan were

aligned on

uh forcing the vote on medicare for all

like oh god we'd have it i mean that oh

could you imagine it would be world war

four

like

if if they were if they all got in line

mobilized all of their viewers and they

were all on the same page

holy [ __ ] we would we would be living in

communism right now

you know i mean it was crazy

during that uh we had like groups of

like

uh

mainly honestly jimmy dore supporters

and members of like other audiences who

were getting together

during the week of christmas calling

into representatives offices um the the

i think it was like 13 justice democrats

we were targeting and basically

encouraging them to force the vote and

even with like

20 30 40 50 people calling in a given

day you know just going down the line

through the list of all the justice

democrats like

they they would literally reiterate to

us like the people on the other end of

the line they're like wow you guys have

called quite a few times today like 50

wow we got a few uh quite a few people

encouraging us to force the vote on

medicare for all with all their support

for pelosi now imagine if that number

was like

5 000

or 10 000

imagine it is and and you know that that

came from

i mean in part came from people like

jimmy dore you know and and you just

mentioned the justice democrats and who

started that it was influencers kyle

kolinsky and the young turks media you

know so

we we have to be really cognizant that

this media is a very powerful force

initiate things in real life

and and you know one of the things i

always tell my viewers is that

if i start getting hus like first of all

i gotta support myself right i gotta do

to do this full-time i gotta pay my

bills and

for my food whatever that's gonna come

from

but if i get to hassan level or the

there's houston's level with like all of

these viewers i tell my viewers we're

gonna do something with it you know i'm

not just going to sit here

complain about the world if we have a

way to start get the ball rolling on

something we're going to do that you

know

and yeah

uh

yeah so for me it's it's you know my i'm

i've been a pretty successful stream

bar but i don't see myself as like oh i

just going to want to be a streamer and

that's going to be my career i have

long term ambitions

i think that's what we need more of you

know like what what good is someone

who's uh

i mean

what

i i can't even say what's what good is

someone who's like fighting from just

behind a screen but like

all of these bread tubers and hassan

alike and and some of the you know

streamers on youtube they're literally

just putting out misinformation now but

um and lying audiences but like

what what good

in a hypothetical situation is just

someone who's sitting behind a screen

and um you know amassing

all this wealth if they're not going to

leverage their privilege to get on the

streets and and continue the fight or

build something you know build something

sometimes i think maybe this i'm just

being too generous maybe it's because

they lack media theory maybe it's just

because they've gotten used to this idea

that they're just reacting to the world

and not affecting it at the same time

like that's that's pretty much why

they've come to this conclusion where

they just justify anything the democrats

do because they fail to see

i mean like

how much

they can actually make a difference with

their platforms

they just see themselves as like

reacting to the world rather than

participating in it

that could definitely be um i feel like

there's a lot of that that goes on um

especially when i think about like well

one of the biggest shows right now is i

don't know if you watch it at all but

it's um it's breaking points and like

they are like a new show right like they

they kind of operate like a they they

tried to like

they tried to have like the setup of

like a mainstream news show it's crystal

ball and sauger and jetty

but like we all know that crystal has

like

actual you know progressive beliefs

um and kyle's right there kyle

kolinsky's right there like i think he

was co-hosting the show today and this

week and it's like

why why are you guys not like actually

trying to fight for something new why

are you just like reacting to the news

and doing this like when you could be

uh

debunking the news or debunking the

[ __ ] that's happening and pushing

for something new but like the

the the craziest thing is like when

kyle's ever um you know faced with like

an alternative option to what has

failed us and what he admits has failed

us the justice democrats it's like

he says oh you know i don't think a

third party could work i don't think a

third party could work and it's like

well it's not going to work if you don't

try

so it's especially not going to work if

you're spreading demoralization about it

platform exactly exactly

so i i've just never understood that but

that it is an interesting thing to think

about it's something i thought a lot

about and it's why i was i was so hyped

on forced vote and i was so hyped even

on

though there weren't a lot of uh action

calls behind it there were some uh the

march for medicare for all i thought was

great as well and it that that it felt

vibrant being out in the streets um

i would hope moving forward we have more

action-oriented uh you know

demonstrations and events

yeah yeah and like i said media is a

very powerful two-sided

people um i i've considered the idea of

like huh if i got big you know

thinking like far into the future

what if i organized like uh

some kind of like

beat up you know where we just

some kind of political meet up where

discuss new ideas and invite you know

like i'm thinking in those terms

where of like you know how to really

get the ball going in

i think there's a um

caleb maupin is have you ever had caleb

on your show yeah yeah i've talked to

him before yeah

we're like a big fan before i heard

about you i always consider caleb the

only other

because i don't really know ever any a

lot of people i just consider like oh

yeah caleb's like our only ally pretty

much

yeah there aren't the whole there aren't

a whole lot of allies i mean there

honestly i feel like there's way more on

youtube actually that do like youtube

streaming

um there's a lot more now i i don't know

what happened but there's been this new

wave of like i mean i feel like i'm a

part of that wave like i'm very new

um but there's this new wave of like

real lefty streamers um that have risen

up and it's it's cool to see but um i

think caleb is like through his

um the organization that he has it's

like a political organization the name

is slipping my mind is about center for

political innovation the cpi

yeah i think they're doing a um

a

yes center center for political

innovation i have the book right here

they're doing like a socialist

convention in santa barbara sometime

soon oh really i didn't know about that

wow yeah yeah i think i'm gonna go to

that it should be pretty where is that

gonna be at

uh santa barbara in california

yeah when is that

um le i have it right here

let me see it it sounds really sick

i love santa barbara too have you ever

been to santa barbara

no i've i haven't been to california

many times in general

wait you ha you haven't been to

california

no i've been there a few times but just

like not

not a lot i'm not there

um let's see here

oh it's coming up i think it's

august 28th 29th

oh yes

you know i i don't know i might

i don't know i can't commit to it but

yeah i'll consider going to that

yeah i mean i'll yeah that's that's

right up the alley of what you're

talking about sounds pretty cool it's

yeah

but it sounds pretty cool it does

honestly does is caleb gonna be there

uh i believe so yeah i believe so

yeah yeah i might i might i'm i'm gonna

write that down

i might do it

yeah it'd be cool

uh it'd be cool to get people together

for that for sure um

we should honestly i was thinking about

it before i i went live with you

we should do at some point

at some point i think a stream with like

you

me

caleb

um i don't know if jimmy's ever done

anything with with caleb but that would

be a that'd be a really if we i mean us

three alone would be like crazy but if

we could get jimmy as the fourth

that would be

that would be like the most legendary

stream of all time

that would be a legendary i know i was

like i was thinking about it right

before we went live i'm like [ __ ] that'd

be

that'd be a hype as [ __ ] yeah we'll see

i think that'd be good i think that'd be

good i mean why not that's another jimmy

someone just said uh less bone said

jimmy on twitch yeah jimmy's got to get

up i mean that would be insane if if

jimmy [ __ ] you know i want him to but

i also want him to be careful and not

get banned off twitch because if he gets

banned i will never be able to cover him

again you know really is that how it

works

oh yeah yeah i mean um yeah it's listen

uh i gotta tell you this

which is terms of service are not

intuitive

i mean there there are rules usually

you'd think youtube is a common sense

rules right

which is a different ball game the rules

are not based on common sense and you

like you actually do have to read them

because um

yeah they will they will definitely you

know

yeah very strict about it too so yeah if

someone's banned you can't show them or

quote unquote promote them on stream

um wow

yeah you you can't show i have to clear

this up i'm gonna try to get partnered

soon so and i'll have a manager and i'll

ask them but they have a thing about

hate symbols and i don't know if that

applies for like

the news and documentaries and stuff

yeah

um

so i got to get that cleared up it's

kind of ambiguous um

you also cannot show violence like

whatsoever um even if it's in a

documentary uh you can't show that i

remember that because i um during my

reaction to vosh's stream i had

something up and you were like you can't

have that up and i i didn't have any

idea

um i also i i also did reach out to

twitch last night they got back to me

very quickly but they um

they

they did say that they no longer do any

sort of like special agreements for

people who have uh large youtube

audiences as to as like mitigating the

twitch exclusive rule because for those

of you who don't know

if i wanted to become a an affiliate on

twitch which basically means you get

people that can like pay subs it really

does help your community grow like if

you're not an affiliate i'd imagine that

you know that's really mysterious you

said that because i remember there was a

guy who's

more of like a bread tube lefty

and i asked him like how are you dual

streaming he said yeah i called the

twitch and they were totally fine with

it and i think he still does it he's

still dual streams

that may have honestly may have been a

thing that they used to do but like

i

at first i got a robot that was like

responding to me and then i just like

kept saying like you know like [ __ ] you

you're not answering my question they

finally i got like a real person that

responded to me and they're like yeah no

we don't do that

so i don't know we'll see i got to think

about it because

it would it would help grow the channel

on twitch and i think it would be

important to like i've ex you know

discussed with you like i think it would

be uh beneficial if we could

take over twitch with a true

anti-imperialist left that doesn't lie

about autism

but it's tough because like i've built

my entire community on youtube that's

yeah so i used to i started on youtube

as well and then i started to dual

stream and then i made the ambitious

decision

go on start streaming on twitch

um i think i'm an outlier so i don't

know if i could use myself as an example

but

i started off getting less

a little bit less than usual right but

then i slowly grew and

yeah i'm way past the point of my dual

streams combined now

but um

it's definitely a tough decision to make

one of the reasons i prefer twitch

is the monetization model is just

first it's more consistent but you get a

more consistent idea of like the income

you're getting but that could actually

to be fair to be replaced with patreon

and then but another thing that twitch

does is that

subs allow you to grow the community

yes as well like when people give subs

to strangers they it incentivizes them

to be engaged

so yeah it's kind of

i think one of the biggest reasons i

moved to twitch

was because

um it's so much less

formal it's so much more informal you

know i could just like make an ass of

myself and it's whatever

you know like to me youtube is a is more

professional you know

yeah and it's different too because like

you stream for like an insane amount of

time you stream for

like six eight hours right like what's

your app i've been lagging recently i

mean i gotta up my game definitely but

the goal is to be like five six hours

yeah

yeah that's that's built different

that's built different i couldn't do

this well i mean like if if there's

another lockdown or a quarantine

hey yeah

really though like if there is like i

would have nowhere else to go so yeah

and at that point you'd probably be

doing like 8 10 11. hey you wouldn't

even believe it did you know like

there's people like xqc and they stream

for like 16 hours a day

really yeah it's unreal and that's like

the one of the biggest guys on twitch in

general

so yeah yeah it's kind of like tough

competition it's like oh [ __ ] i'm not

prepared to

i mean i'm i i get exhausted

streaming for four hours you know

by the four hour mark i need to like

stretch and

you know yeah i get exhausted streaming

for like two hours

i can't even man

but um yeah it is a different animal for

sure but i'm gonna i'm gonna try to

figure it out see what i can do um

it's just an it's just an it's a massive

massive audience pool that's being lied

to right now and i think it would be

beneficial for everyone if i mean like

again just going back to it like imagine

if we had all of the

political twitch viewership that was

like calling representatives encouraging

them to force the vote on medicare for

all back in back in december oh yeah

it'd be crazy i mean to be fair though

twitch does have more normies as they

call it a lot of my audience watches me

just because like they find me

entertaining not necessarily because

like they care about the politics but

to me it's it's worth it just if if the

cracks can slip through a little bit you

know

like if uh for example like if they're

willing to hear me out sometimes about

politics and stuff that's worth it

enough to me you know

yeah i i think that i mean that to a

certain extent i think that's like most

political streamers unless you're like

strictly news unless you're strictly

news but i feel like most political

streamers on twitch it's like a good

chunk of like you know uh chatting

gaming um react content and political

content so it's like you know what one

of the things that i don't know are you

a gamer

i have played i i play a little bit but

not a lot

oh yeah what games do you play literally

barely anything i i play i have on my

i have a destiny

oh wow

and i have um i have this pirate game

that's fun i forget what it's called but

you likes

yeah really you play that

sea of thieves yeah that's that's like

one of the only games i play every once

in a while

and i have among us but i hate that game

yeah i've never played among us but uh

that's crazy you have sea of thieves

yeah that's crazy you know um

that's the one thing that's been just

consistently tough for me gaming streams

i mean people

people do not watch me to play games you

know

so yeah when i start gaming it's like

that's people's cue to like okay we got

to do something else

yeah

maybe you just got the right game yet

can you play like 2k i love 2k

sports games no no i never really

oh yeah i never got into them oh no no

but can you play them on twitch oh yeah

you should be able to play 2k i don't

see why not

actually i don't know

it's so weird you mentioned that

i've never seen someone play that on

twitch

no i'm thinking about it too and i i

would be like

well

honestly like i wouldn't really get

a lot of enjoyment off of watching

someone else play 2k but like if there's

something i play it there's a category

sorry

there is yeah there's a category yeah

yeah you don't get a lot of viewers it's

kind of

it doesn't get a lot of viewers

we need to tap into that i feel you know

who you know who actually does play 2k

uh streaming is aiden ross i know aidan

ross that's right yeah that's how he got

big you're right

because he played it with like brawny

yeah yeah

i think lebron james actually played

against aidan ross at one point

really that is crazy yeah aaron ross is

like an outlier on the twitch scene

because

like it's so funny yeah here's the thing

so all these people who are big on

twitch more or less they're all like

friends with each other right and they

all came from the he calls it the austin

show now it was like this

yeah yeah they used to do that yeah and

they all came from that you know and

they're all friends with each other and

it's like a big club

and one of the reasons i like aiden is

cause like he just

he just did his own thing he didn't even

like associate with those people he just

rose to the top by himself you know

yeah no it's cool that he did that and

he's got his own thing he's got like the

freestyling he does with rappers got 2k

and then also it's like now he literally

lives in a i mean i don't know how much

you follow him but he lives in a house

with uh mike malak and uh

like some of the um

some like who else is i think i think

there's like

there's some random youtubers who live

in that house it's like mike malak

there's some big gamer that lives in the

house and then

rice gumly i i think rice gum lives

there and phase phase banks that you're

talking about yeah yeah yeah

there

and

then there's some chick that lives there

too

one of beret or something like that

um but like he's like built this entire

like and he's kind of like the center of

it he's the most popping one and he just

he just went on impulsive too logan paul

show and blew up on that episode too i

mean kids on another level wow i mean

yeah that's crazy

yeah

a

random brand tangent but it does go to

show that you can build something

outside of the current uh

the current like the club basically

of like twitch twitch streamers

yeah yeah i mean yeah that's crazy it's

like you know one thing twitch is

lagging behind youtube though is that we

don't do twitch boxing matches

the beef hasn't gotten that big people

like start doing that

let's go

you know believe it or not a random

person one time just told vosh that i

wanted to box him

and really yeah and vos was like oh i

would destroy him so the person came to

me and i messaged them and i was like

hey

i heard you wanted to box

um

you know i i can do it like two weeks or

a month from now no way and he didn't

respond and then like the next day

someone asked him and he was on stream

he's like yeah

oh yeah uh infrared did message me but

he sent some kind of like weird

sexual [ __ ] and i had to literally show

my chat the dms he was lying

he's not so [ __ ] up it's like

you'd say that yeah i literally just

told him i was like yeah i'll box you in

two weeks

no way that would be funny as hell

well he he says he's six too but

the thing is is i don't i don't know if

that's the case he he took a photo with

like tim poole

and he he didn't seem like he could be

more than an inch taller than tim poole

how how tall are you i'm only five nine

but

i think he's only five i think at most

he's five eleven he could even be 510

but

you got the speed though you got the

speed yeah

yeah i mean whether i'll win or not i

don't know maybe i'll lose but i'll do

it you know it's content

you box

no i i mean um not box but i have

experience in martial arts

okay

yeah i mean it's all it's

yeah similar principles i think i would

like to learn to box in like two weeks

or something and

yeah i mean it wouldn't be enough

obviously but but it's content

it's content it's content seems fun

though

yeah yeah

i don't know i i i could definitely get

into that that'd be that'd be lit

yeah i guess we'll have to we'll have to

pioneer all of it right

i guess the beef has to like escalate so

much that it's already there

[ __ ] call me a nazi the beef's

already there yeah

yeah

yeah bro

i i think i'm a clo i i know i'm weak i

only go for like two hours i'm gonna i'm

gonna close out the rest of my stream

here cover some news stories but um

thank you so much for for joining me i

appreciate it yeah i think i'm gonna

have to end it in like 30 minutes too

but yeah great talking to you man

um

i'm sure we'll do more stuff in the

future together yeah definitely

definitely all right man see you later

all right peace

how based is jackson guys one of the

most based people on the internet

honestly

great guy great guy