AMERICAN PATRIOTISM W/ JACKSON & CALEB MAUPIN! [2021-09-14] 🚀 Infrared Content Catalog

[Music]

foreign

[Music]

um

[Music]

is

[Music]

foreign

[Music]

foreign

[Music]

foreign

[Music]

is

[Music]

foreign

[Music]

is

[Music]

foreign

[Music]

hey

[Music]

um

[Music]

oh

foreign

[Music]

um

[Music]

is

[Music]

foreign

[Music]

is

[Music]

foreign

[Music]

you know a few things need to be

clarified

does i want to see my family yesterday

and today i saw you know

i think people really overreacted

um

blew things out of proportion

so let me be clear about a few things

just so we're clear right

let me maybe turn the music off for a

second

just so we're clear right for a few

things

so

i think you guys really took it took

things like out of proportion like i saw

on youtube actually i want to react to

it

peter wiley uploaded it

he uploads everything you know but his

video it got like 5k views on youtube

it's probably like the most viewed video

on his channel

and

i really think reading the comments

thank you bunny i think you guys really

like misunderstood

um

[Music]

like where i was coming from and what i

was trying to say so first things first

me and zerka are still cool like there's

no issues between me and zurka okay

that's like

you guys gotta get that down like

there's no

there it's not like me and zerka have a

problem we don't have a problem okay

and thing too a lot of you guys

interpreted this as me versus zerka

it's not what's going on you know i've

i was a i was a twitch chatter

for a long time

a watcher right i watched zurka for like

a year dude zerka's a good guy you know

i wouldn't have actually watched him

and known about him if he wasn't a good

guy he's a good guy okay

so you guys need to get that [ __ ]

straight

um you know don't don't be out here

making it seem like

there's an issue between me and zurka or

i got a problem with zerka because

that's not the case

um

yeah you guys got to understand that

you know and and chat i hate to break it

to you but

you know i i i probably

like zerka more than probably anyone in

chat you know and i'm just going to be

honest with you you know because i know

him

a little more than you guys

um you know me and zerk are cool okay

we're fine

um

what's going on

so don't be here you know trying to

stir [ __ ] and blow [ __ ] out of

proportion start drama because that's

that's not where i was coming from okay

so yesterday

the main point i was trying to make is

that

with the direction i've been going for

the past few weeks

i'm kind of losing touch with my um

thank you poster credit appreciate you

also thank you bunny appreciate you i

don't know if i forgot

um i'm just trying to get back into the

groove of infrared you know

and

i need to get back into my own groove

for a little bit

so that

you know because i was i've been

treating his chat as my chat right which

isn't true right i got my own chat and i

got my own thing

and i gotta

lock that down more focus on that more

so that i could be better prepared

dealing with hostile chatters

right but

you know um

obviously his chat doesn't mean bad most

of his chat doesn't mean bad there's a

minority of stalkers and haters from

other parts of the internet that go into

the chat and stir [ __ ] and and i know

his community they don't know what's

going on

they don't they don't know anything

about that

but

i do need to take a break you know

because

i i need to go my own way for a little

bit just to take a break

get things

in the right direction

and

just kind of take a break from that you

know because i don't i'm

like i said i'm usually a private person

so

putting everything out there like that

and always being judged thank you king

glucose like all the [ __ ] time i just

need a little break you know so

to be clear

um

i'm not done

with uh

collabing with zerka or anything like

that

probably for a week or two i don't know

um

i'm gonna do my own thing

but

you know the the circle arc or whatever

peter wiley called it or it's it's it's

you guys over exaggerated it a little

bit you know like there's there's no

circa arc you guys have to understand

that

the one of the only streamers on twitch

besides jackson

who you know i've known and i [ __ ] with

is zerka you guys gotta understand that

okay it's not an arc

it's not a phase

it's gonna be part of my

stay on twitch

um

[Music]

yeah like

that's it's not like some fish like you

guys gotta understand i didn't just meet

zurka right

i've

oh [ __ ] anonymous holy [ __ ] anonymous

with the 20

thank you man appreciate you

appreciate you a ton thank you so much

but

yeah thank you man

jesus

yeah anyway um you know

like i said you know

yesterday

you guys read a little bit too much into

it you spin narratives and [ __ ]

it's just not i know that's what you

guys were chatting to yesterday but i

was ignoring it because i was focusing

on

what was on my mind right

um

and mainly i was just trying to get you

guys to understand

why i don't tolerate that disrespect

right so there's a lot of funny comments

that i saw

that

really pathetic [ __ ] like really

pathetic loser

you know low life

um

let me show you something

so this is pathetic dude let me read you

this comment on as soon as these gifts

are done

damn

i'm just gonna wait for these

music

god damn it

god [ __ ] damn it

you realize that if you're insecure

about people calling you a virgin more

people will call you that

um yeah you can call me that i don't

care you can call me that as much as you

want

um

my issue isn't that it's the disrespect

okay

it's general disrespect

especially when i don't deserve it

right

if you really want to think that i don't

care you can think whatever you want and

there is the chatter is right there's

literally nothing wrong with being a

virgin

yeah you ever thought of that there's

actually nothing wrong with being a

virgin by the way

so like why

but obviously when people are spamming

it they're trying to disrespect me

right

and you know how i feel about lies too

is i'm triggered over lies in general

but

yeah

you know um

no you know

let's not go back over it i know you

guys are stupid as [ __ ]

um irrelevant spent two hours yeah i'm

gonna i'm gonna be clear about that

um so here's the thing

yeah uh

yeah it's the intention behind it right

what i was trying to say though is that

just to be clear about something

i know you guys think

that yesterday means i'm going on

streaming and pouring my heart out and

inventing

and i i got so many words of

encouragement from you guys and thank

you so much by the way i appreciate it a

lot twitter dms

instagram dms just people telling me

you know that what i said resonated with

them so much

thank you danzi appreciate you and guys

i appreciate that a lot i really

appreciate your words and stuff

i really want you guys to know though

that

i am not

like

i'm not in a

depressing sad state

i don't have funny thoughts

when i say [ __ ] like

it you're gonna it's gonna be too late

thank you class analysis appreciate you

when i say [ __ ] like

you're only gonna understand me when

it's too late

i mean what i'm trying to say is that

i really do think my haters

will prob would probably take it two

lengths right that would get your

attention

that's all i'm trying to say right

um

i'm not talking about me a lot of you

misinterpreted that and you thought i

meant something else

and no that's not what i meant what i

meant is these people really are [ __ ]

after me

and

i'm gonna repeat this

very very clearly

and as clearly as i can on twitch i have

not had uh thoughts

whatsoever

it's not even within the realm of my

consideration

so

whatever happened to me has nothing to

do with that just want to let you know

that

as i don't know if you catch my drift

here

um

you guys understand what i'm trying to

say i have not had any thoughts like

that

whatsoever

so if anything were to happen to me god

forbid i can guarantee you that no

matter what anyone says i would never

ever ever ever in a million years do

something like that

you got it

like maybe clip this and get this click

never in a million years would i

consider that

it is not possible so if something like

that happened to me

and people say oh this is the reason

that wasn't the reason something else

happened to me because i would never do

that you understand

just want to be clear

there's no circumstance in which i would

do that none

okay um

you i need to be crystal clear about

that

i hope yeah so you guys got to know that

you know

but anyway um

you know i guess i was a little

emotional yesterday

but

uh

it's mainly because

thank you class 232

thank you so much man appreciate you a

lot you know it's mainly because i need

you guys to understand this is that i

really do believe in what i'm doing

i do really believe in what i'm doing

and every once in a while i have to

remind myself

of that i have to remind myself that

this is not

thank you spirox so much appreciate you

thank you so much i have to really

remind myself

that this is not a game it's not a joke

i'm not a nihilist who doesn't take any

like

i do joke and have fun but there's a

certain level of like

you know i am a real person i'm a real

human being

and

when you get in character for too long

like i've been in character for like

weeks and that's not completely in

character it's just

i've been on this spiel for weeks

basically just joking and you know

making a joke out of my own bitterness

and i just kind of taking it too far to

a point where it's like okay i gotta

reign in and get back to like

what i like where i really am at you

know what i mean

because i can't keep up the gag forever

you know

i'm i'm a really

funny guy or whatever but the truth is

i'm a very serious person and i've

always been a serious person

um

you know

the gag has gone on too long i guess and

the gag will resume again

thank you dog

like i'll i'll get in lighter moods and

[ __ ] with you again

in no time

but i need to just kind of

reflect and get back to you know my

solid ground before

i do that does that make sense

you know

and

yeah it's just

when i get endless hate

it just forces me to reflect

why am i doing this and that is kind of

an emotional thing

because

why there's a lot of emotion that goes

into why i'm doing what i'm doing you

know

like it's something i take very

seriously

so when i have to remind myself of that

it's like

it does kind of make me a little bit

emotional

and serious i don't know if emotional is

a good word but it makes me more serious

and makes me you know less inclined to

just be like

joking 24 7. you know

so

yeah i mean

me and zurka are still 100

cool um you know we're not going to stop

collabing

forever you know it's just

you know

a week or two something like that i'm

probably going to take a break

and focus on my own thing for a little

bit you know

um

[Music]

you know i i saw my family yesterday and

thank god

and i really um

you know i really

think that was really good for me you

know i hadn't seen my family in weeks

and weeks

you know my sleep schedule was [ __ ] so

yesterday you know saw my family

you know i'm

yeah

i'm kind of back

you know

i would have streamed longer yesterday

but i had to go see my family you know

and maybe it would be good to take a

little bit of a day off a break

but

yeah i just want you guys to know stop

stop

spinning things out of proportion

now finally i'm going to address the our

relevant thing and the guy are relevant

now our relevance a loser let's put it

plain and simple our relevance is a

loser okay this is a person

who's been on twitch for years and years

and years

and still gets like 200 views right

he's been on here for years and years

and years and he just can't crack

anonymous sandy donated 200

you add a moment of vulnerability

there's nothing wrong with that live for

your best life comrade we will support

you regardless there is no i there is

only we

holy [ __ ] anonymous

jesus christ

i'm [ __ ] speechless i'm literally

speechless i don't know what to say

based

dude i do not know what to say man thank

you so much i really appreciate you so

much

thank you a lot man i appreciate it so

much

i appreciate you so much man

and i know i say that to almost

everybody but

i really do

you know

200 man holy [ __ ]

wow

god damn it

i'm just speechless i don't know what to

say

jc thank you and and nina thank you

but anyway um

what i was going to say about our

relevant is that you guys got to know is

that even when i am being a little bit

vulnerable

it's

i you know i'm not stupid i'm very

selective about making sure

that whatever i put out on stream

i know the consequences i know that what

i put out is not gonna harm me

you know

i'm really not

emotional

like that on stream

if you think i was being like

opening my entire heart out and no

reserve reservations whatsoever thank

you joey steele then i don't you know

that's kind of a cop it's not really

what's going on

um

but i am talking about something real

it's something real like it's a real

feeling i have but

you know it's it's not a breakdown like

ah has had a mental breakdown

how

well because i was yelling based

thank you so much is vertically

accelerating thank you sucky what

percentage of my streams do i yell on

the top of my lungs

probably like 70 right so am i always

having a mental breakdown

you know you guys gotta

understand

that as much as i tell you about my life

i've been alone for years and years and

years i've been isolated

i don't have any human warmth i don't

have the touch of a

human warmth i don't have the feeling of

human warmth

you guys gotta understand that i'm still

walking out here with my nuts hanging

you know what that means it means

i my

skin has grown thick

thick thick thick i don't care i don't

give a [ __ ] i don't need it

you know that's why i was trying to tell

you guys don't sage me don't feel bad

for me i told you that in the stream

don't feel bad for me because

trust me i take it you know i can endure

it

i endure it

and the reason i endure it

is because at the end of the day

the thing that motivates me that what i

have in my heart

is faith

i have faith and believe

in my cause

if i didn't have that

i

i wouldn't have had the strength

and the toughness

to endure

and i'm gonna tell you guys as much as i

was isolated i was probably way more

happy

than people who have a bunch of friends

thank you i had genuine happiness i was

genuinely happy

you know

i was genuinely happy because i could

appreciate

the true beauty of the world and the

real meaning in this world

and nothing made me happier than that

nothing made me happier than the fact

that at the end of the day

the world is reconciled like

i can't explain it

you know

like history faith is on your side

right i genuinely believe that i

genuinely believe that

and that brings me so that brought me so

much peace of mind the only time i

became emotional and [ __ ] was when i

started streaming right because i went

to law school

and

the ability to maintain that

that vision and that sense of

meaning right was starting to break down

in law school i started to get insomnia

i started to have this christ like what

am i [ __ ] doing here

i know this isn't my calling i know that

my calling

is to spread the message

i know that my calling is to show people

there is an alternative you shouldn't

lose hope

it's not what you think

um and any the wound is reconciled right

i really believed

that people should know this

or at least if i'm gonna interact in the

world i should interact in a way

that conveys this to others

right that conveys to uh to others the

fact

that

um

this really dark crisis that we're in in

in america and the world at large that

there is light at the end of the tunnel

right that

it's not all hopeless it's not all

despair and that ultimately this is

gonna sound you know redundant but

there is real power in the people the

people are a mighty force

they just have to receive the calling

of their the era

and themselves

streaming has been a kind of roller

coaster you know

i'm fueled by rage i'm fueled by anger

it motivates me to defeat and topple my

enemies

but you guys have to understand

you know that

this is real to me it's not just

you know all a joke and then the reason

i pursued twitch

instead of pursuing law school

is because it was 2021 the time was

passing me by and i just felt like the

world has to know

someone has to be out there saying this

[ __ ] someone has to be out there

showing people that there's an

alternative that this is a fake left

we're dealing with that there is a real

left there is an authentic left there's

a real tradition of communism there's a

real tradition of socialism and someone

has to remember that

someone has to represent that because no

one's doing it

and well some are doing it but it's not

being done to the extent that it needs

to

why not organize direct political action

and this is why i yell every day because

i get dumb [ __ ] comments like that

where people bark things at me that i've

already [ __ ] addressed

hundreds of times

but i didn't watch our relevant

irrelevant stream

the only thing i know about our relevant

is that he he leeches off my content

he's always seething and bitching and

whining about me his chat

um have nothing better to do than [ __ ]

and see than wine about me

and it's as simple as that he's a failed

streamer he's a failed content creator

he does nothing but try and harass me

and talk [ __ ] about me and he still

refuses to debate me

that's the hilarious thing he won't even

debate me because he admitted he's not

smart enough to debate me he's a destiny

orbiter

as simple as that like what what

what what did our relevance say what did

he say that that deserves my attention

you know

and i actually have an important

question that i want the chat to see if

they can answer

let's say i met are relevant in person

how much [ __ ] would he talk about me to

my face

how much [ __ ] would our relevant talk to

me

face to face with me

so why should i care what he says on

stream

i know for

i see our relevance in the gym all the

time our relevance walk into the gym and

they scurry by because they're scared to

even look at me i'm in the gym working

out and i'm i have the whole gym to

myself and i always see these our

relevance walk into the gym and i look

at them and i give them a death stare

because i'm like you [ __ ] these

are my machines

i'm here in this gym

i was here first i'm doing super sets

you better not touch my [ __ ] [ __ ]

right

and i see them walk in these are

relevant they walk in the gym and they

just scare me by they scurry by me right

they scurry by

[Music]

and i see them every day

and then the our relevance come in the

gym

and they go

i'm working out right

and there's some stupid machine that's

like

15 feet away from me i'm not even using

it

and i don't i don't have any i don't

have my phone or my keys or my water

bottle there to mark my territory and

they scurry toward me

[Music]

um

excuse me um are you using that machine

over there

they have to ask my permission

to use an unoccupied machine that i

didn't even mark my territory on 20 feet

away from me

that's how much

our relevance have to respect me in real

life and i look at them and i go

nah i don't even talk to them i don't

even look at them i go like this i

literally just do this

that's how much our relevance

have to respect me in real life

you understand

he can say what he wants let him say

what he wants on on twitch right in real

life it don't work that way right in

real life it's a different story that's

not how it works

you know

trust me i see our relevance every day i

know how our relevance are i know the

true nature of our relevance i know how

they think i know how they act

you know

um

anyway

i just wanted to read a funny comment

from the youtube

let me read it

and then we'll we'll maybe watch the

matrix trail and we'll do that after

that we have 15 minutes so we don't even

have a lot of time

but let me go ahead and read it

okay

has acting entitled to people's positive

attention when he pushes people away

treats women like play objects and

marginalize anyone who doesn't share his

exact political opinions by the way this

was the most liked comment on peter

wiley's video

which is interesting right

so i want to clarify for the obnoxious

anarchist

i am entitled to people's positive

attention

and here's why i'm entitled

because if you don't give me positive

attention in my chat

you get vc or ban your two choices vc or

ban right can't say i'm a coward because

i'm giving you an

opportunity to be a [ __ ] man come on

my [ __ ] vc and talk your [ __ ] in my

vc

so you have two options vc or bang right

and then i push people away

speaking about himself so the obnoxious

anarchist

is a failed content creator who was on

my [ __ ]

for most of the months of infrared

begging me for clout and begging me for

attention and begging me to uh interview

him and platform him and all this dumb

[ __ ]

and the obnoxious

anarchist had the name the obnoxious

anarchist goran thank you so much

he was no different than any other

weirdo leftist on the internet i ignored

him i ignored him i curved him and i i

left his dms on red so now he's mad the

second thing

if

if people don't give me positive

attention right there's two options

right i'll leave

if i like the streamer like circle i'll

just leave if his chat is hating on me

i'll just go right

whatever i don't care like they don't

want me if they don't want me to be

there i won't be there

right i'll leave

on the other hand

if

if i'm getting negative attention from a

streamer's community

i will go debate that streamer

just to show that community that the the

symbol that they're rallying around

i take a [ __ ] on i turn into

my

betas and my subs i become the dom and

the alpha

i become

the [ __ ]

leader i become the [ __ ] boss of

their [ __ ] streamer and that way

every time they talk [ __ ] on me

they will know

they i become your daddy

i defeated your daddy so i'm your new

daddy chat i'm your new daddy that's

what i do

so yes

i will

exact the positive attention

of my haters

unless they scurry away and run away to

their [ __ ]

image boards and whatever dumb pedophile

[ __ ] they go on

so yeah i am entitled and i'll take my

title

because it's my title and i'll take that

title simple as that

if you're not a pig

it's not acting like it no need to be

fake you don't find value and validation

in yourself by pretending to be a

womanizer

pretending to be a womanizer i literally

admit the fact that my body count is not

high

and

you know

um

and the fact that i it's been years

since i've you know done anything

so i admit that but here's something i

will insist on right

if i want someone

i can get someone

if i want someone i can get someone

i insist on that 100 certainty it's just

a matter of how long how long that

depends it it could be a week could be a

month

whatever if i want someone i can get

someone

absolutely anyone i want

it's just a matter of how much i'm

willing to work and how hard i want to

try but yes i could get pretty much

anyone i want i think

besides celebrities and

you know besides people who have like

way more views i genuinely like know

that that i can it's just a matter of

how much effort

is worth it to me

and mo the truth is most are not worth

my effort that's really it

most are not worth the effort that i'd

have to put in

to me you know

and by the way i'm telling you this

seriously i'm not joking i'm not playing

a comedy like i'm telling you this

seriously

i am telling you this seriously if i put

enough effort into someone

i am absolutely

assured

it just depends how long i'm impatient

but yeah i'm gonna be honest with you

guys like i am a pretty good looking guy

um i have some flaws i guess physically

but that has never gotten in the way of

anything

and i'm an extremely confident guy you

know i'm an extremely whatever

it's not really that hard for me you

know i need you guys to

stop

stop playing and joking about that

um

treats women like play objects

but here's the thing when i treat women

like play objects

they can't get enough of it

and you don't know everything

but

let me just say yeah they can't get

enough of it okay

now that now that let's contrast that to

the obnoxious anarchist

when this guy

talks to women in a calm radley and

equal way

they are cringing and their [ __ ] is so

dry

that

the weather forecasters

became confused about where the sahara

desert is

because they're thinking it's within two

feet of the obnoxious anarch is that

well is it going to rain today hell now

we're going to have a drought for

thousands of years

in in obnoxious anarchist state

that he lives in

the weathermen go we're gonna have a

drought for thousands tens of thousands

of years because her [ __ ] is so dry

talking to this creepy lefty guy

there's no possible way

right

um

you know you know these dudes don't talk

to women they can't

talk to women they can't get the [ __ ]

that's the difference between them and

me is that i ultimately choose

i ultimately choose

i choose

not

to be talking to women all the time

because i have trust issues

and i'm telling you the truth i'm being

honest with you now i have trust issues

and

it's like just for it to be physical it

has to be very

very very much like driving me insane

right and sometimes

i see that in real life but i i i don't

go through with it because it's like

there's no context

but

i do need something spiritual most of

the time

and and that's sad i'm i'm gonna try to

change that but

that's how i've been you know that's how

i've been

for a long time

um

i need something i need a spiritual

connection to get hard

that's truth

take to get hard like to perform not to

like imagine or whatever or fantasize

but like to actually

be able to

[ __ ] someone i do need to connect with

them

spiritually right i need to connect with

them

on a deeper level right

you know i mean

that's the truth

i can't just [ __ ] anybody you know

but

here's the thing

i really can speak game i'm not gonna

lie to you guys i can speak game

i can literally drive women insane

with what the things i can i say you

know

believe me don't believe me

only god knows

but

i mean yeah

the dudes like this

will never know that they'll never have

any understanding of that you know

uh haas blames everyone but cannot seem

to self-crit

it's all fun and games until making

people

laugh till they turn you into a lol cow

so let me explain the term lalka if you

don't know so lao kao is a cope term

created by a bunch of losers

um

who are themselves the biggest losers

uh

the bottom of the barrel of society and

lol cal basically means that they're

gonna milk you for laughs because

they're gonna laugh at you

and it's basically this cope idea that

you know oh you're not really obsessed

or interested in this person or

fascinated by them or extremely you know

compelled and ultimately altered by this

person you're just taking a distance

from them and milking them

i'm just laughing guys the reason i have

to stalk this person and think about

them 24 7 is because they make me laugh

you know it's a cope it's the biggest

cope that was invented on the internet

you know

um

if i make people laugh

it's intentional i have never

unintentionally made people laugh

even in the heat of a debate when i'm

roasting someone so [ __ ] hard

do you think i don't expect you guys to

laugh

i never get laughed at unexpectedly and

please point out an exception every time

people laugh

because of what i do

it's intentional

like i or at least i know what i'm doing

i know that i'm making them laugh

i know i'm creating an absurdity you

know

um

haha it's just a wild cat i mean yeah

that's really a a cope

um

yeah uh

and i don't know why he's talk he's

addressing me man i pick stop acting

like it no need to be fake

um

who are you again who are you to tell me

what to do like who the [ __ ] are you

you're you're literally nobody you're

literally a nobody

you're even more of a nobody than

irrelevant you were [ __ ] trying to

suck my [ __ ] for clout for so long

because you were begging you were

begging i give you attention and by the

way

you know

i've when i say i don't need anyone

people like oh my god guys how can you

say you don't need anyone when you're

always thanking subs

because if people send me money my

manners that i was raised with says

i'm going to thank them for giving me

[ __ ] money their hard-earned [ __ ]

money

but at the end of the day i will never

beg you guys for money and i will never

beg you guys for views i will never beg

you for anything because ultimately

when it comes down to my dignity i don't

need you

i'm telling you the viewers that right

now i do not need you

if my dignity is on the line i just

don't need you it's not worth it to me

right so if you're watching me don't

you're not doing me a favor by watching

you're watching me because you're

enjoying it if you're not enjoying it i

am giving you permission to just leave

just go i'm not forcing you to stay okay

you're not you're not like fulfilling an

obligation so if you really aren't

watching me because

it's what you want to see and you're

enjoying yourself

for whatever reason

just go i don't don't don't let me force

you to stay you know

you can just go i'll let you lose

you know um

destiny some loser in destiny chat

linked this video to destiny destiny

told the guy to f off he's not going to

react to this because he didn't want

people sending ha's negative energy

yeah you know

destiny's a real one honest to god

destiny is a real one and i found out

about some of the things that leftists

have done to destiny

dude he's been through [ __ ] he's he's

seen some of that hatred too you know

but the only difference is that the

reason i think it's a little harder for

me is because

i was experiencing that same venomous

hatred

at a really low

amount of like views and low amount of

community and low amount of followers

so

it's it was harder it's harder for me to

defend myself right

but

yeah they got him unpartnered yeah

yeah i know

but dude he's a real one for that

honestly thank you destiny for that

appreciate you i should i should

probably dm him thanking him for that

honestly that's real [ __ ] that's real

[ __ ] you know

um

yeah just personally on a personal level

that's some real [ __ ]

you know he didn't have to do that

and even if he didn't do that you know i

wouldn't i wouldn't have hold it against

him you know it's all business nothing

personal

but yeah that's some real [ __ ] i

appreciate that

yeah i don't know what destiny did to

deserve hate that's what i don't

understand

i don't know what he did to deserve hate

what did he do to deserve hate that's

what i don't get you know

i think all of his views have been on

the surface

and he's put it all out there

okay he can say what he wants about kyle

rittenhouse if you disagree then debate

him why does why does that warrant

personal hatred why do you make it

personal you know

it doesn't make any sense to me

[Music]

okay hold up i'm gonna grab some food

from the fridge

oh man

[Music]

b

[Music]

um

[Music]

let me put on some clothes this will be

disrespectful

um

[Music]

here we go

[Music]

it's not cold but it's respectful you

know

[Music]

thank you geo appreciate you

um

[Music]

let's bring them

this is

[Music]

all right let's do this

all right give me a second

just like right before a stream starts

to be like asking to

be let in

oh hey hey what's up guys what's up you

ready uh give me a second i just gotta

set up the um

i gotta set up the uh

this

stream yard

second

sorry about this

green yard

all right uh

profit

all right all right i'm ready now

cool um

i'll just i'll start it off with just

myself and then i'll drag you guys in

for the youtube stream for sure for sure

all right everybody what's up welcome

back to the show thank you so much for

joining me here

um this is the dive and it's also haza's

stream as well i guess because i think i

think you guys are able to hear me right

now so um i hope everyone is doing well

it's good it's good to all be here for

this

um

i think most people know why we're here

but i'll just briefly summarize there i

put out a tweet and this isn't a new

thing like patriotic socialism is a very

very old idea and really it's it's

rooted um in the historical practice of

socialism so this is not a new thing but

i put out a tweet that i didn't think

was controversial i said i'm a

marxist-leninist i'm an anti-imperialist

and i'm an american patriot and it

sparked a massive debate debate online

um not just in the united states but

like across many countries

and uh

a lot of people were

a lot of people have already done live

streams this week kind of uh discussing

the debate from the opposite side of the

uh you know political spectrum as far as

this goes and i wanted to bring these

two individuals together for a

conversation

um

about why we all feel

that patriotism

is inherent to the fight for a marxist

line in his future and uh these are two

individuals that i think

um

you know are very smart very

well spoken when it comes to this issue

in particular i think you'll find their

comments um

i think you'll find them very

interesting so without further ado i

want to bring them on first we have

caleb maupin

caleb is an incredible uh political

commentator analyst author he's written

numerous books you can find his work at

uh well you can find out on his twitter

if you just look up caleb maupin but i

believe it's calebmaupin.com you can

correct me if i'm wrong yes i see the

shake of the head and then the second

individual we'll be bringing on is haas

from the infrared show runs a very

popular uh twitch stream and also has a

youtube channel and we've all been doing

work together and i've i've had both of

them on my show before but this is the

first time we're all coming together for

a collab stream which i know a lot of

you have wanted so

uh here you go

the men the myths the legend caleb and

haws how you guys doing

great good how about you jackson

i'm doing well thank you so much for uh

for being here

you know we didn't really uh we didn't

really like talk too much before as to

like how we wanted to dive into this but

um given that i just kind of gave that

brief summary i maybe maybe each of you

could go one at a time and

caleb maybe you first and uh discuss

your general thoughts on the tweet that

was um

the tweet that was put out by myself and

the reaction that unfolded well sure um

what immediately comes into my head

many times i have had this image in my

head

you know some average american family

enjoying their afternoon and then

there's a con you know someone's

knocking on the door

opens the door hello i'm from the local

communist organization uh oh okay great

well tell me what your group believes in

uh well we think that everyone in this

town is a dirty rotten euro settler and

your living standard is too high so we

want to drive down your living standard

to make it more fair to people in the

third world

and while we're at it um we are planning

to engage in violence and property

destruction tonight and tear this town

apart light some buildings on fire um

you know you'll come with us right oh

and uh while we're at it we love drugs

we think drugs are amazing is anyone in

your family addicted to opioids or

heroin or marijuana yet we want to get

them addicted to it because drugs are

just awesome and uh while we're at it um

you know have any of you considered

becoming sex workers you know i mean you

know prostitution we are all about that

that is our central issue uh so will you

sign up and join our group

now of course i'm being hyperbolic uh no

one literally does this um and i think

that that is the essence of the problem

that is the essence of the problem right

there because i have done actual

political work i have knocked on

people's doors i have sold people

newspapers and you realize that you know

it seems pretty basic that in politics

the way to get people to support you is

to make the case that you're going to

make their lives better people generally

vote for candidates that they think are

going to improve their lives people

generally support political movements

political ideologies that they feel will

improve their lives

however unfortunately a lot of our

politics on the so-called left has

degenerated not into a program and a

strategy for actually dismantling

imperialism building a socialist world

but rather kind of an identity that

people can buy into they can be on the

internet they can feel really radical

they can be very angry at the society

around them they can give voice to their

their very very very pent up angry

feelings of rage they don't fit in with

the society around them they realize

that there are evil things that go on

and other people don't realize them and

they're frustrated they feel alienated

that's not real politics uh and and look

national chauvinism you know i've heard

that my whole life you know this is the

greatest country in the world you know

and if you so much as ask people like

why is the united states the greatest

country in the world they look at you

and go what you don't think it's the

greatest country in the world you must

be brainwashed everybody knows you know

we all hate that okay we all hate

national chauvinism we all hate jingoism

uh you know we all hate this idea that

the united states is this infallible

country that's never done anything wrong

slavery jim crow segregation murder of

native americans korea vietnam you know

there's been horrendous things that have

gone on in the history of the united

states and we offered no support for

that obviously but while all of those

things were going on while slavery was

going on there were people like matt

turner and harriet tubman and john brown

uh you know when there was exploitation

in the sweatshops you had gus hall uh

you had william z foster you had eugene

debs you had the labor movement you had

people organizing for the rights of

women during the vietnam war you had

people who burned their draft cards and

said hell no we won't go you had people

that ran through the streets of of the

city that i'm in right now in new york

city with the flag of the national

liberation front of vietnam chanting ho

ho ho chi minh the nlf is going to win

and i would argue that the anti-war

activists and the suffragists and the

labor movements and the abolitionists

and the anti-racists are just as much a

part of the history of this country as

are the war makers and the colonizers

and that socialism when it comes to the

united states will be this progressive

current in american history taking power

and mobilizing to dismantle imperialism

build a whole new world raise people out

of poverty and build a better life for

people around the world and for people

in this country i think that's a pretty

winning message that i would be

comfortable knocking on somebody's door

with so forgive me if i was a little bit

provocative there but i couldn't resist

no i love it i love it i think that was

very well said and it reminded me of

what michael perenti once said he said

you know this is our country and we have

to fight to take it back so has um

oh and for anyone in the audience let me

know how my mic is people are saying

it's a little bit loud at the start but

has uh your thoughts on the initial

tweet and the reaction that um

came after it

yeah i think um

i think we really need to

delve a little deeper in terms of

a caleb is 100 entirely right that they

do have a losing strategy and they have

a strategy of failures basically people

who cannot win the masses and cannot win

in this country but

a more fundamental problem with leftists

is um

they actually don't

uh

[Music]

care they they say well we don't want to

win we just want to be right and as a

matter of fact winning among the masses

in america would be a bad thing because

the masses in america are a bunch of

settlers

uh upon whom we can only desire um

misfortune and disaster and punishment

divine

retribution for the sins of the fathers

so i think we should walk it back a

little bit and actually um

assess the fundamental controversy from

the standpoint of the history and

experience and theory of marxist

leninism because it's not just that as

kayla pointed out that the strat

adopting american patriotism is the

winning strategy it's also fundamentally

correct and principally correct from the

standpoint of marxism leninism so

now one of the first ways we can um

ground the controversy is this what is

the soil of socialism or marxism or

communism is this soil the abstraction

of individual morality uh set against

the world or is it the actual given

majority overwhelming majority of people

that preside and live within your

country

um

where does socialism become real where

does it become

relevant what is the the class struggle

is the class struggle and abstraction of

thought or is it something whose context

is inevitably national and

civilizational and so on and so on

now there's the example of history this

controversy actually isn't being brought

up for the first time in history

actually marxism leninism is what came

to define

itself

significantly on this basis of this

precise question what is the real ground

of the class struggle so the first form

of this was when lenin

refused to recognize that the

westernized city elites

uh in russia were the sole primary um

and privileged site of the class

struggle lenin elected to uh recognize

that the national russian peasantry um

the democratic petty bourgeoisie as he

put it was the site of the fundamental

class differentiations that were only

apparent in the cities the real essence

of those differentiations were happening

in the countryside

and then

through the course of the experience of

the bolshevik party a term came to be

adopted which was called liquidationism

now

liquidationism um was a phenomena that

basically

um

was this

this trend in tendency whether for

coming from the left or from the right

that

when there's a new historical um

situation to just completely basically

abandon the entrenched wisdom

accumulated by the party and its

experience let's just liquidate the

parties program liquefy uh the party's

tradition and continuity and let's just

start from scratch the reason i'm

bringing that up is because in the 20s

and this actually forms a significant

part of the origins of

stalin socialism in one country and and

what we call stalinism itself

was actually happening in the sphere of

aesthetics so

many of the

more radical um

figures of

[Music]

revolutionary culture within russia were

pushing for this idea called proletarian

culture prolet cult

and the basic idea was that the old

russian culture was completely stained

by the sins and wrongness of the past

and we need to create a brand new

proletarian culture

and

the

majority of bolsheviks responded to this

prolet cult this this idea that was

being pushed

um

with the accusation that it was a form

of liquidationism but instead of being a

form of liquidationism against the party

it was a form of liquidationism against

the entrenched experience of history

itself specifically in the form of

russia's national traditions russian

literature and also european literature

and so on and so on so lenin responded

to these people by saying

listen

we need our the russian people to be a

cultured at the bare minimum with the

works of um civilization with all of the

treasures of mankind from the european

enlightenment to russia's own traditions

and so on and so on we cannot cede

russia's national traditions to the

enemy we have to give them new meaning

because we're actually the ones

inheriting them um so they applied this

accusation of liquidationism which was

first levied against

um

detractors from the party

uh to those people who were trying to

invent a brand new culture

um so i think an important detail here

is the fact that

the past

well and and one last thing i don't mean

to ramble but

the

opponents of american patriotism will

point out well that's very well and fine

um russia was a real civilization in a

real country that was founded based on

some kind of authentic tradition whereas

america was a kind of settler colony

that was founded on the basis of pure

abstraction right it's the united states

it's the constitution with its negative

rights it doesn't really have a

substantive

reality per se

and and they will say on that basis we

cannot speak uh we cannot apply the same

logic to america

and with that i think one should be very

careful to acknowledge that the same

logic could be applied to communism or

socialism itself communism and socialism

is not readily

um

possessed of a substantive content it's

kind of the same way a kind of

abstraction and that's why i think in in

countries like the united states

communists not only have to follow the

example of the bolsheviks and of

marxist-leninist and other countries we

should also recognize that communists

are um

within the united states uniquely

privileged with the ability to give new

meaning to the uh so-called american

project what was 1776 about what was

this

united states uh to a point where we

should recognize

that

um the goal of communism is not only to

give new meaning to those things

but also to inherit them to also succeed

them and

be what they were always meant to be if

that makes sense like represent what the

meaning of uh

1776

and the united states of america is and

as far as substantive cultural and

civilizational realities only then

can the authentic

civilizational realities that encompass

the united states whether it's um

the latin uh american culture or spanish

culture in the south or indigenous

cultures

um or black culture or uh appalachian

and um the european culture all of these

things can given be given more authentic

substantive um

expression

by a communist-led

united states

because communists are uniquely endowed

with the ability to recognize

that

the abstract formalism of the bourgeois

state of the united states is not enough

to address the deeper you know national

realities and this was the case in the

soviet union and it was the case

wherever communists ruled they were

especially attuned

uh and sensitive to the fact that it's

not enough to declare yourself a

universal

state and a universal party you have to

address the specific national realities

so in no way is acknowledging the

continuity of the united states of

america and seeking hegemony over it

incompatible with recognizing the

specific

uh national realities or whatever you

want to call them

within america whether it's spanish

indigenous black

or also european

so

can i can i add something go for it i

should have started with this actually

and i i apologize because my mind

slipped but i want to say this you know

uh when i was in cleveland there was a

local activist named cheryl lesson and

she was a member of the revolutionary

communist party the maoist group and she

went to prison for two years for

lighting an american flag on fire and

that was wrong

and there's been various attempts to

outlaw flag burning in the united states

and i would be the first to protest

against that people have the right to

express themselves in that way and i

will add that the first people to burn

the flag and protest in the united

states were african-americans it was

marcus garvey and while i think that

proletarian patriotism and such as a

very good strategy that we should adopt

i respect the right of any colonized

person and black person a chicano person

any indigenous person to burn the flag

to say that they are not an american to

argue that they need to have their

self-determination and a national

territory

and that my belief in proletarian

patriotism as an overall strategy is not

a negation of that in any conceivable

way right and i and i and i i want to

also talk about how cheap some of this

can be right because you know i i i

support all black nationalism whether

it's you know the uhuru movement

minister farrakhan the move organization

i support all black nationalism and a

lot of the people criticizing us don't i

support all anti-imperialist states iran

venezuela cuba any country that's

fighting for its independence against

imperialism i support them a lot of

people criticizing us don't and that

this you know demonstration of i hate

america i want nothing to do with

america oh look how revolutionary i am

is really fake if you don't actually

support black nationalism if you don't

actually support iran and cuba and

venezuela if you accuse people who

criticize uh the syrian uh the the

syrian anti-syria propaganda about

chemical weapons if you accuse them of

being nazis you have no right to

criticize us on that ground and say

we're pro-imperialist because we won't

we won't tweet you know f the usa on

social media and that it's really it's

really kind of childish to think that

you can make up for not really being

anti-imperialist in your politics by

virtue signaling with this you know this

kind of teenage rebellion verbiage which

is what a lot of this really is um you

know because at the end of the day i

mean support for actual anti-imperialist

forces that's what makes you

anti-imperialist

yeah very good points very good points

um i have a few things i i want to i

want to pick your minds on but the first

one is that and has you kind of brought

this up a little bit is that a lot of

people have been saying like well

you can't be an american patriot because

of reasons x y or z because of

it being a settler colony or be it being

an imperial power the imperial power

right now on the globe and what i think

a lot of people don't understand is that

you know the red lettuce uh brought this

up on their twitter actually i'll put it

up for everyone um so you can see they

said ultras love to misinterpret

revolutionaries russia was a former

imperial empire cuba venezuela bolivia

peru et cetera were all settler states

and their revolutionary movements use

proletarian patriotism to rally the

masses to form a worker state but u.s

workers can't get the [ __ ] out of here

so i'm curious like whoops i'm curious

your thoughts on um that hypocrisy that

we've seen from so many ultras just like

continuing to tout that line that like

oh you can't be a patriot because of

like this or that reason

but then they go off supporting

socialist causes and the countries that

have a very very not a similar history

but like in the way that they're

pointing out it is a similar history be

it because of it being a settler state

or it being an imperial power so caleb

you want to address that first um sure i

mean if haze wants to go first since

i've seen either of you yeah

um uh sure i guess i'll just be a little

bit quick um

so

you know um i think this question this

precise question can be so adequately uh

addressed

from the perspective of dialectical

materialism again which is within the

arsenal given to marxist leninist now

from the perspective of dialectical

materialism that also entails a unique

view of morality so from the dialectical

materialist perspective

no one is an abstract universal moral

agent devoid of any material or

substantive base for their existence no

one is out here just representing some

kind of you know

some kind of abstract mind floating

above reality so when people

are expressing habits and attitude and

ideologies they are taking as their

basis real material premises and among

those premises are national premises

there are premises uh that belong to one

country it's not a coincidence that so

many leftists are just so uniquely

american it's such a uniquely american

phenomena

to care about jay sakai and all this

kind of stuff and

that's not a coincidence right it's

coming from those real

premises

from the dialectical materialist

perspective the notion

that america as a whole can be condemned

on the basis of its immorality as a

whole

is an absurdity because morality belongs

to this fear of an agent's

um

will and intervention in the present

tense here and now right not in the past

but here and now in the present tense

and if

american leftists because uh sorry to

clarify dialectical materialism is a

kind of ontology of reconciliation which

means you cannot say there's a founding

sin of america and then everything

henceforth is sinful at one point you

have to sober up and be able to

reconcile yourself with the fact that

the reality of america has endured it

has endured the test of time it has

become

an irreversible material part of

people's way of life people's uh means

of life and people's uh reality you

cannot

spit on the hand that feeds you and

clothe yourself and feed yourself and

support your entire existence on the

basis of um

these material premises and then pretend

that you're completely absolved from

having to engage or confront them in any

kind of way like oh i'm not an american

patriot i'm not an american

even though america is the basis of your

um existence it's the it's the basis of

your reality and it's what's

contextualizing your position in the

first place the dialectical materialist

perspective forces the individual not to

blindly accept everything done in the

name of america or amer the american

government or america's representatives

but just confront your own material

premises own up to them and acknowledge

them that's how i interpreted a jackson

street when he said he's an american

patriot he's owning up to the fact that

he is an american he lives in america

and marxism leninism or communism for

him means serving the american people i

don't see what context communism

possibly could have

beyond that it's not a moral

condemnation of the world a little less

the material world it is insight into

material necessity itself that if

america

has been around this long

um

if the american people have constituted

themselves as such for this long and

you've taken that for granted as the

basis for your existence at what point

do you have to make peace with that

are you going to wage a war against

reality for all eternity until you get

the divine retribution where all of the

settlers are you know

brought to justice by history or some

other stupid thing like

you know and the the disgusting

hypocrisy is the fact they talk about

and condemn americans as settlers and

say all these things but then in effect

and in practical reality they end up

serving the aims of the american deep

state and the state department

effectively being tools of american

colonialism or imperialism more than

anyone else as caleb pointed out there's

no one who has had more solidarity with

black national self-determination in the

online ml sphere than caleb there's

nobody who has been more persistently

um

supportive and given solidarity to

anti-imperialist forces globally so we

have to appreciate this irony they are

themselves repeating the path it's like

what you do not

uh what is it you are doomed to that

which you repress you are doomed to

repeat

by isolating themselves from the masses

in the name of this jay sakai [ __ ]

whatever they're on they are repeating

the original sin of settler colonialism

they are making themselves

um settlers who are fortifying the

ramparts against the masses and creating

their own little pure community set

against the american people so we have

to appreciate that irony they are the

most uniquely

american uh phenomena in the world you

don't find leftists in russia and then

you know

and even in europe at least when

europeans are not being americanized or

elsewhere latin america or africa you

don't see them you know expressing these

sentiments it's a uniquely american

phenomenon so sorry for rambling but

well i would like to add that okay first

of all we need to differentiate between

a number of things because as soon as

you say this you could immediately

people start throwing a whole bunch of

things and conflating a whole bunch of

things at you okay

patriotism just means loving the land in

which you live wanting life to get

better for the land or country in which

you live patriotism refers specifically

to a country right uh that's what it

means that's all that patriotism means

that's patriotism

nationalism is a different concept

nationalism is loyalty to a nation and

the united states is not a nation it's

not a nation state it's not scotland

it's not france it's not germany uh

we're not you know we don't have the

attributes of a nation here we don't

have a common culture a common

background a common language even so

we're not a nation so you can't be a

nationalist for the united states and on

top of that national chauvinism is the

belief that your nation or your

nationality is superior to other nations

and discriminating against other nations

so when you say you're a patriot you're

not being a nationalist and you're

definitely not being a national

chauvinist you're simply saying you want

a better life and a better future for

the country um and

what is so frustrating is that that

people seem to

argue that oh saying you're a patriotic

american that means blah blah blah blah

that means oh that you don't

you don't recognize the country was

founded on slavery you don't and it's

like no all that means is we want a

better life for the country and at the

end of the day you can't really be an

american patriot without being an

internationalist if you're really

patriotic to this country you want

imperialism dismantled you want a better

relationship with countries around the

world and an end to the exploitation of

the third world you want global

relations based on win-win cooperation

you want an end to these wars you want

to break up the big corporations that's

really loving america and if you're

truly an internationalist if you truly

want what's good for the world you would

want the united states to move towards

socialism and dismantle imperialism and

so there's no contradiction whatsoever

to truly be patriotic to this country

you must be an internationalist and an

anti-imperialist to truly be an

anti-imperialist and an internationalist

you must be patriotic to this country

there is absolutely no no uh no

confusion there there's no contradiction

between these terms um but people just

continue to to and and this is a great

example of how it's another example of a

very common trend which is the

internalization of our enemy's narrative

um and you know the most common example

of this is the myth of the 20th century

i have heard my whole life communism

failed everywhere it's ever been tried

never had any success wow you know china

is the second largest economy in the

world soviet union industrialized

defeated the nazis cuba's health care

system but oh no it just failed

everywhere it's ever been tried and you

would think when someone becomes a

communist they would be recognizing that

that's not true but they don't i i hear

so many people say oh that's true but

i'm a special kind of communist i read

marx myself and i came like my own

magical theory so i accept your premise

i've just got my own well this is what

we're doing on this thing we're

internalizing our opponents have told us

to be a communist means you're a dirty

rotten unpatriotic enemy of the country

you're a traitor to the country and

we've internalized our enemies narrative

here uh we've internalized this joe

mccarthy had the house un-american

activities committee um you know and and

in the communist party of the united

states which was led by real organizers

like william z foster and eugene debs

and gus hall and bill haywood and others

they went before the house on american

activities committee and they said this

is an un-american committee and they

said we're the real patriots and this

congress is full of fifth columnists who

supported the nazis during world war ii

it's full of poll taxers and racists and

jim crow segregationists who are

depriving people of their civil rights

we're the real americans and you accuse

us of being violent revolutionaries

maybe you've never read the declaration

of independence uh you know that calls

for you know maybe you've never read

thomas jefferson um and they got up

there and they said we are we are not

un-american you're un-american this

committee is un-american and that was

the correct stance to take that you know

that that at the end of the day um

people in the united states are going to

identify as americans um and they're

going to want to make life better in

their country historically the way

communists take power

is not on the basis of their rhetoric

it's not on the basis of their ideology

even it's on the basis of their program

what are you for the bolsheviks were for

peace land and bread and people of

russia and the surrounding countries

supported them because they thought

peace land and bread would improve the

country right china was for land to the

tiller the communist party was for land

to the tiller land to the peasantry a

new china breaking free from the

imperialists defeating the japanese

invaders well the people of china

supported the communist party because

they thought the program of the

communist party would improve things at

the end of the communist manifesto karl

marx in the second to last paragraph he

says that communists everywhere support

every uprising against the existing

order of things that's every uprising

not just ones that are liberal not just

ones that are politically correct not

just ones that have a good view or a

good demand every uprising but in all of

them they bring forth the property

question

as the leading question so whenever

people are at odds with the system in

the united states whether they're mad

that their taxes are too high uh whether

they're mad about you know banks

foreclosing their homes whether they're

mad about the wars

communist job is to go to them and and

show support for them as as having an

uprising against the system and then

bring forward a program demands

that would challenge the question of

property that would move us towards

socialism that's what our job is and if

we want people to accept our program

they need to understand that the program

will improve their lives i mean it's

just kind of basic right i mean this is

just you know so on the basis of our

program we should be formulating demands

that will improve people's lives when it

comes to the issue of climate change i

have raised fusion city right right now

fusion energy is really the only hope

for getting out of the nightmare of

fossil fuels we're not going to get out

of the windmills we're not going to get

out of it with solar panels we need to

construct a global united effort to

defeat fossil fuels to harness the power

of fusion energy um and that is a

program build fusion city an

international combined effort with

russia with china with venezuela with

iran india south africa every country in

the world working on fusion energy

combine their efforts build a gigantic

facility in heartland in the united

states of america to solve the problem

of fossil fuels get us off of fossil

fuels once and for all with fusion

energy make it not a competition between

countries but a global unified effort to

defeat fossil fuels that's a program are

you for it or are you against it well if

you're for it if you're for it we're

gonna have to challenge all kinds of

capitalist power we're gonna have to

push back the power of the fossil fuel

corporations and the big banks and we're

gonna have to team up with the chinese

communists and with russia and with

other countries to do it so are you for

it are you against it well if you're for

it that's a pretty darn patriotic

program isn't it isn't that a pretty

pretty patriotic program when it comes

to the issue of immigration right we

talk about the sandino zapata economic

corridor you know there are there are

people piling into the united states

from central america from guatemala from

honduras there are criminal

organizations like ms-13 that have

formed there's dead bodies on the border

every day this situation can't continue

right and donald trump and his big giant

wall that's not solving the problem

because that makes those criminal gangs

even stronger people can't walk across

the border they get smuggled in uh you

know the more afraid immigrant

communities are the more we have ice

kicking down doors the more terrified

people are gonna be that's not the

solution uh liberals they offer

basically the same thing right it's not

it's not kids in cages now it's children

in facilities that's what it is now uh

but it's the same thing when you get

down to it but we have a solution which

is the sandino zapata economic corridor

the united states and mexico and

nicaragua and china need to team up to

economically develop honduras and

guatemala jobs schools education

hospitals effective teaming up with

communities to fight the narco gangs

there needs to be an emergency program

of economic development for central

america and that would mean jobs in the

southwestern united states in texas new

mexico arizona southern california that

would mean jobs in mexico that would

mean jobs in nicaragua an economic

corridor from the southern united states

all the way down to nicaragua through

central america through mexico that's a

patriotic program that would solve the

crisis of mass migration on the border

the humanitarian issues it would make us

a lot safer it would stop the flow of

drugs into this country that's a real

solution and it's a very patriotic

solution and it's on the basis of

solutions like this that communists take

power and in order to have solutions

that raise the question of property in

order to have those you have to be

patriotic

very well said very well said i'm

curious your thoughts on um

uh there were there was a there was a

stream i think hakeem may have said this

uh and they were talking about this

whole debate the patriotism debate

and

they were discussing the fact that uh

you know america has such a rich history

of imperialism and settler colonialism

um how could anyone

call themselves a patriot when that is

so much of what our history american

history is

and uh you know i would obviously push

back on that and say well

no like there's plenty of history that

should be celebrated right and there's

an active attempt by liberals today to

try and erase that history uh from the

minds of young americans right um

but i'm curious to hear both of your

takes on that because it is you know

that that is a true thing like there has

been a lot of evil that has been done in

the name of the american empire uh

way way before we were on this planet so

um i look at it and i say you know i

want to celebrate and learn from and

carry on the torch of good that this

country has done and i want to use that

to improve the lives of my fellow

americans

and i want to reject the evil and also

learn from the evil that has been done

in our country's name but reject that

and take this country back um haas do

you want to take a crack at that

yeah i think um again we should probably

this is an issue of um again a very uh

widespread confusion that

self-proclaimed marxist and marxist

lenin have on the question of morality

and morality is something we should take

very seriously

um

because a lot of the mistakes come from

not having a materialist perspective on

the matter

now it's undoubtedly true that there was

a unique evil i will agree there is a

unique evil of european colonialism and

specifically the colonization of america

that is not even comparable to the forms

of

you know um

aggression and uh

you know slavery and so on of the

pre-modern um

status quo so i agree there is a unique

evil of uh

this kind of modern european colonialism

no denying that uh so it's not that i'm

trying to say like well this is the true

for every single country's past and

america is just no exception no i agree

it is a unique evil the problem is it

has already happened

it has already happened

and if we do not believe that this

reality can be reconciled that

we cannot um

so to speak uh

clean the mess

or at least help try to clean the mess

created by the sins of the forefathers

there is no moral position that can

judge

the past

in this way in other words america has

created a mess so to speak right with

americans settle colonialism and the

genocide of indigenous slavery this i

agree is all a mess created by america

but only as americans can we clean the

mess we created can we address

this original problem we're not going to

address it by turning our backs on this

country and its people and saying

they're all evil and they're condemned

because in effect you are actively

participating in that original evil by

by doing that and saying that if we say

if we take responsibility for those

original crimes

and i agree america must take

responsibility and i'm not speaking in

the form of atoning for its sins or

rectifying the problem but strictly in

the sense yes we have to acknowledge

this is part of the founding of america

we should own up to it and if we cannot

see how

there can be a reconciliation and a

redemption of the american project even

after this you're in no position to

judge it from the perspective of

morality if we don't we can at the same

time own up to this hideous ugly history

and also believe

that

there is a reconciliation of this

history of this original wound that is

to put it in this kind of hegelian way

the wound is reconciled this very

original evil has a deeper meaning than

just

you know meaningless barbarism and it

must

amount to something more than that and

communists are uniquely disposed to

being able to allow it to amount to more

than that and i think the form this

takes

is the united states as a

because america as caleb poured out is

not a nation it's a union state it's a

union state of various different states

and it's um almost it's in a state that

by the example of stalin on the national

question is almost completely

devoid of

any specific

national uh particularity when it comes

to the pure form of the state obviously

there are national realities but when it

comes to the united states it is devoid

of any particular specific

uh national content

what is more communist than that

communists need to inherit that

um

and give new meaning to it to this form

uh

and morality cannot be treated as

something where well i may have not been

um around at that time of settler

colonialism but now i am uniquely able

to you know they like to use this word

you're reproducing and you're

reinforcing this settler colonialism by

participating in it

by being a communist and admitting

you're a patriot this is a completely

bankrupt uh mentality it's a completely

bankrupt moral or ethical position

you are already participating it whether

you acknowledge and own up to it or not

unless you want to leave this country

and go live in a different country

it still forms the basis of your

existence you're doing it either way

right you're not again you're not an

abstract you know ghost

looking down upon the world you're an

individual who has real material

premises who has real premises in this

reality and in this country

um

so so when people try to treat morality

as like an individual is the ultimate

arbiter of every uh moral reality and

that moral action on part of the

individual will is what defines an

individual's morality that's not a

materialist perspective because a

materialist perspective says you are

culpable and engaging in actions as an

individual whether you attribute them

with the quality of moral will or not as

marx puts it men and women enter into

relations independently of their will

and they are doing it but they don't

know it as marx put it right you're

being an american you just don't know it

and you're not acknowledging it you're

just as your hands are just as dirty as

anyone else it's just that you're a

hypocrite

right

um

so the point is you are not pure or

cleaning your hands or uh somehow

morally uh

sorry morally uh correct by withdrawing

from this reality and saying oh i want

to create my own pure reality this is a

false reality

uh this is a complete this this is what

kind of hegel would describe as the

beautiful soul and since dialectical

materialism comes from hegelian

dialectics to put it in english's words

the standpoint of marxism leninism to

reality is that all that is real is

rational

but not without further qualification

the meaning is

all that is real is rational but not

everything that is apparent is

necessarily real for example as mao used

to put it american imperialism

is a paper tiger mao predicted that

american imperialism would collapse

under the weight of its own

contradictions without any moral

intervention on part of americans

whatsoever so marx so being opposed to

imperialism doesn't mean that you're

enacting some kind of you know purely

moral uh

uh you know

prescription and imposing that upon

reality it means you are expressing

insight into material necessity you

recognize that american imperialism and

american racism and all these things

these hinder the forces of production

that are waiting to be unleashed these

hinder the flow of history that is

waiting to be realized and it becomes a

question of time and the point of

communism is to accelerate a process

that is in a sense

uh inevitable and insofar as we're

participating in this reality the only

moral thing to do is be true

to what is already happening and being

unleashed american imperialism will

collapse

all of the evils of america that we

attribute to america will not last

forever but insofar as we're living in

this world the only will

that can be expressed that can be called

moral is one which acknowledges this and

expounds this insight into action

so that's what i'll say

well i i want to add that you know we

shouldn't accept that all these things

that have gone on in the history of the

united states that were absolutely evil

and wrong

benefited the country um slavery for

example held back the industrialization

and economic development of the united

states um and that was one of the main

motivations for the civil war the

industrial capitalists were furious

about the fact that in the south uh they

maintained an agrarian economy uh

without industrialization and and there

was a clash between the semi-feudal

slave economy of the south and the

rising industrial economy in the north

and if you look at the u.s south the

reason that even today hundreds of years

later it is still poorer than the rest

of the united states it's still largely

agrarian it's still less developed is

because of the legacy of slavery now um

that's not to say that wealthy white

plantation owners didn't benefit from

slavery uh but if you look at the u.s

south overwhelmingly the majority of the

population uh of white people weren't

benefiting from um you know black people

certainly weren't benefiting from it

being you know murdered and exploited

and worked to death they weren't

benefiting from it but the majority of

white people weren't benefiting from it

because they had the lowest wages in the

country because they were competing with

people who worked for free uh you know

and and slavery overwhelmingly was bad

for white workers in the south and the

defeat of slavery was a victory for the

u.s economy overall it led to unleashing

industrialization in the country

and this is what w.e.b du bois has

talked about in his history of the

united states and his uh black

reconstruction he makes this point um

and at the time that slavery was going

on uh it was labor unions and those who

fought for the rights of workers that

were the biggest opponents of slavery

for this reason because even if even if

these labor unionists were racist they

understood that slavery drove the wages

of workers down it hurt the u.s economy

um so by saying that you know that you

can't be patriotic in the united states

because of slavery the strongest

arguments against slavery at the time

were being made by people who were

arguing in the interests of the united

states and slavery hurt all working

people in the united states so that that

logic just doesn't add up um and you

know and this has been completely eroded

i watched you know john oliver he did

this piece about confederate monuments

and if you watched the piece you would

think that slavery was good for southern

white people it was good for southern

white people they should just feel

guilty about it well that's bullcrap it

wasn't good for southern white people

and the idea that slavery was good for

southern white people is propaganda that

was invented by the democratic party

that was invest gone with the wind birth

of a nation the ku klux klan they did

all this stuff to rewrite history to

convince low-income white people that

they were better off when slavery went

on but that was a big fat lie and

liberals now go around repeating this as

if this is a fact oh yeah well you know

slavery benefited all white people in

the united states and uh but they should

just feel guilty and ashamed of this

that's not actually what went on um and

you know this whole narrative i've often

criticized the book uh the book to kill

a mockingbird it's a really nice story

it's very touching but it has absolutely

nothing to do with the anti-racist

struggles of the 1930s right it's you

know you have this town in the south and

there are these black people and these

black people couldn't possibly fight for

their own rights they're just helpless

victims you know and they're just these

passive helpless victims and then all

the poor white people are a bunch of

rednecks and racists and all that and

the hero is this wealthy white lawyer

with a heart of gold who just steps in

and tries to hold back all those poor

white rednecks from their racism that's

not what happened in the 1930s it takes

place in the 1930s before the second

world war in the south at that time the

communist party was going to the south

and building labor unions of

sharecroppers and textile workers of

black and white and gus hall and william

z foster and those folks were going

around the south and they were saying

that

racism and jim crow hurt all working

people and that they needed to build a

fighting labor movement for the rights

of all working people and that jim crow

hurt all workers and that putting the

needs of the black people at the front

of the class struggle was a way to

liberate all workers and it was it was

the the white rednecks who were joining

the same labor unions as the

african-americans and teaming up

together that shut down the state of

south carolina in 1934 and caused the

national guard to be sent in um you know

you you read the history of what went on

in alabama go read hammer and hoe by

robin d g kelly and it was it was the

white poor people and the black poor

people standing together and

understanding that racism hurt all

workers and that putting the needs of

black people to front would lead to the

liberation of all workers that made the

wealthy white lawyers and made the

businessman and the bankers panic and

made them panic and and pushed racism

and ku klux klan ism like you wouldn't

believe um and also is part of what

motivated roosevelt to pass his popular

reform to try and calm the class

struggle so that's just you know that

that book to kill a mockingbird it's not

really about the 1930s every work of art

reflects the period in which it was

created not the period in which it takes

place that reflects the mindset of the

civil rights movement and what was

happening during the civil rights

movement was that all over the world in

africa and in asia and in latin america

the colonized people were breaking free

and they were breaking free and the

soviet union and china were the leaders

of that global national liberation

struggle and to humiliate the united

states and to expose the propaganda to

the united states they showed the

picture of emmett till's mutilated body

they showed jim crow segregation and

they said the united states are a bunch

of hypocrites they say they believe in

freedom look what they do to the black

people and in response to that the

richest capitalists in the northern wing

of the democratic party uh like the

kennedy family and others said okay we

need to fix this jim crow problem so we

can have better optics and that's what

to kill a mockingbird is really about it

was the rich capitalist of the north

saying all right we're going to go down

south can you guys cut this out we're

trying to make to make them think we're

the free country against the commies

that's what was really going on there

and that's what to kill a mockingbird is

really about okay and this notion that

the rich are the enlightened ones with

the good values and the poor people are

all a bunch of you know racist white

trash who were all in the clan and and

the black people couldn't possibly fight

for their own rights well the only

reason there was a civil rights movement

was because before that there was a

black nationalist movement there was

malcolm x there was the nation of islam

and black nationalism and revolutionary

politics was getting strong that also

motivated the northern wing of the

democratic party to start working with

dr martin luther king jr and others so

so this notion that black people can't

fight for their own rights that's false

this notion that that poor white people

are these racist rednecks that need the

rich people to control them that's false

the whole narrative we have around this

is all false and this feeds into the

mindset a lot of a lot of american

communists the way they see this is that

you know they feel they don't fit in

with this country which i've felt that

way my whole life and and many people

feel alienated especially now with the

economy in crisis a lot of young folks

don't have a decent job and and there's

a lot of social alienation and confusion

and and they don't feel like they fit in

so they they adopt marxism so they can

say i'm the good american all the

americans around me you're evil you're

supporting the empire you're euro

settlers but i discovered the truth of

communism on the internet so i can sit

on the internet and type away and call

people racist and sexist all day and

feel good about myself well that's not

real politics that is not real politics

and that's what like third worldism is

really about right third worldism is a

way

and look labor aristocracy is a real

thing right i mean that there is has

been sections of the u.s working class

that have benefited from imperialism and

been off bought off by it that's a

reality but the the reality of the

period we're currently living in is the

breakdown of the labor aristocracy those

good paying jobs are gone uh that white

picket fence home that was the staple of

the american dream of the 1950s has been

foreclosed it's boarded up i mean i mean

so to be screaming about labor

aristocracy right now i mean yes in the

50s and 60s and 70s that was a real

barrier to popular organizing now

you know average americans are ready to

fight average americans are against the

wars average americans think the

government is working for for someone

else and not them average americans are

are fed up they want jobs they want

health care and education um average

americans are ready to fight back now is

not the time to say they're not ready to

hear it and if you think it's impossible

if you if you are in the mindset that

it's impossible we can never win over

average americans so why even try

stop right i don't take dating advice

from incels okay i don't

i don't take barbecuing advice from

vegans and if you think it's impossible

we can never win the american people to

socialism there is no hope shut up shut

up go learn to play golf you know maybe

go join the alt-right i don't know what

you should do but you shouldn't be a

communist then because communism is

about winning i mean we actually want to

see

imperialism be dismantled we feel we

have an obligation here in the center of

the empire to build an anti-imperialist

working-class movement and if you don't

think that's possible i don't know what

you're doing and i don't know why you're

trying to tell me how i should do

something that you don't think is

possible you don't think what i i'm

trying to do is possible and win

americans to anti-imperialism socialism

then don't tell me how to do it because

we're i mean you don't think it's

possible

yeah just one really final thing i don't

mean to it's not going to be long but i

just want to say

yeah the um

you know i think a lot of this really i

don't mean to keep going back to

morality but it's almost like people

just have this crazy

um

cynicism about like oh how could

something be both

morally correct and human and at the

same time benefit the people like how

could it be that slavery is it just a

coincidence you're saying it's a

coincidence that slavery just so

happened to harm white people because

they're in this state of frenzied

liberal moralism where they want to feel

like they're in a state of a pure will

divorced from material reality material

reality is completely evil and the only

thing that is within the sphere of good

is your voluntary will right but that's

not a materialist perspective a

materialist perspective reconciles the

will with material reality which means

yes what is ultimately good is what is

good for the people what is ultimately

bad is what is bad for the people this

this is marx's humanism 101 and and marx

only thought the proletariat

was significant because for him the

proletariat was the section of the

people within the in germany and

elsewhere and in england that he thought

represented the future and represented

the faith of all the the majority of the

people in the class he called them the

ingenious soil of the people right so

this idea that oh you're just a

coincidence that how can you say that

imperialism and racism harms the

american people wouldn't it be more

convenient if they actually benefit from

it and that i'm the only moral person

because i'm the one who's in the know

well no that's a completely idealist and

false understanding of morality and

second i just want to leave this on this

i'm not going to go into it but i also

think we should also re-evaluate here

the significance of the popular front in

relation to this question of patriotism

because i think

that's where communist parties worldwide

started to really

understand its significance so that's it

yeah um

one thing i've seen brought up by a lot

of

like leftists and not not just like ml's

but um left us more broadly that

supports the idea of being like a

patriotic revolutionary is that the most

patriotic stance

on any given issue is to be uh you know

on the left you know if you it's not

patriotic to want to send your brother

your son your daughter whoever into into

imperialist endless wars you know it's

not patriotic to to want to ruin and

destroy this country for the benefit of

the top one tenth of one percent it's

not patriotic to you know allow 68 000

people to die every year because we

don't have basic health insurance

guaranteed as a human right so

um i want to read this this was actually

a tweet that was put out by dc metro

cpusa

in response everything that was being uh

debated on twitter they said a word from

an elder comrade fidel wants uh fidel

castro once told a group of black

nationalists and white students during

the years the black power movement and

vietnam war who did not want to

associate with the usa flag while other

groups from other countries sat next to

theirs

that the u.s flag is can i skip one here

no that the u.s flag is their flag he

then said that they cannot allow the u.s

ruling class to own the flag the working

class of the u.s must fight for the flag

and once socialism is established it is

up to the workers to decide what they

want to do with the flag in the united

states as it exists

uh they go on here and talk more about

like you know patriotism isn't the same

as nationalism but um you get the you

get the gist there of uh what they were

talking about i'm curious your thoughts

like um

and i think i i has i think i've seen

you talk about this but do you feel as

though uh you know a communist must be a

patriot a patriot essentially must be

like a communist because of the values

that those two

um you know those two like points of

view hold

yes absolutely i could ramble endlessly

about why this like especially is true

for marxists but i'm not going to

obviously but

like uh you know you have to understand

something from marx marx arrives at his

humanism and the proletariat in a very

beautiful way

um

marx was a hegelian and hegel

you know created this kind of um

this system this philosophical system in

which he encompasses all of being

through the mind the mind

and thinking and being really truly

become one in hegel's case so hegel is

just dealing with the pure what is

purely within our ability from the

perspective of thought individual

thought and from that he reconciles all

of reality from the individual

standpoint for marx to turn around and

then say that here in the ingenious soil

of the people like the lowest

denominator the most kind of abandoned

accursed

um

landless and kind of deprived section of

humanity that this actually represents

the point of true dialectical

reconciliation marx was saying

that marx's humanist gesture means that

the highest insights of thought

individual thought and morality and so

on we're ultimately united with the

reality of humanity which means

that communism is ultimately about the

people that is what it's about it's not

for an imagined people it's not for a

good people we think of in our head that

doesn't exist in reality it's not for

a different specimen it's for humanity

and specifically it's for the people the

only context and meaning

given to a communist is to serve the

people and the people

obviously subsist in within the context

of a country right a people if there are

a people and not an imagined and

abstract one

have a country and america is a country

with a people right china's a country

with a people russia is a country with

the people there is no meaning to

communism especially from the marxist

perspective

without being with serving and serving

the people what the people are

so patriotism has always just been a

given for communist now there's

confusion because the communist

manifesto famously says the working man

has no country

um

but you have to understand why they were

saying that because they had predicted

within the communist manifesto that all

distinctions with in terms of borders

and countries were being dissolved by

capitalism right

so

and they also predicted a lot of other

things were being dissolved classes were

being dissolved and they also sorry

families were being dissolved religion

was being dissolved they also predicted

that for the same reason that you know

the revolution was going to emerge in

the advanced countries well after 18 the

revolutions of 48

um and the experience of history marx

and engels you know they changed their v

their uh their understanding of what

uh of what they were saying in the

manifesto reality had proven them wrong

that the most advanced sections of the

proletariat were not in england by the

end of marx and engel's life they were

in uh germany right which was the most

backward

country in europe when they wrote the

communist manifesto and then marx and

engels were anticipating that the

revolution was going to start in russia

right which was the most backward of

countries um

there so

in essence um

they were they were proven wrong about

all national distinctions or

distinctions between countries and

borders and states

being dissolved

uh for the same reason that they were

they turned out to be wrong about a

great deal many other things but

marxism doesn't mean you elevate every

word written in the communist manifesto

to the status of a dogma i mean yes in

terms of what they were trying to say

they were right right they were right

because the meaning of what they were

saying was

um

no country is eternal no nation is

eternal and they are all subject to an

eternal process of kind of

transformation and that's kind of the

wisdom of what they were trying to say

but

um

the the sad thing is is that it's not

it's not like i'm just for the first

time pointing this out i mean marx and

engels themselves basically pointed this

out mark said in the critique of the

gotha program that the proletariat must

take national form it's national inform

class struggle and content lenin

continued this stalin continued this mao

continued so the history is already

there and the reasoning for it is

already there

um

so yes in some in short

communists must be patriots if you're

not a patriot you're not a communist

simple as that

[Music]

well i would like to say one thing

because you know viewing this from a

tactical point of view okay

during the vietnam war era uh the united

states in the 50s and 60s up into the

mid 70s had a very booming economy and

there was a very big industrial working

class in the united states and that

industrial working class saw their

living standards dramatically increase

after the second world war their i mean

they were in depression conditions

before the second world war the 1950s

things got way better and because of

that a lot of workers loyalty to empire

was bought and so the communists in the

united states from the communist party

from the socialist workers party from

the workers world party they had to make

a tactical decision how do we oppose

this genocidal war in vietnam and at

first they tried to oppose that war on

the basis of you know proletarian class

struggle don't fight a boss's war etc um

but it didn't work um but they realized

though that a lot of the people fighting

in the vietnam war uh they were people

who had grown up in this very

comfortable middle class right and that

uh going into the army and fighting a

war is not the most comfortable thing

and it's not a lot of fun and especially

if you had more of a cushy middle-class

upbringing that cannot be particularly

good and you know military discipline is

very harsh and such so the anti-vietnam

war movement over the course of the

vietnam war

learned to make kind of a middle-class

pacifist appeal that that was the way to

win americans to oppose the vietnam war

in that time okay and they were right to

do that trying to oppose it on a class

basis when workers had a high standard

of living booming economy wasn't going

to work that was the right thing to do

in those situations but you don't want

to be a general fighting the last war

right the vietnam war ended a really

long time ago after the vietnam war

there was something in the united states

called the new communist movement and

that was the the revolutionary communist

party and the communist workers party in

the october league and other groups and

they went and got jobs in factories

throughout the entire 1970s and tried to

win their co-workers to communism uh you

know sold the newspapers and the plant

and a lot of their co-workers again

there was still a very strong industrial

middle class in the united states a lot

of their co-workers didn't want to hear

it and said go screw yourself you know

go go back to russia ukami or whatever

because there was still a very strong

industrial middle class and then as you

get to the end of the 1970s you had the

first major economic downturn um and so

a lot of the communists thought oh wow

now they're going to listen to us now

there's an economic downturn well no

things have been getting better and

better and better until suddenly they

got worse so of course the reaction of

most of the working class was to get

more conservative and to go you know for

the ronald reagan you had the reagan

reaction but after the reagan reaction

you had a lot of those communists who

had gotten their jobs in factories they

just retreated they said you know what

it can never be done right we tried it

for 10 years uh throughout the course of

the vietnam war protest movement we

learned to make a middle class appeal it

can never be done average americans can

just never be one to socialism well you

know 1978 1980 1981 that was a really

long time ago and conditions have

drastically changed since that time and

lennon very famously said that if the

situation changes in 24 hours the

tactics must also change in 24 hours and

that the left in the united states has

gotten used to operating in a period

where there was enough of the booming

economy enough of the solid labor

aristocracy

we assume that we're going to be this

bohemian fringe that the only people

that are going to listen to us are

college kids and hippies there might be

an alliance with the black liberation

struggle in the black national movement

but for the most part we're going to be

a fringe element so let's

that is not the way to win we're in a

different period now capitalism is in

crisis the united states is falling

apart interest in socialism is very

widespread across the country we could

actually win now but in order to win

we're going to have to update our

tactics right the new left the vietnam

war the new communist movement in the

70s that's all

a long time ago and we're now faced with

a country full of people that are hungry

full of people that have seen their

relatives locked in jail or died from

opioids full of people who have seen

their relatives shot in afghanistan or

shot in iraq or in syria and they're

tired of it and we need to find out how

to make a populist appeal a populist

appeal that we will fight for you and

again that's not we're going to fight

for you and make the country worse and

tear things apart and light things on

fire and beat people up and and no we're

going to fight for you by making a

better country and that we need to

communicate to them that while we may

not agree with with how the united

states was founded we may not agree with

all the awful things in this united

states we want to make their lives

better we love them and i will also add

this i've made this analogy before but

uh you know in legal terms they talk

about fruit of a poison tree right and

that's the idea that you know if a cop

comes into your house and searches

without a warrant what he finds is not

admissible because the way he acquired

that evidence is was was impure and so

the result is impure it is the fruit of

a poison tree and i've said many times

that the united states as it currently

exists is the fruit of a poison tree it

is tainted by the legacy of slavery and

jim crow and the vietnam war and the

korean war and this extermination of

native americans and the the

exploitation of the chicano people and

the theft of mexico of texas and

california from mexico the united states

is definitely poisoned by all of that

and in the 1950s and 60s despite that

booming economy all of those cars all of

those hula hoops and tv sets and

refrigerators were dripping with blood

and that was the blood of the people

around the world that were being

exploited the blood of the black people

who were suffering under jim crow the

blood of the chicano people the blood of

the indigenous people and that in a lot

of ways the collapse of the united

states that we're watching the gradual

deterioration of the country is very

much the chickens coming home to roost

and we can recognize this none of this

is incompatible with being a patriotic

socialist none of what i'm saying is

contrary to being a patriotic socialist

because one of the most key

things that all progressive forces have

done is they've recognized that what we

are appealing to people to do is to

change we are telling people to change

right we are telling people that the way

we used to function as a society the way

the world works doesn't work anymore

that we're telling people that that we

have to change and turn things around

and that's that's what communists have

always done wherever they go they go and

they tell people that used to think one

way and used to act one way to act a

different way and now more than ever is

the time to go to the american people

and to say you know the ideology we've

been spoon fed about individualism and

capitalism not gonna work that you know

national chauvinism and jingoism not

going to work that support for these

wars not going to work that belief that

profits should come before people and

free markets not going to work

what are we doing if we are not going to

people who disagree with us and getting

them to change our minds what are we

doing yeah and and

go go ahead yeah just really quick um

you know what you said also is i also

think that

this is one of just maybe my view is

that i think this the the communist

party um seriously under appreciated and

did not really learn

the real significance of the popular

front even in the post-war period i

think i think mao actually gave new

significance to the meaning of popular

front in a way that um the

soviet-aligned parties did not at at the

outset really accept and i think um

when we look at it from the perspective

of populism

the conservative instincts of american

working class and working people i don't

think are in any way incompatible with a

general um kind of revolutionary or

anti-establishment

rejection of the vietnam war i think

perhaps maybe i don't know genuine i

don't know is that

maybe communist because the the theory

of the class struggle remember is

institutionalized theory right it's a

specific kind of marxist theory that

only the initiated understand trying to

impose it on reality is not going to

work in that period or in this period

right um

but if they had a kind of more maoist

understanding of the significance of the

popular front and interpreting the

popular front from the perspective of

populism

maybe it could have been possible that

that communists could have led the nixon

reagan

uh

rule a kind of uprising against the

democrats because ultimately let's

remember who started the vietnam war

um

if i remember correctly it was under a

democratic administration right and the

democrats at this time it's very

interesting we're starting to change

their strategy from the working class

americans to appealing to marginal

groups in an alliance with the

professional managerials so i think

communists did have an opportunity

perhaps at this time maybe they couldn't

for for historical reasons but

retrospectively i think from a maoist

perspective

it could have been those reagan

democrats who could have been the base

for a communist anti-war populism

i don't know

a lot of what the fake left puts out

these days is just anti-working-class

bigotry i mean you know vosh is a

disgusting creature a rich kid from

beverly hills who thinks average working

class people when they get together and

start organizing for their rights are

scary and authoritarian and it triggers

him and oh my god and that's what all

this equating of communism and fascism

is really about right this is hannah

arendt uh this is the congress for

cultural freedom this is susan sontag

what they really believe it actually

comes from leo strauss the neocon

philosopher which is basically there are

these great people the intellectuals the

philosopher kings who are meant to rule

over all of us and and everything must

be done to protect these people's sacred

right to rule over the rest of us and

whenever you know the rabble start

getting together and demanding their

rights and and mobilizing and building

mass movements and wearing uniforms and

waving flags and making demands whenever

that happens it must be crushed

immediately because that's nazi germany

that's communism that's the labor

movement and they in their minds all

populism is the same fascist right-wing

populism left-wing economic populism is

all the same because it threatens their

ability to rule over the rest of us and

that's what they really think when it

really gets down to it this is neocon

philosophy uh and on the on the right it

manifests itself with you know free

market economics and you know hawkish

foreign policy on the left it manifests

itself in kind of social liberalism and

the belief that average people are

dangerous rednecks who need to be

controlled but at the end of the day

anti-populism is the essence of neocon

philosophy and that's what the synthetic

left believes it's essentially just

politicized anti-populism they are

afraid of the masses of people bosch is

a great example of that i mean he really

just hates working class people i mean

after january 6 he tweeted out something

to the effect of uh you know um you know

these people can't coexist with a

democratic society either they get

disappeared or we all do right so in the

name of protecting his sacred freedom to

live in beverly hills and read about

anarcho communism he wants working-class

people who might support trump to get

dragged away in the middle of the night

and taken to guantanamo bay disappeared

we all know what that means that's what

vosh wants but he's lecturing us about

freedom um and this is the iron the the

irony i guess you could say of of of

liberalism is that liberalism is never

afraid to utilize illiberal institutions

to defend itself um

you know you couldn't have an open

liberal society without an entity like

the us army and do you think the us army

is a free thinking institution that

drill sergeant you know everyone must

think for themselves sir yes sir you

know what is the meaning of truth we

don't know sir yes i mean

the liberalism is the class privilege of

a privileged few right and it depends on

very illiberal authoritarian

institutions to prop it up okay and they

have contempt for these authoritarian

illiberal institutions the military that

goes out you know that bosh wants to

keep in afghanistan that military is

people from red states okay largely it's

people from red states those people he

hates he wants to send them to

afghanistan to go fight for the women

okay you know this is this this is the

irony of the whole thing is that that

this is very much a class divide the

synthetic left is the middle class you

know

reviling in contempt for the broad

masses of workers who are going to

mobilize and are going to fight for

their rights um and i would like to see

them fight for their rights on the basis

of a progressive anti-racist

anti-imperialist program um and if

that's not the case

their alienation could express itself in

a vulgar right-wing way and i would like

to see that not happen so you know i

think we're on the right path here but

i'm sure you know bosh would disagree

yeah speaking speaking of uh people like

vosh

um i see like a lot of the i see a lot

of the uh arguments from the other side

of the spectrum on this debate coming

from the same type of people that

promote like like

like very heavily like woke cancel

culture ideology

um

curious your thoughts on on because okay

also like as we discussed earlier being

a patriotic marxist leninist patriotic

communist um that was the norm

historically wherever you saw these

popular movements take place so i'm

curious your thoughts on where uh the

american left

decided to reject that notion that that

should be the norm and how it's kind of

shifted into what it is today this like

now now it's like a woke cancel culture

and like no this this you're gonna get

canceled if you say you're a patriot uh

but where did it begin in american

culture because it wasn't always like

this

so uh caleb has like a very in-depth um

background of knowledge i have a kind of

narrative myself but he wants to go

first and

i'd be sure

well i mean when you talk about i mean i

guess to give expression to what you

were talking about i um

you know i tweeted out it used to be or

i tweeted out that leftists are mad

about wars

poverty inequality etc

and it seems that synthetic leftists are

not mad about wars poverty and

inequality they're mad that

working-class people are mad about wars

poverty and inequality in a politically

incorrect way um and that you know

largely if you look at you know if you

look at i remember you know way back

when i was like 19 years old i went to

the u.s social forum which was this

left-wing gathering they had in atlanta

georgia they had two of them they had

another one a couple years later in

detroit you know and i had been reading

communist stuff i'm from a small town in

ohio i went to the u.s social forum and

all the different communists maoist

trotskyist anarchist groups are there

but there were a lot of young folks

there at this u.s social forum who had

piercings body piercings and they worked

at planned parenthood or the aclu

or or students against sweatshops or

some kind of ngo

uh and they had piercings and they were

talking this ideology they didn't sound

like anything i'd ever read in communist

theory and it was about white skin

privilege and it was about gender

oppression and it was about about you

know intersectionality and they were

talking this totally different language

um and they you know they were making

quite a bit of money at their you know

at their ngo liberal jobs and you know

they they had their nose piercings and

and

it's weird a lot of them had gone to ivy

league schools harvard and yale and

stanford and places like that and i

remember even back then thinking who are

these people why is this isn't the same

thing as communism this isn't what i've

read in william c foster this isn't what

i've read in mao's little red book this

is something different um and what that

ideology is that the ngocialists i like

to call them you know or the synthetic

left really uh what they espouse this

stuff started at the elite ivy league

schools and it was really training for

the business class right and it's you

know it's basically that if you you know

if you own a big corporation in the

united states and you go to do business

in africa and you act like a

racist [ __ ] and and you speak to

people in a condescending way and you

don't acknowledge their culture and

their history uh you're not going to do

a very good job and you're going to hurt

the image of the united states around

the world and this was about getting the

business community here in the united

states and getting people from these

upper middle class backgrounds to go

to the developing world and interact

with them in a more kind of polite way

and these ngos were built by the cia and

and all of that and it was about trying

to kind of revamp and reinvent the image

of the united states and the height of

that was the election of barack hussein

obama as president of the united states

right uh we had an you know a president

of the united states who was not white

and had a muslim middle name and and had

gone to a muslim school how do you think

the arab spring would have gone if

george w bush had been in office during

it things would be very differently but

it's only because barack obama was

president of the united states that the

usa was able to co-opt the arab spring

and turn it into the destruction of

libya the most prosperous country on the

african continent turned into a civil

war in syria the usa was able to hijack

the arab spring because they worked

really hard on tweaking the optics of

imperialism and that's what

intersectionality is and that's what

white skin privilege is this is all just

tweaking the optics of imperialism it is

sensitivity training for the lieutenants

of empire it's go to the developing

world and don't act like an [ __ ] and

hire people of different races and hire

people of different different genders

and make sure you're representative and

learn that's all this is it's not

marxism it's not socialism it's not

communism i i i think that that needs to

be said now as far as the thing about

the popular front

i i just i can't resist going down this

this rabbit hole because every time i

bring this up some wise guy who thinks

he knows everything he's like really

well read about marxism says oh oh you

want to be a patriotic socialism well

that's called

browderism what you're doing you're

reviving earl browder i've read a book

see i know all about this no you haven't

read a book go read william c foster's

history of the communist part of the

united states go read the struggle

against revisionism go read the

pamphlets from the anti-browder campaign

earl browder's deviation was not that he

was advocating american patriotism the

whole american communist party did that

for the whole time from the time it was

founded up until that time earl

browder's deviation was that he opposed

strikes he wanted to prolong this the

the wartime strike pledge of world war

ii he didn't want to end it he wanted it

to keep going that he he said that us

imperialism was progressive in latin

america he supported american

imperialism against juan peron and and

other nationalist leaders in latin

america he opposed the independence of

puerto rico he said that black people

did not constitute a nation uh earl

browder's deviation and his dissolving

of the communist party and changing it

to the communist political association

was far

more wide-reaching than just patriotism

yes earl browder was into the american

patriotism thing and that was part of

the way the popular front was

implemented in the united states but any

other communist leader would have done

the same thing and the french communists

did that and the uh you know and the

spanish communists did that during the

spanish civil war and the british

communists did that and that to say that

that is browderism is is just juvenile

and it's just a complete

it's very very naive um and that uh that

you know in many cases you have the

maoist movement they're kind of they're

trying to explain away you know how the

communist party when it was good was

doing things that they say are the

opposite of what they do and so they

just made earl browder the fall guy for

the policies that were widely practiced

and implemented um and i will add that

you know one writer i really admire and

respect is nelson peary an

african-american communist and nelson

peary advocates proletarian patriotism

you read his writings he advocates uh

appealing to people on a patriotic basis

african-american communist maoist kicked

out of the communist party during the

1950s went on to form the communist

labor party he very much is an advocate

of proletarian patriotism uh and despite

the fact that he's an advocate of

self-determination for the black belt he

didn't see a contradiction there um and

it's quite interesting because you know

who else was an advocate of this kind of

stuff was the black panthers right go to

listen to the black panthers talk the

black panthers aligned themselves not

only uh with puerto rican organizations

and chicano organizations they align

themselves with with a white

organization called the young patriots

and the young patriots i might add they

did something that i would never do i

think was a big mistake they actually

had the confederate flag as their symbol

now i am opposed to the confederate flag

i think it's an offensive symbol but

they align with a group of young white

people working class white people from

chicago and appalachia who were

organized and organized fighting

imperialism aligned with the black

panthers and called themselves the young

patriots now could you imagine if we

started a communist group now called the

young patriots i mean we would be

destroyed people would people would kill

us but the black panthers had no problem

aligning with them because the black

panthers understood that this was going

to be on the basis of a class struggle

right um and that is that is what is

completely missing class struggle

politics populism we are fighting for

the broad majority of american people

against a billionaire monopolist elite

that has destroyed this country

economically that sends our children off

to die in wars that is looting the place

that is driving us into poverty the

destiny of the american people is in

solidarity with the people of the world

against the big corporations and banks

and that needs to be our message it is

our job as communist at the center of

the empire to convince the american

people that it is in their interests to

stand against imperialism if we're not

doing that we are not doing our jobs

um yeah and uh also i wanted to add um

regarding the origins of this current

left

you know it's it's um

i think something happened specifically

in the post-war period in the united

states or maybe even earlier than then

which has a lot to do it's it's a

confusion of marx's theory

um where the material class struggle was

confused and kind of conflated with

something that really belonged to the

sphere of information and media theory

prop proper so you have this distinction

between the material objectivity of the

class struggle and the manner by which

the knowledge of the class struggle is

disseminated right the consciousness of

the class struggle right these are two

crucial distinctions that i think may

have been taken for granted

um

at a certain point uh the united states

became more of a kind of economy of

signals and information and mass media

um

uh and you know there is an increasing

increased level of what they call

marxism socialization which basically

means um you had this kind of um

economization of spheres of life that

previously weren't like communities and

cities and things like that

and this gave rise to the emergence of a

specific class

of

uh how should i put it an

institutionalized class of the american

which was an arm of the american let's

say deep state whatever the deep state

was at that time

and these institutions also fostered a

specific and unique view of

their relationship to the american

people which was one of social

engineering

um

so the kind of post-new deal and new

deal social engineers

and kind of technocrats uh increasingly

adopted a perspective of

what is rationally contrived within an

institutional setting versus the actual

material reality of the people this was

like their primary contradiction they

were trying to overcome

um and also not just rationally

contrived but like what is the site of

the free use of

moral and intellectual and philosophical

whatever thought

um

now when the vietnam war came i think

this was a crucial period

um

the progressive forces struggled with uh

developing and cultivating a basis for

the opposition toward the war that was

beyond mere

individual morality

we could clearly see this was an immoral

war i mean that's very much clear to

everyone i'm not denying that but

morality is not enough to um

enough to convince the masses to win the

masses right uh unless we're speaking

about the the middle classes uh who you

know have the kind of

free time to be moral

contemplate and care about these kind of

a cultured moral issues

so

increasingly i'm skipping a lot of stuff

but increasingly leftism had to become

associated with

uh middle class moralism and hyper

reflexive which basically means

um based it was no longer something

forged in the kind of material senses of

the american people their kind of

uh intuitions and so on it was

forged from the perspective of reflexive

institutions

um

this inevitably uh corresponded with

the fact that leftists increasingly had

to align themselves with democrats

because all expressions of reactionary

tendencies were obviously coming from

the rural america and the working class

with their conservative instincts

um leftists didn't recognize that

uh

if

if communists do not lead the rural

working class reactionary elements will

be the spontaneous form of uh socialism

right marks and english talk about

reactionary socialism feudal socialism

and this is what we were starting to see

with the reactionary populism

uh in the postwar period i would even

argue to an extent maybe this was some

of the basis of mccarthyism and that you

know the john birch society and all this

kind of stuff

right so

um

i think there was a kind of confusion of

the meaning of the popular front where

communists believe the popular front

means you stand behind the institutions

that represent the people and you don't

create an alternative organ for

representing the people like that we

have to rally behind the democrats

because they represent the popular

elements well actually no they don't

represent the popular elements of

america at least uh

by the time of the counterculture they

stop doing that they're on their way to

stop doing that

they represented a

a representation of the popular

interests of america which is a very

crucial distinction

um

but at a certain point

the american left and communists as a

whole

faced with the inability to transmute

the consciousness of the class struggle

and the precepts of communism and

marxism the only way they could kind of

spread this ideology was within an

institutional setting where people take

thoughts and theories as the premise of

their daily lives like who is going to

take as the premise of their daily lives

uh ideologies right it's going to be

people who exist within institutional

settings who make their daily bread

being paid to spread ideas and write and

read and research and things like that

um and also to to be part of uh

scala pointed out ngos

social engineers activist groups and

these kind of interests corporate and

business

culture interests so there was this

inability to understand that the

consciousness of the class struggle is

not the same thing as the actual

essential site of the class struggle

like it's one thing to know what class

struggle is it's another thing

um

to recognize where it actually is

happening in reality

and

it's in my view marxist and marxist

lenin is within america even marxist

leninist i mean this is especially true

for the the more extreme ones like mauis

those type of people they completely

lost the ability uh to to make this

distinction so when they would go to the

workers for example or working class

people with their special etiology and

ideas and workers just flat out reject

this they would go oh this is proof that

these are a reactionary class they're

not

they're not accepting my special theory

in ideology

but your special theory in ideology has

no content you're not making a concrete

analysis of a concrete situation when

you're speaking to people about marxism

and the class struggle that they're just

going to see you as an academic and an

intellectual who's coming from the

universities trying to socially engineer

their lives but if you expound the

insights of marxism into a concrete

analysis and specifically from the

perspective of media and information

theory a concrete understanding of what

the real content of america's working

class interests are you will be able to

scientifically arrive at a message that

does resonate with america's working

people and which does allow communists

to really lead

as a popular force and not a force

confined to institutions

or mar the marginal fringe right of

people with piercings and

this crazy kind of stuff

so

to me i think we require a comprehensive

re-evaluation of uh the post-war period

specifically

um

because i think

especially around the sino-soviet

conflict a really big air of confusion

and uncertainty was thrusted upon

communists within the west and within

america that i don't think has has been

resolved

as of yet

so we must have a comprehensive

re-evaluation and that's why i also say

you know speaking in regards to existing

parties like the communist party

they must they should re-evaluate the

significance of the popular front right

uh maybe

the popular front was the correct

strategy right

in the 30s and so on but what does it

mean to be faithful to that strategy of

the popular front does it mean

uh trailing behind the democrats or

might it mean

forming alliances with new third-party

initiatives like the people's party and

things like that so i think that is

really the crucial question

when it comes to what are the origins of

this kind of synthetic fake

um

left which is really a bourgeois a force

of bourgeois the consciousness and

culture

uh and how can communists overcome the

mistake of having fallen into the trap

of

aligning themselves with it in the first

place

um

caleb do you have time for one more

question i don't want to keep you too

long sure i know hazel will probably be

streaming all night but um i this is

actually a question for the both of you

uh from a super chatter chaya who asks i

don't know if you've read the book i

know you're familiar with uh their ideas

but they said what's the biggest thing

jay sakai gets wrong in his settler's

book

well for me i would say that he takes a

problem

in u.s society is very real and

he

makes it something

that

therefore leads to the conclusion

that it is never possible that we could

have socialism right he takes

he takes some very very very true things

and there is some misrepresentation in

the book he he misquotes william z

foster intentionally uh distorts what

williams foster is saying at one point

to make williamson foster look deeply

insensitive and racist when if you read

the context of the paragraph he was

clearly not saying what he says and it's

a it's it's a book that is is

problematic in many ways but the main

thing is it points to true things there

is racism among the white working class

of the united states there is a history

of settler colonialism and and you know

what you can call settler populism with

andrew jackson and other things is very

problematic however

the world is constantly changing a does

not equal a

tomorrow is not the same as today and

the world is constantly in flux and for

him to take that you know the arguments

that he makes there basically lead to

the conclusion that it's hopeless that

you can't do anything that there is no

hope um and

i must say you know who is jay sakai

nobody knows he's just there's some

interviews on the internet there's some

articles that have been posted around

very mysterious that book is from the

1980s it's been floating around there

was this weird like very secretive

communist group for a while called mim

or the maoist internationalist movement

that was like you know circulating that

book among prisoners uh throughout the

90s and and such and that book is a very

strange book it kind of it kind of

appeared out of nowhere the author is he

still alive is he still writing stuff

there's a couple articles there's some

like interviews where you can hear his

voice that's it no one knows who he is

no one knows where he came from that

book is everywhere an anarchist mind you

the same kind of people who think that

anyone who admires mao is the same as a

neo-nazi anyone who admires stalin as a

neo-nazi are printing this book by this

so-called maoist and circulating it

around because it's just so important

that we get people to understand that

there's no hope for revolution in the

united states because all the white

people are inherently evil euro settlers

very mysterious right and look let's be

real okay i i don't want to be paranoid

and i'm not leveling any allegations i

just want to say that if i was the u.s

government i would want every communist

in the united states to get settlers

shoved down their throat it's the best

thing you could give to a communist in

the united states you want to convince

people that there's no hope don't go out

and organize don't build a revolutionary

movement that's the book to read it is

the most demoralizing it is the most

effective piece of propaganda

and the fact that no one really knows

who the author is the fact that people

who hate communists people who advocate

violence against communists the antifa

anarchist crowd you know are

distributing that book even though they

hate in theory they hate the people who

wrote it uh you know the fact that that

book is everywhere you can't go to any

communist space communism read it

everywhere this book is and it leads you

to the conclusion that there's no hope

you shouldn't do anything

very mysterious very very mysterious

right and that you know the us

government goes all over the world

carrying out all kinds of psychological

operations and disinformation campaigns

to try and prevent communist revolutions

do you think that they wouldn't take big

efforts to try and control the left in

the united states

and again i saw that book floating

around among prisoners when i was doing

prison activism in ohio it was very

weird and people didn't know where it

came from and the group mim the maoist

internationalist movement was

distributing it it was founded by a guy

named henry park who mysteriously died

and he had some kind of psychological

breakdown and no one ever saw him either

you would just see his newspaper left

around places

very shady history there with that book

very shady history i don't know what's

what's happened maybe the documents will

be released 50 years from now i'm very

very very suspicious of that book i must

say i am highly suspicious of it and

when someone showed me i mean i admire

william z foster he's probably the

greatest communist in american history

and when someone showed me how

intentionally they lied to make it look

like he was being blatantly racist when

if you read the full paragraph he was

saying

pretty much the exact opposite of what

they quoted him as saying at that point

i was just shocked i mean that's the

work

it struck me as as this is not coming

from a good place this isn't a communist

who's just frustrated with the white

working class and has come to some

negative conclusions this is there's a

sinister agenda here at work there's

people being manipulated i i have very

negative feelings about that book and

the role that it's played and i must add

my final thought i'm a little

long-winded tonight but

i have you ever noticed that it seems

like all the third world is for the most

part are white

like it's the weirdest thing you know i

i've met so many communists of color

that are african-american

or latino or whatever and they seem to

have no problem having white workers and

black workers stand arm in arm and they

you know but it's this white it and it

tends to be white people from like upper

middle class backgrounds who are the

ones that are most attracted to this

idea that that you know white people are

inherently reactionary and stuff you

would think it would be people of color

that would come to this conclusion based

on the racism they've experienced but

it's actually a very middle-class thing

you know and before it was put into

words with settlers and stuff like that

the weathermen the weather underground

this was their excuse for doing their

bombing campaign their ultra left

adventurous bombing campaigns they said

oh you know the white people are all

pigs they're all bought off you know

they're not hip and revolutionary and

you know the white youth must choose

size now and and all this look at who

the weathermen were right look at who

the weathermen were right you know i

mean bill ayers you know the bill ayers

who was later became a he's just a

democrat now a friend of barack obama

but he was this big weather underground

bombing guy his family they are the

richest family in chicago he's

you want to talk about a family that

comes from money bernadine dorn very

very wealthy mark rudd very very wealthy

background these are not working class

people who got frustrated with the other

workers this is very much a kind of

upper middle class deviation

to add to the mysteriousness of that

book in particular so again

anti-populism is toxic get rid of

anti-populism that's the neocons that's

leo strauss that's the congress for

cultural freedom hannah aren't susan

sontag irving crystal cia money this is

not our movement communism has been a

popular movement fighting for the people

against empire

yeah the way i would put it um the way

i'd have to put it is basically um

so jay sakai

he talks about he's going into the real

dirty history of the origins of the

american people and

settlers honestly leaving that aside for

one quick second it's really interesting

how at the same time that jay sakai is

engaging in this kind of historical

reductionism and all this kind of stuff

he treats himself as a free rational

agent completely talking from the abyss

and from the aether

jaisakai doesn't believe

that ideological and intellectual

reflexivity has a material basis if he

did believe that he would recognize that

the ability to be given this insight

this consciousness he's trying to foster

right that rests on the basis of a

specific not only a specific class but a

specific people there's only a specific

type of people

as a general trend who are soaking this

stuff up and as kayla pointed it out

it's majority white leftist it's white

people white leftists who see this hyper

criticism and hyper reflexivity as a way

of avoiding

the material premises of um

i guess their own people which is the

working class if they can estrange

themselves from the working class they

can maintain their comfortable class

position as purely institutional and

purely reflexive classes without ever

being forced to confront their real

material the real material basis of

their class like it is the sweat and

labor of america's working people that

feeds academics and

professional managerials and

institutionalized people and by cutting

themselves off from the popular majority

in the broad strata they are cutting um

they're cutting off the possibility of

their privileged social position ever

being threatened they always are

hypercritical against white people and

all this stuff because what they're

basically saying is we are the real

white white people in charge like they

have a monopoly on being

the preeminent uh

white people in power basically they

they have this issue with um

america's working class like you know

during the new deal when fdr he brought

down farmers from texas he brought up

farmers from texas and he gave him

positions in government right

um people who don't they want to prevent

america's working people the rural

people from having any of the

opportunities because at the end of the

day this is a very mediocre class of

people who are just not talented not

very bright not very original not very

creative

and

nothing would eliminate their class

basis more than opening the gatekeeping

ramparts and allowing in some real

genuine and authentic

talent and intelligence and creativity

to pour in from the popular majority so

this is kind of a very common theme

throughout the history of kind of elites

trying to

you know be more morally pure than than

masses right it's a form of gatekeeping

basically and another thing too is that

um

you know what jay sakai gets especially

wrong his whole entire idea of settlers

is wrong because

lenin already pointed out that there is

no pure proletariat a proletariat is

always entwined with a democratic petty

bourgeoisie you won't

you know the proletarianization is when

you are stripped of all land and you

have nothing to salvage your labor

historically speaking

this was never a permanent phrase

there's always some kind of return to

some kind of stability um when during

the russian civ during the war and in

the crisis in the russian empire the

factory proletariat went and returned to

cultivate their landed plots that they

had in the country right there's always

this kind of duality of the proletariat

on the one hand and this kind of

peasantry on the other hand that manages

to persist even beyond

the agricultural peasantry we have the

case of the middle class so-called

middle class the post-war baby boomers

who had their suburban homes and their

white picket fences and cars

um

and the same is true for the period of

the 19th century you

had uh settlers right who had their own

plot marx also described them in capital

um they were able to subsist on the

basis of their own kind of uh private uh

property who at the same time were being

subject to proletarianization now sakai

dismisses this class as a bunch of

immoral settlers stealing indigenous

land but that's not the only thing that

defined this specific class would also

define this um

specific class was as marx was

describing their means of subsistence

right

and which also made them the base of not

only the jacksonian

populism which of course had many

problematic racist and also uh so on

problems but also

phenomenal like uh the farmer's alliance

and the p and which would become the

people's party which cemented an

alliance between

the so-called settlers relevant to jay

sakai small white farmers and also uh

black republicans who also had their own

uh small farms uh and wanted to um

create a movement

to build infrastructure and and

to get off the gold standard and things

like that which would benefit the

overall majority of america's people

so

sakai basically commits the error of

saying because they are settlers who in

effect often participated in the

wholesale theft of indigenous land

um that this means that's all they were

and that's that's what you can reduce

the entire genesis of the american

people too when in fact that's a detail

in an aspect but it's not actually what

primarily defined the genesis

of what we call the american people

proper it's a horrible aspect and a

horrible fact of the history but to

reduce it to that is to

refuse to engage in a materialist

analysis of

what this how this class actually was uh

reproducing itself and constituting

itself materially so that's my criticism

of sakai

can i make sense quickly

okay um you know we published at the

center for political innovation our

textbook it's called we are city

builders uh the

center for political innovation

educational manual and we included in it

a very important uh piece called talk on

the question of philosophy by mao zedong

and it is one of the rare examples of

mao kind of off script where it's a

transcript of mao speaking to a group of

college students about philosophy

and i included it and the reason i

included it is because if you read that

speech talk on the question of

philosophy mount zee tongue 1964

that's who mao really was

mao was a mass organizer mao knew how to

talk to people mao told jokes mao told

stories mao knew how to interact with

people he begins that speech by telling

the the young people there he says go to

the countryside that's where you're

going to get your real education is by

being among the people and that's what

communists need to do uh if you can go

to the people if you can start pushing

revolutionary ideas you can start

building organizations you will break

out of this internet edgelord culture

and you'll understand why proletarian

patriotism is not a bad thing if done in

a rational anti-imperialist anti-racist

way

learning comes from the masses from the

masses to the masses the revolutionaries

are the fish and the masses are the

water that's what what mountain said

that's the approach that we need to have

from the masses to the masses leading

while learning learning while leading if

we can develop that kind of approach of

approach we can develop a mass line that

will eventually lead to the overturning

of capitalism in the united states by

building a mass movement of working

people

very well said um

thank you both so much for your time i

don't want to hold you any longer i know

we've been talking for a while but i

feel like we hit

a lot of really good topics i feel like

we hammered out this uh you know this

debate from a you know side that hasn't

been discussed too much online yet um

but i feel like it's very well

represented i mean if you guys saw the

breakdown of the tweet that i initially

sent out it i mean it was kind of split

50 50 to be honest which i didn't

initially think it was going to be

controversial but it was and then i was

actually kind of surprised at how split

things were so

um

hopefully if there were people on that

side of the spectrum that were thinking

you know you can't be a patriot in a

marxist londoness and an

anti-imperialist all at the same time

maybe now if they've watched this um

either in this live stream or if someone

else is reacting to this further down

the line

you will understand that yes it is very

possible and actually it is uh the only

correct stance to have when you look at

the values of what being a patriot

really means so um thank you again uh

i've included links to both of your

channels twitter's um in the pinned

comment on this chat so if anyone in

watching wants to go follow go do so and

i encourage you to do so um do you have

any last words or where people can

follow you and find you um i will just

say we need a government of action that

will fight for working families and that

will lead us eventually to the

development of socialism with american

characteristics the kind of socialism

that works in china is called socialism

with chinese characteristics it is

uniquely applied to china's conditions

and when socialism comes the united

states it will be a socialism with

american characteristics i'm not sure

what those american characteristics will

be and that will be developed in the

course of building a mass movement and

in the course of struggle but it will be

a unique brand of socialism and if you

don't recognize that you're clueless

cause

um i guess i will just leave something

that might be a little controversial but

it's just my personal uh opinion

i really see great value in the

communist party of the usa i disagree

greatly with the

the strategy they have taken for a very

long time but this is a party that's

over a hundred years old it's tried and

tested against every form of ultra left

um

fanaticism and

and

i while there i think um it requires a

comprehensive reevaluation and internal

criticism

um i really think that it can be a

platform for american communists to

congregate around

um

because it is the communist party in my

view it is the original america

communist party of the usa

and uh

i i view it may perhaps i could be wrong

i'm willing to be proven wrong but i do

see a future in it um

as far as like

potential is concerned so i guess i'll

just

say that i don't know

but yeah

cool well uh thank you so much for uh

coming on and

i think everyone from what i've seen in

the chat really enjoyed this so uh

hopefully it's not the last time you're

both always of course welcome back on

and uh i look forward to building this

with all of you thank you so much yeah

all right

i'll catch you guys later

i just want to quickly say thank you

rickard i missed a lot of your stuff

thank you rick for the five

appreciate you thank you max

thank you rick again

thank you thurmy

thank you x

uh unbuttered toast appreciate you thank

you

solokin

uh thank you bernice appreciate you for

the 100 bits thank you globe poor

appreciate you too

uh thank you gore

sorry if i missed anyone else

but

oh [ __ ] the hidden bean

thank you so much

appreciate you a ton thank you atari

so soulless thank you so much

appreciate you a ton

thank you so much

um

damn patio with the five thank you man

appreciate you a lot

thank you

thank you so much

damn

that was great guys that was really good

that was a really good talk

[Music]

okay

[Music]

foreign

[Music]

a

[Music]

um

indigenous africans

shut the [ __ ] up

you think the eff in america is going to

be [ __ ]

not the dude

and dude trump is more like julius

malema than anyone else shut the [ __ ] up

you think [ __ ] uh

you think like what do you what do you

think you think the [ __ ]

you think the equivalent of the eff in

america

is gonna be like

some psychiatrist no they're not dude

they're going to be like looking like

trump

they're going to be populous the eff is

populist you understand

shut up

[ __ ] cringe lord

[Music]

bro the ultra leftists exist in south

africa

they're called um

the blf

black land first

what are they called

black land

black first

land first

there are a bunch of

ultra leftists in south africa

who splintered from the eff

and they are indistinguishable from

american jai sakai woke people

those people exist in south africa and

the eff don't like them

[Music]

brother the message is not about

tax the rich make the rich pay the

message is

give the land to the working people

the message is

give the working people land

the message is

the message is the government of action

the message is

let's unleash the forces of production

and then inequality is a problem but it

is not the primary problem the primary

contradiction is not inequality

that's a cultural an issue it's a

cultural issue

[Music]

i don't care if dudes are out here with

yachts and lamborghinis and ferraris and

mansions

i don't care what do i care what do i

care if another man

has nice things i don't give a [ __ ]

what i care about

is how that gets in the way of the

american people's common good

what i care about is [ __ ] golf

courses that take up land that could

otherwise be used for better things what

i care about is the fact

that

they are monopolies

who are making the little guy

have no opportunity to rise to the top

that's my issue i don't [ __ ] care if

people are rich have a ferrari have a

lambo have a yacht i don't give a [ __ ]

and invite me to the yacht too by the

way i don't care i don't care about that

it's the ish the issue is monopoly now

if as a byproduct you lose all those

nice things then hit kick rocks dude

[Music]

kick rocks

i like nice things i want nice things

i mean i don't know

maybe not that far but i like nice

things dude i like nice jackets you know

you know guys you know my weakness i

like jackets i'm a jacket guy

you know

i have super expensive jackets but

they're not mine they were give they're

my dad's and he doesn't wear them

anymore so i just take them

but that's me dude

i'm a jacket guy

i'm a jacket guy dude i would drop 5k

for a jacket a nice jacket i would spend

not now i'm i can't afford it now but

let's say i had a ton of money i would

buy expensive jackets

no joke i'm a jacket guy

what's my dad like

he's when i get okay when i become a 2k

andy i'm gonna bring my dad on stream

when i'm a 2k andy

i'll bring my dad on stream

because he wants to come on stream but

i'm i'm not gonna let him

until i'm a 2k

[Music]

andy but i might be it might be on

youtube because he might say to your

[ __ ] i don't know

might be tos [ __ ] i have no idea

so in two months

dude if i'm a 2k andy in two months you

know how [ __ ] great that would be

if i'm a 2k andy in two months i'm

quitting lost i don't think i'm gonna be

too candy in two months

dude remember i only have 10k followers

like how about how about i get some

followers you know i don't have any

followers

i only have [ __ ] 10k followers you

know how [ __ ] low that is

dude like dylan burns

he's at

450 views right now

he has 34k followers i have a i have a

third of his followers

but i have 700 views

you

know

what's your dad's political meaning

um

he doesn't care

he thinks all american politics screw up

you know which is true

but he's more into like foreign he's

more into like foreign

middle eastern stuff you know

i really didn't know that

i really didn't know that you know what

i mean i did not know that

i had no idea

i never knew that about aoc but

i never knew that

thank you jackson

i never knew that i swear to god i

always thought

otherwise

but

you know um

bruh this is this is the democratic

socialism message

this is the communism with a capital c

message you know

this is a communism with a capital c

message

communism

democratic socialism communism

democratic socialism

this is the most beautiful [ __ ]

outfit anyone could wear at the met gala

i swear to god this is beautiful

kanye is going to design cpusa 2036

merch this is the most beautiful [ __ ]

thing the most beautiful statement you

can make

through fashion

aoc is mary antoinette and kanye are the

peasants storming versailles

[Music]

foreign

will there be a six month badge

i'm gonna replace all the badges as soon

as i can as soon as i can replace them

i'm gonna i'm gonna

but i'm gonna get new sub badges

[Music]

i literally have another browser up you

guys are [ __ ] stupid

i have a browser up i'm not looking at

this [ __ ] picture

i'm looking at something else the [ __ ]

is wrong with you guys i'm gonna put the

[ __ ] window here so here i'm looking

at the other window here i'm looking at

aoc other window here i hit there we go

i'll look here

okay you guys are so [ __ ] annoying

[Music]

honestly what's the issue with

democratic socialism what is the issue

you know force the vote

that that was just

that was just you know

that was just unreasonable

you know what i mean

of course the vote what is that

what's forced to vote

what is that

there's a guy who actually thinks i'm

serious it's just red lips no dude you

don't know what's going on

yeah maybe we should just tax the rich

honestly

[Music]

you guys did you see the matrix trailer

let's watch the matrix trailer together

or should we finish the reddit

let me see if there's [ __ ] on the reddit

worth finishing

i'm going to look through ready

yeah chat with kanye 3k definitely

definitely

[Music]

foreign

[Music]

oh my god

the [ __ ]

yeah we do have some

we do have some reddit [ __ ]

[Music]

caleb and dawson jackson forever rising

100 years cpusa 2036 for all-time 100

years cpus 2030. thank you captain

waffles thank you so much

appreciate you thank you so much

i do it

so i could see their stone

idle into [ __ ] pieces

to let them even know that everything

they think about this world is wrong

nothing gives me more satisfaction than

exposing how each and every one of these

[ __ ] people are fake and don't know

anything these authorities you look up

to these powers you believe in they rest

on thin

[ __ ] air

they are nothing they are dust they are

[ __ ] ash

that's why i'm here

[Music]

bruh

it's not durham it's someone else imc

it's infrasound

infrasound show me that

in for sound

damn look at this

not again we broke international law

invading panama

now we're breaking the law with the

fabricated drug war why can't we leave

latin america alone haven't we exploited

them long enough damn that's captain

america saying that [ __ ]

damn okay

this is literally vegan humor what the

[ __ ] no i got to know putin

based trump look at trump dude

and you tell me why

everyone was sympathetic to trump who

was a real anti-imperialist around the

world look at this you know i got to

know putin and president xi of china and

kim jong-un and all of them very well

they're at the top of their game

china's ambassador to u.s reportedly

asked biden administration to please

shut up and zoom call

based

know your place

i didn't know your place

know your place

the underlying

what the hell is this

the underlying thing in the age of

individuals the age of the self that

we've all lived through

is

whilst at the same whilst on the one

hand

we are very free and we're very

conscious that we are free and that we

can express ourselves there is also a

deep sense of self-consciousness in our

time

people have a sense they've been watched

and you get this online all the time

that people behave as though they are

being watched even if they're not

dancing is this really strange moment

because on the one hand

it's that moment when many people give

up that sense of self-consciousness and

really let themselves be what they are

but at the same time you're right

they're dancing within a quite a

pre-programmed you know everyone every

dj knows the range of beats per minute

that you can work with they think

they're free but they're like robots in

a system and it's that again that

paradox of our time is that we feel

completely free

but what we don't see are the tendrils

of others of the systems of power that

sort of hold us together

[Music]

the underlying thing in the a

infrasound

nice

newfoundland up so nice

china repairs to test thorium fuel

nuclear reactor

mao is slarping on discord what is this

for two days we will have a morning

period for our chairman who has recently

passed away

during this time there will be strict

moderation on memes and generally

unprincipled behavior

i hope that this is understood and the

server can voluntarily abide by this as

i trust you are all very principled

comrades tldr we are having two days of

mourning no pcp jokes or gonzalo jokes

or you'll receive harsh punishment long

live chairman gonzalo

you know it's really

sad when you take a step back

you take a step back right

and you realize

that these people

are [ __ ]

15 years old

you realize these people are 15 years

old right

you realize these people are literally

like

14 to 17 years

old long live chairman gonzalo

you know that right

you know these aren't there might be

adults but those are the people you got

to watch out for because yikes it's kind

of creepy but

i mean it is creepy but

these are actually psychotic zoomers

they all have anime profile pictures and

it's super super weird

super weird

anyway

pesto mime is pesto posting again

okay there's so much [ __ ] we've missed

on the [ __ ] reddit

latest polling in russia looks good for

the communist party

nice

conversation with brian berkley

[Music]

i'm literally going through so much [ __ ]

in the reddit

pesto mimes weird posts that don't make

any sense but everyone just ignores

is there any [ __ ]

my god

how many i've i've missed a week of

reddit posts

i've missed a week have i really missed

a week of reddit posts

have we not covered the reddit in a week

i've literally been scrolling just

trying to find ozzy weinstein

you didn't

okay we're gonna keep going

okay you know what i don't i don't care

about red anymore thank you so solos

yeah only infrasound show has shared

good stuff

okay finally we caught up

okay i think we're caught up

yeah i think we got

up yeah there's nothing on the reddit

oh my god there's still so much more

oh my god durham operations banger

featuring haas makes it to the top of

the

subreddit

what

where am i

versus john circo what the [ __ ] is this

where are you talking [ __ ] now let's go

[ __ ] you

yeah that was

it i was in that [ __ ]

i [ __ ] your mother bro

bruh

oh my god

okay

okay let's check this out we have a

really cool post

house is such an incel

how can he be this dense and stupid and

treat these women like [ __ ]

he's stuck in the middle school

mentality jordan peterson pick up crap

grow up highs or quit the bit real

people don't like it it's not cute

um

my dm say otherwise but okay how's this

such an incel

yeah you're right they don't like you

you're right you're right what can i say

you're ultimately right

um

this is how this guy talks to women

ready

here comrade

i want you to know that as a male

feminist

i ultimately consider you

my equal

and as my equal i will never treat you

differently

and

i want you to know that you are just as

smart and just as capable as any man

and i humbly

reveal myself as an admirer from afar

but not in a male chauvinistic sense

tis no difference where it's to be a

different gender

all genders are heteronormative

constructs anyway

but i am humbly proposing to you

that we can enter into

sexualizing relationships on a purely

consensual basis and

you will allow me to sniff your hair

as a feminist

[ __ ] weirdo

am i wrong that's literally how they are

that's literally how they are let's

watch the matrix trailer

curtis yarvin the trailer

this is going to be the curtis yarvin

trailer

thomas

[Music]

you seem particularly triggered right

now can you tell me what happened

i've had dreams that weren't just drums

triggered

is there nudity in this trailer

i don't think there would be right

there's no nudity there can't be

they can't show titties in a [ __ ]

trailer right

no they can't okay

am i crazy

we don't use that word in here

[Music]

hi

what is this [ __ ] movie like

who is this is not neo this is

this isn't neo dude neo was not like

this

have we met

[Music]

he has to keep taking blue pills

[Music]

at all

wait this looks like it might be cool

dude this kind of seems like it'd be

cool

as long as they don't make it woke it'll

be cool i think they're going to make it

work though

yeah watch this [ __ ] be woke it's gonna

be like

and it was all about indigenous crimes

you know what i mean i don't know dude i

don't know what they say nowadays this

movie is a parable for racism it was all

about racism

and we need to do better

[Music]

literally saying keanu reeves doesn't

age

what is the message

what is that can you make better cgi in

2021 because this looks like [ __ ] dog

[ __ ]

this this looks stupid as [ __ ]

[Music]

time to fly

there's something really tacky about how

this looks

but i also like it

like it looks so

90s and 2000s but i like it

[Music]

if you want the truth

you're going to have to follow me

[Music]

the only thing that matters to you is

still here i know it's why you're still

fighting

and why you will never give

up you don't know me did morpheus die he

didn't die did he did morpheus die

morpheus actor

he's not a lot he's alive right

oh [ __ ]

oh thank god he's still alive okay i

like that guy

oh he died in the movie that's what it

was

oh he died in the movie

no

that looks stupid i'm sorry that looks

stupid

[Music]

morpheus is dead in the mmo they made

what mmo the [ __ ] you talking about

[Music]

is

this looks stupid what the [ __ ] is this

[Music]

actually it kind of looks cool

it looks unique it looks if it's

intentional i don't know if it's

intentional it really looks outdated it

really looks like it's from the 2000s

or the 90s

after all these years to be going back

to where it all started

back to the matrix

i i just you can't make this [ __ ]

movie

after making

one two and three dude i saw three okay

i saw that weird robot world and you

know you took it so far with the [ __ ]

the nautilus or whatever the ship was

you can't just [ __ ]

make this movie

and make it a throwback to the first

they're all in this city and it's oh is

it reality no no we already saw the

[ __ ] first three films

dude why don't you grow balls and

continue off of from three

i wanna know what happens in the real

world make it about the real world

you know you should do

you should make it

about the real world

and

how people who live in the real world

are choosing to go into the matrix

as like virtual reality that would be

cool

that would be cool that would be cool

that would be cool make it take place in

the real world but people choose

to go into a virtual reality

and like it's like a video game make it

like that that would be cool

that would be cool

okay this is not cool

this is stupid

[Music]

that's what happened in the third movie

no it's not

they need to reboot this one first

i don't think they need to re i didn't

even think they didn't mate to make this

why did they even make this no one even

asked for this [ __ ]

but no we didn't need a reboot and keanu

and they're all too old they're all too

[ __ ] old

they're all too old and

bruh i'm gonna i know this is not a

kumar stream

but can you give me some eye candy

to motivate me to watch this

give me some eye candy why don't you

cast some fine like look like blade

runner dude look at that girl from blade

runner she kept me watching that movie

you know

give me something to look at

what why did hollywood movies stop

casting hot people

can you tell me why

hollywood stopped casting attractive

people

and now i have no reason to watch

yeah give me something for the male gays

i am a male and if you want me to watch

your [ __ ] movies

give me the mail wait thank you

thank you love appreciate you give me

something for the male gays honestly

i stood if you gave me something for the

male gays i could watch a five hour

movie

cuz down objectify women

shut up

give me the gaze

g-a-z-e the male gaze

give me something to look at thank you

mercurial

um hold on

thank you

male gaze is boring

for you

not for

me you can watch

if they cast

the chick next to aoc would you watch it

no

dude the best vr or ar anything i've

watched

was memories of alhambra

[ __ ] it's about ar and it's so [ __ ]

original and so

[ __ ] good you put on contact lenses

and you start seeing npcs dude imagine

imagine if you put on

let me let me um put something for the

thumbnail imagine if you put on contact

lenses

and you just went outside

and you saw npcs and you have a virtual

sword and you can [ __ ] fight

that's way better than vr

it's ar because it's in the real world

but you put on contacts

and you auto you see like another

you know what i mean

it's so [ __ ] cool

vr sucks right because ar you stick it's

still in the real world but

they just add stuff

dude memories of alhambra is the

[ __ ] dude i need season two i need

season two

i need season two

there will never be the season two will

not be as good as season one dude that

show had such a good [ __ ] mystery a

buildup the main character it was so

mysterious what was going on

and it was it's so [ __ ] good

they started copy striking gala pictures

are you joking about that or no

[Music]

are you joking

are you joking charm

is that a joke or not

they can't do that okay good

okay hassan watched it okay good

yeah

oh man

yeah as i was saying

the matrix

is overrated

but the best one was what was the one

that had the french girl what was that

one

matrix

monica

is her name

yeah persephone

and she was in the matrix reloaded which

is the

third or the second one

it's the second one

number two is the best film

[Music]

i know i like number two dude number one

was like

i i i you know why two is the best one

because i don't care

i don't care

about the like the city that he's in the

fake the matrix sucks like the actual

matrix sucks what i liked about the

matrix

was the in between like the [ __ ]

secret clubs

where like people didn't know

but they knew

that it was the matrix and it was like

a really fringe elite

let me show you let me show you

matrix two

percep funny

they can't show nudity can they

oh [ __ ]

it's got flagged

damn

[Music]

let me show you

the best matrix film

this is this is the cool parts of the

matrix

when they're just chilling in reality

and they're just like you know what i

mean it's in between

[Music]

hold up this is a good thumbnail

yeah dude

this is literally

the best one

this is the best matrix matrix two

best one easily the best one

this is the best one

by far

[Music]

this is what's cool like this [ __ ]

places

that's what's cool about the matrix not

the [ __ ] stupid city i didn't care

about that

i cared about these parts

[Music]

every nerd in school thinks they look

like this you ever notice that every

nerd in school

thinks that they're like this

you're not like this dude stop you're

just cringe

you're just cringing weird every [ __ ]

nerd dude mold bug thinks he was like

this curtis yarvin thinks he was like

this guy you weren't dude you're just

[ __ ] weird stop

okay

[Music]

it's all right boys bear with me

this fellas work for my husband they do

is dirty

it's a good thumbnail

dude

how old was she in this let me see

monica bellucci

damn she was actually kind of old she

was like

36 years old

what up jason

watching your eat it with kaiut bot what

are your thoughts on her

what are my thoughts on her

i don't really have any

i don't know i don't know

i really don't have money thoughts about

her

that's the truth

she seems she seems

sarcastic

i don't know

she seems this is this is my take on

caillou or her name's kiana my take on

kiana

this is this might this one this might

take ready

i feel like in person

she is super super super serious

i feel like she's a very

serious smart person

like very serious and very smart like

very

like she could i feel like

tiana could be

an agent she could be like a cia agent

or something

she could be like a secret agent she

just has that

level of seriousness you know what i

mean

that's my take on her

that's my proclamation

i think she likes decepting guys and

lets them think she's a little dumb no

she likes mocking them

through their face she mocks them

and like

like very subtly with sarcasm but i be i

won kiana i like i won she lost and i

won and i'll tell you why

i don't care if you're sarcastic with me

like if you tell me

like oh

you're such a big man with big muscles

i don't care if you're mocking me like

you're saying it so that's good enough

you know i don't care if you're

sarcastic

i don't mind that

what do i mind you know

i that's a w for me

no that's a that's a w like you're still

saying it

right

you know what i mean i'm fine with like

i'm i'm a very direct person like if you

say oh haas you're skinny i'm like huh

who the [ __ ] but if you just like

mockingly say oh my god haas

you have such big muscles

that is so whatever i'm like

okay like okay i'm fine with that

you know what i mean

you could be sarcastic or mocking me i

do not care

i do not care

i don't think that deeply i'm not

like i'm honestly not like thinking

about it that deeply i'm it's all on the

surface you know what i mean

like i don't care what your real

intention is

it's enough for me you know

it's enough for me

but

are you gonna make more content with ink

bites no

no i banned her from the chat

and removed her and stuff and

yeah

i

just i don't i i i i i is at this it's

like

this is why this is why

i'll tell you why

because she sided with chat

she sided with circus chat against me

and at that point i'm like

yeah at that point it's like

i don't need this chat you know i don't

need to pander to nobody you understand

like you gotta pander and [ __ ] good luck

with that i don't give a [ __ ] i got

nothing to do with that

circus chat incident two days ago was a

bad look do you think so

i don't care dude i follow where my

heart takes me

i just follow where my heart takes me

i'm like a dog chasing a car i wouldn't

even know what i to do it if i caught it

but yeah

i just follow where my heart takes me to

go you know

have you seen the destiny debate yeah

gaga you gotta chill okay you gotta

chill

you really gotta chill you're a [ __ ]

mod

you can't say that [ __ ]

can't say that [ __ ]

although if you think about it all other

streamers mods what they say about me

and they get a pass whatever it's not

we're not giving equal treatment okay

there's no equal treatment

you gotta chill okay

you gotta chill with that

i will debate gaga someday

do it literally just go on vc she'll

debate you

i've never heard gaga be toxic in my

[ __ ] life every time she yells at

people to go debate in vc

she's never actually toxic

she's always nice to everyone she talks

to why is that

you ever notice that

ink defended you today against her chat

i mean that's fine but

i don't know

don't don't don't bother them you know

don't go and bother them and whatever

just that's how that's how it is on

twitch some streamers

connect and other times they don't

connect simple as that sometimes they're

they friends and their network and

sometimes they don't simple as

and if i catch you in their chat doing

bad [ __ ] you're gonna get banned that

rule still applies you

know if you go in the chat and still

talk [ __ ] you're gonna get banned and

also don't talk [ __ ] here don't talk

[ __ ] here there's no hard feelings

there's no hard feelings

no bad blood but

you know that's just

some [ __ ] is just too far you know

simple as that

you good with zurich yeah i'm good with

zerka

i'm good with zerko

and also let me tell you another thing

about with ink bites now i'm just gonna

come full

full disclosure

i told you i didn't have good intentions

i did not have good intentions with her

i told her that i told you guys that

and

you know it's as simple as that like it

you know it should end now it should end

now

because again i don't have good

intentions

i am not like a good guy who's going to

be a good boyfriend and you know be a

real in a relationship

i don't have good intent i'm being

honest i'm just being honest with you i

don't have good intentions i'm not

really looking for a relationship

so

it's you know it's not that serious it's

really not serious

it's not serious

trust

me

you know i could be the type of guy who

just plays people and pretends

but

i'm just not that guy i'm just not that

guy

you know

so leave it at that

true you'd be a bad bf

i'm i'm not really looking for a

relationship

at all so i'm gonna be real with you

guys i'm not looking for a relationship

i'm just not i'm not

i i do not trust anyone there's no i

don't trust anyone in this life

right now at least for now for now i do

not trust anyone i just don't trust

anyone

that's as simple as that i don't trust

nobody

so i'm not looking for a relationship

and yeah simple as that

relationship equals

right

i'm not that thirsty i'm really not that

thirsty in general i'm really not a

thirsty guy i'm gonna be real i'm not

guys think about it

for years

i

was just using my left hand for years

how many of you

have

gone years without getting any

so i can

cope with that i can deal with that okay

i can deal with that and yes i'm a lefty

when it comes to that

you don't trust zerka it seems like you

do

i trust zerka more than anyone on

which

guys i i am not a thirsty guy i'm not

i'm not

i have to force myself to pursue someone

and plus she said

to stop pursuing her so i'm just gonna

stop she said that on stream

so why wouldn't i just stop

you know

simple as that

i'm not gonna force no i don't force

[ __ ]

have you communicate with zerka to avoid

any misunderstanding

um

we've been in contact don't worry about

it

are you still planning on going to texas

i don't know i don't know what's going

on

possibly

all guys have used their hand since the

mid-2000s

yeah

that's actually why

soft peach light radio account created

seven minutes ago

lying i heard that what what did you

hear

new account

what did you hear

what did you hear soft peach

go ahead

i'll give you a chance

do what you gotta do what did you hear

it was this

a what

let me look at what that means

don't act like it wasn't there

what was in there

an alt account created just to watch me

after getting banned

but who is it

is the question

who is it

they're

you're banned

being banned is the worst fate

that can be fall

if you could delete one movie from all

of history and everyone's mind what

would it be

avengers

easily the avengers

easily the avengers there's not even a

doubt

about that

if you could delete one philosopher

would from history why would it be

spinoza it literally would be spinoza

it would literally be spinoza spinoza's

the only guy that i just think was wrong

you know that

spinoza is like the only guy that i just

think is wrong

i just think he's wrong

you know

how about the liz

he was cringe

who's grinch work you're very good very

loyal

aren't you boys

yes yes

we come from a much older version

oh yeah this is probably two os i can't

show this

every one of us she's in love

anyway

now delivers okay i'm sorry the loose is

okay

i mixed up some things

the liz was fine

[Music]

foreign is

[Music]

foreign

[Music]

foreign

[Music]

whatever

[Music]

oh

[Music]

thank you so much man

[Music]

um

[Music]

foreign

[Music]

thank you kevin

all right let's finish the kurdish

interview the curtis jarvan interview

let's finish this

let's finish it where we last left off

did her ticket cost 35 grand

you're telling me aoc paid 35 grand to

go to the [ __ ] met gala really

let's watch goldbug exact same reason

they hate your makeup professional and

when you sympathize when you have this

friend enemy distinction when you have

this sort of you know kind of idea of

we're at war with these people i mean i

can't tell you how uh when walter

mondale

lost the election in 1984 i was living

in cyprus um you know

dude aoc was like

i'm gonna go to the met gala

and

this would be aoc ready

i got invited to the met gala

and

i was really thinking

that

i was gonna do something a little bit

special so

i'm

gonna put the dress

to put tax the rich

and

this is really gonna be

quite special

you know

shut up you know what i mean

that's literally how she was thinking

tell me i'm wrong

[Music]

off the off the coast of turkey a little

little island there yeah and i was

getting my news two or three days late

because we could only read the

international herald tribune and i was

elected because my girlfriend wants to

sleep what do i do

sleep with

me seven years old i was just

utterly devastated that this like foul

creature reagan had won an election over

this like fundamentally good indecent

and wise man walter mondale you might

have had the same word well you know i

did not have the same you do not have

the same reaction right you know um um

um but that was absolutely my reaction

and and and you have this reaction when

you're part of and this is true by the

way of any aristocracy and any sort of

ruling class especially in an oligarchy

where there's sort of no

kind of center of power to balance

aristocratic power in an oligarchy like

ours in a world that's ruled by the deep

state or the swamp or the cathedral or

whatever you want to call it this world

of permanent influential people inside

and outside the government um and it's

it's very important that many of them

many of these power centers are outside

the government proper

and you might have noticed that um and

and they're beyond the control of the

population yeah yeah that makes them

completely unaccountable you know to

sort of digress a little bit if you took

the new york times

and or all you know all the prestigious

mainstream media just shut down the rest

it's all dying anyway you know like the

two or three most prestigious outlets

and instead of calling them private

companies

a

[Music]

um

[Music]

is

[Music]

foreign

[Music]

is

[Music]

is

[Music]

is

[Music]

god damn

it's at least a reasonable thought and

you know the interesting question is

okay is the new york times a democracy

is it um how is the new york times

governed and then you think about it and

you're like oh i see it's a fifth

generation hereditary absolute monarchy

the problem with moldova he's just not

smart

he's kind of smart but he's not that

smart

right

like mobile you don't understand mobile

doesn't understand the difference

between private property

and sovereignty

he's in the anglo box he doesn't

understand that private property and

sovereignty are not the same thing

private property does not

mean

sovereignty

like you got to understand that dude

private property does not mean

sovereignty

please understand that

[Laughter]

like you can't have a private state

because that's not what a state means

that's the opposite of what a state is a

state is not private property

else it's not a state period try as you

may you cannot eliminate this form of

government and and and that's what gives

it its weight and its prestige the very

font that the new york times is written

in is saying respect this fifth

generation it's fifth is it fifth at

least at least generation absolute

monarchy and in fact i think one of the

reasons that we've had this sort of you

know

um

woke explosion since um you know i try

to not use that word because if you've

noticed they've stopped using it yeah um

um but uh you know it's so easy to say

uh one of the reasons we've had this

latest woke explosion since 2013

actually i think one of the problems the

times has now for anybody people who are

listening thank you man

appreciate you mango neil thank you

i know it's not likely but

anytimes people out there

i think your problem is that you have a

weak king

i think the latest

salzburger is letting his office be run

by the office slack yeah and i think

that basically that is doing what an

oligarchy does which is to reward

increasingly unbalanced perspectives

why do you that's a very interesting

observation why do oligarchies

reward increasingly unbalanced i mean

that would seem like not a great

self-preservation strategy well yeah

there's no strategy here it's a

decentralized oligarchy right and so you

know you basically have to sort of look

within this mindset of the american

governing class the people who went to

you went to a good school right tucker i

went to a bad school well really yeah

i went to trinity college in hartford

connecticut i wish i didn't never trust

well you know i was unimpressed to be

there i was unimpressive while i was

there and i'm ashamed that i wasted four

years well i'm i'm a legacy brown admit

and uh um i'm not sure i needed the

legacy admissions but the fact is i got

it and um um brown university and

providence rhode island yes yes and

brown university in providence

providence rhode island and you know all

i can say about these people who believe

the woke explosion started in 2013 or

whatever is uh you know they should have

been a brown with me in 1991 because

it's exactly the same doctrine yeah mold

was like

yeah like in 1991 like

i was not allowed to say the n-word and

i wasn't even allowed to yell it

it's the same thing

okay dude shut up

it was not the same i mean i get what

he's saying but like dude come on it

wasn't the same thing

you're just a little bit too edgy

like when i was at brown in 1991 like i

could not even say the n word

it's ridiculous

and and you know so that just means that

its roots cannot be later it's like if

you found like a bat coronavirus from

1991 right you know you can't say well

this was created in 2013 right right and

and so so it's it's a very it's a very

deep problem and

you know it doesn't date to 1991 either

this is a very this is sort of a deep

strain of thinking

in the american aristocracy in the

american upper class it's the way these

people who

sort of were my people

think

and

you know where does it come from

oh my gosh where does it come from i

think that you know there's a couple of

ways that you can answer that question

uh a one fun way is to answer it

genealogically and so you can kind of

work backward in time and say where who

are the people

take the way the average american

college student thinks in 2021

now let's find the people in 1921

who think like this person

where are these people do they exist did

these were these attitudes invented and

if you go back in 1921 and you look for

people who

think like

americans today you will find these

people

um they'll be in greenwich village

they'll be in provincetown they'll be

you know you know contain many like

super rich trust fund people um you know

they're the people that john reed went

to harvard with right one of the things

i say is you know

the the most accurate historical movie

that i know of is red with john reed

because all you have to do is take these

people put them in funny clothes

give them funny accents and tell them to

act naturally and and you basically

you're like yeah while the hollywood

stars of the 1980s they have the same

sexual habits

as the you know ruling class of the

1920s they hang out in the same places

they're the same people

no i don't buy that right you know this

is this is he right i don't know maybe

he's right something

once you establish that this i hate that

movie by the way reds is the shittiest

movie of all time

i would ban that movie i would ban that

movie sort of way of thinking

and this way of being modern is older

than anyone alive

it's actually a really reds is the

[ __ ] shittiest [ __ ] movie

[ __ ] live movie that's like

turning the bolshevik revolution into a

[ __ ] color

revolution let's

talk out again

it's not how it [ __ ] was dude

the bolshevik revolution was a

revolution committed by

real russian

men sailors hardened in battle tough

[ __ ] people that's who [ __ ] did it

i want to make a comparison that i can't

i probably can't

i'll just say like the the october

revolution was more like a certain

political event in america that happened

this year

than what reds was depicting let's just

say that it was more like that

really helpful observation it was not

some [ __ ]

landsale and liberals

shut the [ __ ] up you know

because it makes you sort of stop

blaming people and start to think more

about structures the system the system

and it's like

it was sailors and soldiers and peasants

it was not [ __ ]

you know

this [ __ ] stupid

what rewards

you know these kinds of ideas it's very

very simple it's like if you read

anyone's college application essay what

is the most common thing that these

people who are applying to college

because they're applying literally

you're on your college application you

were ranked as the amer as a member of

the american aristocracy as surely as

peter the great's table of ranks

okay you are applying when you apply to

college you were applying for a rank

the fact that it's not official there

isn't like some like badge you get or

anything like that

okay sure but you're applying for a rank

and what do you say when you're applying

for for a rank

very simple you want to change the world

you want to make an impact

everyone basically who aspires to matter

in this country in this world today is

someone who wants to make an impact what

you're saying when you say i want to

make an impact is literally you were

saying i want power

and

because you're literally saying i want

power and feeling powerful even though

there's no possible world in which

millions of people can actually

literally hold power which means affect

government decisions or affect

government authority they're saying i

want to be powerful

and so

if you want to be powerful that's kind

of true when people say like i want to

make an impact that's what they're

saying

that's kind of true it's kind of true

it's kind of true

that's kind of true that's kind of true

that's kind of true

that's kind of true that's kind of true

that's kind of true that's pretty true

pretty true kind of true that's pretty

true kind of true

kind of true that's pretty true

in a way it's kind of

it's true it's gonna true

you know

it's pretty true

pretty true

it's kind of true

it's going to trip

to true

[Music]

and there's basically all of this um

essentially pornography of power out

there saying

you can you know

feel powerful by supporting this you can

feel powerful by putting this sign in

your yard this putting this sign in your

guard reminds you that you matter that

you're trying to make a difference that

you realize how bad things are often

you'll like think of the powers that be

as completely imaginary corporate

conspiracies or something like that um

and you'll basically be like i'm making

a difference what your sign actually

says this sort of goes back to the kind

of machiavellian approach of seeing you

know the difference between

sort of the objective and the subject of

reality what all of those signs really

say i'm cribbing from a famous um

dissident essay from vassal of havel

here what they really all say is i

support power

i support the government i support the

parties in charge exactly i think i

think this every day

you know and it's just like it's like

it's like the glasses and they live you

know when i drive by and i see a black

lives matter sign in someone's driveway

what they're saying is i'm obedient to

the regime yeah yeah or i love power and

so there's a sort of duality between

loyalty and ambition and ambition

because what you're saying is i am loyal

to the regime and i am happy for the

feeling of powerful that be the feeling

of power that being part of the party is

giving me exactly um and and so it's

just it's the most common thing in the

world and and you know you look at this

regime and what's so funny is that

americans are exposed to all of this

starting in like

you know

childhood they're exposed to all of this

like dystopian fiction like you're

constantly reading about dystopias in

your like why a books and you're like

you know it's it's non-stop and yet you

know you have these sort of basic

dystopian things like you know

the government uh you know these signs

actually say i love power which is

exactly what vaslav havel said uh in

czechoslovakia in 1976. i wonder if

there's any way in which our system of

government is anything like

czechoslovakia's in 1976. it's not very

it had a center and ours does not have a

center and there was a there was a there

was a polyp bureau in czechoslovakia in

1976 there was a central intelligence

agency this was um you know this is a

classic totalitarian structure and the

thing is what happens to americans is

they sort of look for this center and

they don't find it and they don't

understand how the system can basically

evolve

to this point

without having some kind of central

control because they see they you know

my one of the one of the various

concepts that people find in this

million words that they really like

how is it like czech slovakia

that says just like communism

like is my idea of the cathedral yes and

the point that i keep making is is

it's simply it's a socratic point it's

simply a question what is your theory of

why the washington post and the new york

times and

every other prestigious and the guardian

and every other prestigious voice in

society and every prestigious university

in society is always on the same page

yes it looks as though there was some so

why does yale why do yale and harvard

always agree on everything couldn't yale

become go libertarian while you know

harvard is is going woke like why

wouldn't that happen and you just you

look at reality and you're like that's

there's no way that could happen that

could never happen and if it could never

happen it means that these organizations

are essentially branches

you know of the same thing of the same

thing but when you look at the

organizational structure you don't find

any evidence of that and you're like

where is where are the wires like i'm

looking at this and i'm not seeing the

wires when i saw you know when you look

at say the history of any authoritarian

regime whether it's i get asked my

producer are you following this it's

amazing when when when you look at you

know sort of the power structure of

eastern europe nazi germany or whatever

it's a classic dictatorship classic

dystopia you see the fuhrer the fuhrer

has a minister of information right he's

like print this there's an

organization and when you look at

harvard and yale and you know the whole

rest of the system okay again there are

these accreditation bodies there are

various funding things but there's no

org chart and and the thing is you can

sort of basically

work very hard to kind of see an org

chart that isn't really there

or you can think very hard about why

this happens and i can tell you very i

mean it's really

it's not a hard concept to explain i

think it's a hard concept to evangelize

or it's actually it's a pretty subtle

concept unfortunately

when you think about the way these

oligarchies work

the model of the people who believe in

these things that put the signs on

you know their lawns is actually very

reasonable they're like why should we

delegate these decisions to harvard

and the answer is harvard and yale and

the whole you know other you know

collective of this world why do we

delegate this decision to these people

these people

there are very very clear pragmatic

reasons for doing that one is

we know that these institutions select

the smartest people around they're

incredibly competitive they're

incredibly hard to get into i actually

know the answer to this

all of this

incredibly hard to rise in and they

create these incredible concentrations

of expertise

and um well maybe maybe you know the way

i think about covet is a good example of

the way these things go wrong so

basically that view of the world is says

when the public has to make decisions

about virology

who are we going to call and the

oligarchic answer is

obviously we are going to call the

virologists oh what are we going to call

your like aunt in iowa what excuse me

the one i saw from the plane at 30 000

feet like are we gonna call them people

with the rodeo uh no no we'll call the

virologists right i got it i'm brilliant

right so you know this was this was

their you know this was their answer and

this is a 20th century answer this is

you know the idea of basically

just delegating without any

accountability responsibility for

important decisions to academics

basically kind of dates mostly to the

woodrow wilson era yes so you know the

progressive era with the capital p right

you know it's about and this is when

basically america's so if you see like

description of the gilded age like you

know go to an old american city see all

those like brick buildings

and we're units beautiful old stuff

you know all of like dc

you know all of that is built in what we

call the gilded age which is period when

america was governed very much the way

china is now it was very corrupt

politics was this incredibly sordid

screwed up business

um

[ __ ] got done yes it got done in a

corrupt way with people stealing a bunch

yeah did [ __ ] get done at enormous

velocity really fast all the time in the

physical world not just building some

goddamn software absolutely right look

at you know the way they built the

empire state building right right this

is the world to build the empire state

building so and at this time america

like china is a third world country it's

culturally insecure

it does not have before world war one

it's like it's it's a peninsula of

anglo-american culture the center is in

london and has always been in london the

center finances in london you know

america is the periphery

american intellectuals look at this and

they're like

this

wait what is he saying

he was saying uh yeah this is true

america was the periphery of england

that time at that time we should be the

future look at a map

and

what we actually need is essentially and

you'll see this written very very

explicitly for example in walter littman

who i'm sure you've read right and and

what america needs is basically a new

class of platonic guardians a new class

of basically people who are sort of so

you know just are not these like sordid

stealing politicians like you know that

so this comes out of people like henry

adams for example yes who's like this

like fourth generation super you know

he's like you know from this amazing

political dynasty he's like the

intellectual leader of america as the

editor of north american review which

was like the new yorker of its day but

better um

and and you know he's basically like

that whole world of old money and old

wealth is like no actually this isn't

working

and the new world will be a world of

science and it needs to be guided by

expertise what comes out of that is the

invention of sort of all these social

sciences which are really sciences of

government or probably in most cases

pseudosciences of government because

they don't actually seem to work out

very well uh when you try them which is

the thing that sociology

yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah and and so you

know all of these things so you get sort

of all of these sciences that are

basically sciences of government and

sciences of how the government should do

something and once sort of any kind of

governing power whether it's the people

or a king

or anything other than an oligarchy

decides that the oligarchy has the last

vote

and it's the oligarchy's opinion that

counts and basically delegates it to the

experts the scientists you know the

mandarins the priests whatever you call

them you've ceded power to these people

and then and the concept of democracy is

done at that point oh yeah

democracy yeah remember my remember

remember my two no's right you know it

isn't and it shouldn't be and it can't

be and

the american people just simply don't

have the power to do that um they don't

have the energy they have they don't

have the knowledge they don't have the

energy it's not a question of even

whether they would do it well or badly

do you even know what democracy is dude

you're cringe

they would just do it weekly and power

would be instantly ripped from their

hands it would be like having an

absolute monarch who's like six years

old there's no way this kid even if he's

the rightful king of france is actually

the king of france mulberry's like

democracy is when people directly decide

everything no it's not that's so [ __ ]

stupid

there's no such thing as direct

democracy okay

no such thing

i muted

and uh sorry that was uh that was a

little coarser than my usual

announcement so good but uh uh

the

rip

all right

hey guys i gotta go to the gym

i'm gonna try to start what's tomorrow

wednesday

we're gonna start tomorrow stream

earlier

and we're gonna stream longer eight

hours tomorrow

eight hours tomorrow

understand

eight hours tomorrow

i was gonna go to six i gotta go to the

gym

trust me

eight hours tomorrow

we're getting we're going back on a roll

we're gonna be back on a roll

of sorts you understand we're gonna be

back on a roll

we're gonna be back

doing

what we've

you know

yesterday was one hour today's five

hours and wednesday eight hours thursday

eight hours friday hopefully eight hours

saturday eight we're gonna we're gonna

be on our eight hour grinds you

understand seven eight hour grind i

can't promise eight seven eight hour

grinds you know

but all right guys

i'm gonna try to stream earlier tomorrow

but you know

the thing is

guys

you gotta understand that

i'm gonna go to the gym bye guys